Brexit Thread 2

[Return_of_the_STAR]

The Mail Online are running this story at the moment


Brussels 'prepares a Brexit climbdown and is set to agree the UK can stay in the EU single market for goods without having to accept free movement'
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6042765/EU-offer-UK-stay-single-market-goods-without-free-movement.html

They seem to think that a deal can now be struck with the EU for the single market. Obviously this has led to the below top rated comments.

17.4 Million voted to be completely free of German rule via their evil EU. Any deal accepted by the EU will need paying for and will mean we won't be free. I want the BrEXIT we voted for, and nothing else.

We want our own laws and not tied to EU. None of their business.

The Brussels Bully Boys were always going t have to climb down. They sell more of their goods to us, than we sell to them. They would never have wanted to jeopardize that. It was obvious from the start.

Democracy voted Leave , Leave means exactly that , trade has nothing to do with borders , free movement and UK Law .

Reading this just makes me feel sick to my stomach to be honest... It's EU occupation in all but name.

I can't wait to leave. Every week for most of my life I've bought a bag of apples from the local market. Back in the day that bag used to weigh just over TWO pounds, but since the evil EU forced us to use Kilos all I get in that bag is just ONE KG. And for the same price! Yet another typical EU Mafia gravy train. VOTE UKIP!

[Jenuall]

Wow.

Yeah strawberry float the EU I want more apples!

[Rax]

I continue to be amazed at how strawberry floating thick so many people can be.

[Seven]

I've not been following this much but surely some people in comments are taking piss? I dread to think that guy that apple is actually serious

[Lex-Man]

The problem with "food will still get imported" is that we don't have the infrastructure to handle that many non-EU food imports. Who checks the manifests and who inspects the food for safety? Can we do that quickly & efficiently enough to keep shelves full of food coming to every supermarket up and down the country? The answer is probably "no". A possibility is that we will end up with no or very lax inspections, and then the shelves will fill again, but we won't have any assurances the food coming in is safe.

Speaking as someone who works for an importer, of both food and non food products, this is only one part of the nightmare scenario Brexit is likely to be.

The port of Felixstowe, the largest shipping port in the UK, and one of the biggest in Northern Europe, is currently still running at about 2/3rds capacity after an IT systems failure over 8 weeks ago. This was a switch to a system that the port owner already operates elsewhere, but it went wrong, knocked out their site communications for a weekend, and they're still struggling to recover. That's a relatively minor (compared to the requirements of Brexit) change, that's caused massive disruption. The biggest threat is going to be the need to implement a new customs system, and the delays that this will cause. It won't just be more stuff requiring customs checks, but whether the current system will work with the increased volume. If not, a new system needs to be in place, which will impact all inbound trade. The current temporary delays are already causing shipping lines to move vessels elsewhere in Europe and omit UK calls, to redeliver stock later, and that's with other UK ports running at full capacity. If customs control delays cause a significant backlog at all ports, that takes a long time to clear, the UK risks being demoted as an important European call. Major vessels calling into the UK will come less frequently, and the stock will take longer to get off the port. Imports of perishables will be much more difficult, or more expensive if they have to pay for faster options, if they're even available.

I also know that port health inspections on food goods are largely dependent on the shipper and the consignee having a good relationship with the port authorities. If we suddenly start importing food from a lot of new origins, port health authorities will want to start checking a lot more boxes coming off boats. This will totally depend on their capacity, though. They can't process more boxes than they have the manpower to check, which means a sudden shift to a lot of new food origins will probably see a lot of food products coming in completely unchecked. It's then up to the individual retailers to decide that they're happy with that stock on their shelves.

That sounds like an absolute nightmare on so many levels, and is even worse than I thought the situation was. Thanks for taking the time to post this.

Yeah this is pretty much spot on. People don't realise that so much of what comes in from the EU undergoes no checks at all. Add that traffic to the Non-EU imports and the increase in volume alone could potentially bring the system to it's knees.

To make the situation even more hilarious, there is the new Customs Declaration Service (CDS) being rolled out (Starting next week) which will replace the existing CHIEF system that's used for every import and export into the UK from outside the EU. This is intended to be fully in place before Brexit and should (In theory) provide far more capacity than the current system and make it easier for Importers and Exporters to submit declarations. I'm quietly confident about it from what I've seen, but massive IT rollouts like this have a nasty habit of being an absolute disaster. Luckily they're running both systems concurrently until CDS is ready to take over completely, but it's a scary thought.

Oh and the postal service is suddenly going to have to put EVERY parcel through customs as well. There's currently around a weeks backlog of parcels to work through and I can only imagine how long it will take once they include the EU parcels in that as well.

It's not underselling it to say that the vast majority of people don't have a single clue how imports/exports work, which makes my blood boil when Politicians and Brexiteers seem to think it'll be the easiest thing in the world to just switch everything over. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

The only plus side is that my job is safe for the forseeable future. Might even be some promotion opportunities in it.

It's not the whole of Cheif it's a small subset coming on line. Also CDS will still be running, so it shouldn't cause any problems. Tha said I wouldn't be surprised if it was cancelled.

[OrangeRKN]

Is it real? Is it parody? Literally impossible to tell

[Oblomov Boblomov]

That kilogramme/pounds one is definitely satire.

[Cheeky Devlin]

The problem with "food will still get imported" is that we don't have the infrastructure to handle that many non-EU food imports. Who checks the manifests and who inspects the food for safety? Can we do that quickly & efficiently enough to keep shelves full of food coming to every supermarket up and down the country? The answer is probably "no". A possibility is that we will end up with no or very lax inspections, and then the shelves will fill again, but we won't have any assurances the food coming in is safe.

Speaking as someone who works for an importer, of both food and non food products, this is only one part of the nightmare scenario Brexit is likely to be.

The port of Felixstowe, the largest shipping port in the UK, and one of the biggest in Northern Europe, is currently still running at about 2/3rds capacity after an IT systems failure over 8 weeks ago. This was a switch to a system that the port owner already operates elsewhere, but it went wrong, knocked out their site communications for a weekend, and they're still struggling to recover. That's a relatively minor (compared to the requirements of Brexit) change, that's caused massive disruption. The biggest threat is going to be the need to implement a new customs system, and the delays that this will cause. It won't just be more stuff requiring customs checks, but whether the current system will work with the increased volume. If not, a new system needs to be in place, which will impact all inbound trade. The current temporary delays are already causing shipping lines to move vessels elsewhere in Europe and omit UK calls, to redeliver stock later, and that's with other UK ports running at full capacity. If customs control delays cause a significant backlog at all ports, that takes a long time to clear, the UK risks being demoted as an important European call. Major vessels calling into the UK will come less frequently, and the stock will take longer to get off the port. Imports of perishables will be much more difficult, or more expensive if they have to pay for faster options, if they're even available.

I also know that port health inspections on food goods are largely dependent on the shipper and the consignee having a good relationship with the port authorities. If we suddenly start importing food from a lot of new origins, port health authorities will want to start checking a lot more boxes coming off boats. This will totally depend on their capacity, though. They can't process more boxes than they have the manpower to check, which means a sudden shift to a lot of new food origins will probably see a lot of food products coming in completely unchecked. It's then up to the individual retailers to decide that they're happy with that stock on their shelves.

That sounds like an absolute nightmare on so many levels, and is even worse than I thought the situation was. Thanks for taking the time to post this.

Yeah this is pretty much spot on. People don't realise that so much of what comes in from the EU undergoes no checks at all. Add that traffic to the Non-EU imports and the increase in volume alone could potentially bring the system to it's knees.

To make the situation even more hilarious, there is the new Customs Declaration Service (CDS) being rolled out (Starting next week) which will replace the existing CHIEF system that's used for every import and export into the UK from outside the EU. This is intended to be fully in place before Brexit and should (In theory) provide far more capacity than the current system and make it easier for Importers and Exporters to submit declarations. I'm quietly confident about it from what I've seen, but massive IT rollouts like this have a nasty habit of being an absolute disaster. Luckily they're running both systems concurrently until CDS is ready to take over completely, but it's a scary thought.

Oh and the postal service is suddenly going to have to put EVERY parcel through customs as well. There's currently around a weeks backlog of parcels to work through and I can only imagine how long it will take once they include the EU parcels in that as well.

It's not underselling it to say that the vast majority of people don't have a single clue how imports/exports work, which makes my blood boil when Politicians and Brexiteers seem to think it'll be the easiest thing in the world to just switch everything over. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

The only plus side is that my job is safe for the forseeable future. Might even be some promotion opportunities in it.

It's not the whole of Cheif it's a small subset coming on line. Also CDS will still be running, so it shouldn't cause any problems. Tha said I wouldn't be surprised if it was cancelled.

Yeah it's being phased in over the next few months. We'll see how it goes, but it's going to be dicey if they have any big problems.

[Lex-Man]

The problem with "food will still get imported" is that we don't have the infrastructure to handle that many non-EU food imports. Who checks the manifests and who inspects the food for safety? Can we do that quickly & efficiently enough to keep shelves full of food coming to every supermarket up and down the country? The answer is probably "no". A possibility is that we will end up with no or very lax inspections, and then the shelves will fill again, but we won't have any assurances the food coming in is safe.

Speaking as someone who works for an importer, of both food and non food products, this is only one part of the nightmare scenario Brexit is likely to be.

The port of Felixstowe, the largest shipping port in the UK, and one of the biggest in Northern Europe, is currently still running at about 2/3rds capacity after an IT systems failure over 8 weeks ago. This was a switch to a system that the port owner already operates elsewhere, but it went wrong, knocked out their site communications for a weekend, and they're still struggling to recover. That's a relatively minor (compared to the requirements of Brexit) change, that's caused massive disruption. The biggest threat is going to be the need to implement a new customs system, and the delays that this will cause. It won't just be more stuff requiring customs checks, but whether the current system will work with the increased volume. If not, a new system needs to be in place, which will impact all inbound trade. The current temporary delays are already causing shipping lines to move vessels elsewhere in Europe and omit UK calls, to redeliver stock later, and that's with other UK ports running at full capacity. If customs control delays cause a significant backlog at all ports, that takes a long time to clear, the UK risks being demoted as an important European call. Major vessels calling into the UK will come less frequently, and the stock will take longer to get off the port. Imports of perishables will be much more difficult, or more expensive if they have to pay for faster options, if they're even available.

I also know that port health inspections on food goods are largely dependent on the shipper and the consignee having a good relationship with the port authorities. If we suddenly start importing food from a lot of new origins, port health authorities will want to start checking a lot more boxes coming off boats. This will totally depend on their capacity, though. They can't process more boxes than they have the manpower to check, which means a sudden shift to a lot of new food origins will probably see a lot of food products coming in completely unchecked. It's then up to the individual retailers to decide that they're happy with that stock on their shelves.

That sounds like an absolute nightmare on so many levels, and is even worse than I thought the situation was. Thanks for taking the time to post this.

Yeah this is pretty much spot on. People don't realise that so much of what comes in from the EU undergoes no checks at all. Add that traffic to the Non-EU imports and the increase in volume alone could potentially bring the system to it's knees.

To make the situation even more hilarious, there is the new Customs Declaration Service (CDS) being rolled out (Starting next week) which will replace the existing CHIEF system that's used for every import and export into the UK from outside the EU. This is intended to be fully in place before Brexit and should (In theory) provide far more capacity than the current system and make it easier for Importers and Exporters to submit declarations. I'm quietly confident about it from what I've seen, but massive IT rollouts like this have a nasty habit of being an absolute disaster. Luckily they're running both systems concurrently until CDS is ready to take over completely, but it's a scary thought.

Oh and the postal service is suddenly going to have to put EVERY parcel through customs as well. There's currently around a weeks backlog of parcels to work through and I can only imagine how long it will take once they include the EU parcels in that as well.

It's not underselling it to say that the vast majority of people don't have a single clue how imports/exports work, which makes my blood boil when Politicians and Brexiteers seem to think it'll be the easiest thing in the world to just switch everything over. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

The only plus side is that my job is safe for the forseeable future. Might even be some promotion opportunities in it.

It's not the whole of Cheif it's a small subset coming on line. Also CDS will still be running, so it shouldn't cause any problems. Tha said I wouldn't be surprised if it was cancelled.

Yeah it's being phased in over the next few months. We'll see how it goes, but it's going to be dicey if they have any big problems.

I know people who are working on it. The team seems to know how bad it is and are preparing for it to fail so I actually don't think it'll be too bad as they've still got Cheif to fall back on.

Basically they're putting a server in front of both systems that'll send duplicate requests to both systems so everything will work as long as one system works

[Cheeky Devlin]

The problem with "food will still get imported" is that we don't have the infrastructure to handle that many non-EU food imports. Who checks the manifests and who inspects the food for safety? Can we do that quickly & efficiently enough to keep shelves full of food coming to every supermarket up and down the country? The answer is probably "no". A possibility is that we will end up with no or very lax inspections, and then the shelves will fill again, but we won't have any assurances the food coming in is safe.

Speaking as someone who works for an importer, of both food and non food products, this is only one part of the nightmare scenario Brexit is likely to be.

The port of Felixstowe, the largest shipping port in the UK, and one of the biggest in Northern Europe, is currently still running at about 2/3rds capacity after an IT systems failure over 8 weeks ago. This was a switch to a system that the port owner already operates elsewhere, but it went wrong, knocked out their site communications for a weekend, and they're still struggling to recover. That's a relatively minor (compared to the requirements of Brexit) change, that's caused massive disruption. The biggest threat is going to be the need to implement a new customs system, and the delays that this will cause. It won't just be more stuff requiring customs checks, but whether the current system will work with the increased volume. If not, a new system needs to be in place, which will impact all inbound trade. The current temporary delays are already causing shipping lines to move vessels elsewhere in Europe and omit UK calls, to redeliver stock later, and that's with other UK ports running at full capacity. If customs control delays cause a significant backlog at all ports, that takes a long time to clear, the UK risks being demoted as an important European call. Major vessels calling into the UK will come less frequently, and the stock will take longer to get off the port. Imports of perishables will be much more difficult, or more expensive if they have to pay for faster options, if they're even available.

I also know that port health inspections on food goods are largely dependent on the shipper and the consignee having a good relationship with the port authorities. If we suddenly start importing food from a lot of new origins, port health authorities will want to start checking a lot more boxes coming off boats. This will totally depend on their capacity, though. They can't process more boxes than they have the manpower to check, which means a sudden shift to a lot of new food origins will probably see a lot of food products coming in completely unchecked. It's then up to the individual retailers to decide that they're happy with that stock on their shelves.

That sounds like an absolute nightmare on so many levels, and is even worse than I thought the situation was. Thanks for taking the time to post this.

Yeah this is pretty much spot on. People don't realise that so much of what comes in from the EU undergoes no checks at all. Add that traffic to the Non-EU imports and the increase in volume alone could potentially bring the system to it's knees.

To make the situation even more hilarious, there is the new Customs Declaration Service (CDS) being rolled out (Starting next week) which will replace the existing CHIEF system that's used for every import and export into the UK from outside the EU. This is intended to be fully in place before Brexit and should (In theory) provide far more capacity than the current system and make it easier for Importers and Exporters to submit declarations. I'm quietly confident about it from what I've seen, but massive IT rollouts like this have a nasty habit of being an absolute disaster. Luckily they're running both systems concurrently until CDS is ready to take over completely, but it's a scary thought.

Oh and the postal service is suddenly going to have to put EVERY parcel through customs as well. There's currently around a weeks backlog of parcels to work through and I can only imagine how long it will take once they include the EU parcels in that as well.

It's not underselling it to say that the vast majority of people don't have a single clue how imports/exports work, which makes my blood boil when Politicians and Brexiteers seem to think it'll be the easiest thing in the world to just switch everything over. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

The only plus side is that my job is safe for the forseeable future. Might even be some promotion opportunities in it.

It's not the whole of Cheif it's a small subset coming on line. Also CDS will still be running, so it shouldn't cause any problems. Tha said I wouldn't be surprised if it was cancelled.

Yeah it's being phased in over the next few months. We'll see how it goes, but it's going to be dicey if they have any big problems.

I know people who are working on it. The team seems to know how bad it is and are preparing for it to fail so I actually don't think it'll be too bad as they've still got Cheif to fall back on.

Basically they're putting a server in front of both systems that'll send duplicate requests to both systems so everything will work as long as one system works

Yeah I've been on a couple of conference calls talking about the phased rollout over the next few months and I came away from them with the impression that they seem to be on the ball with it.

As with all these things we'll see how it goes at launch, but the fact it's running concurrently with CHIEF until they've ironed out the bugs is hugely reassuring.

[Alvin Flummux]

I can't wait to leave. Every week for most of my life I've bought a bag of apples from the local market. Back in the day that bag used to weigh just over TWO pounds, but since the evil EU forced us to use Kilos all I get in that bag is just ONE KG. And for the same price! Yet another typical EU Mafia gravy train. VOTE UKIP!

WE HAVE LOST OBJECTIVE APPLES! VOTE UKIP!

[Lagamorph]

twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1027874449515794432

[Moggy]

Old people would still vote to ruin everything:



But the young would only have themselves to blame:

However, only half of 18 to 24-year-olds said that they would be certain to vote in a second EU referendum, according to recent polls by Survation. This compares with 84% of those aged 65 and over.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45098550

[Moggy]

twitter.com/sunpolitics/status/1027831921475309568

That’s literally already allowed under EU rules.

[Memento Mori]

I've not been following this much but surely some people in comments are taking piss? I dread to think that guy that apple is actually serious

Some will be Russian bots.

[Garth]

twitter.com/sunpolitics/status/1027831921475309568

That’s literally already allowed under EU rules.

Oh my gawd

[Return_of_the_STAR]

I've not been following this much but surely some people in comments are taking piss? I dread to think that guy that apple is actually serious

Some will be Russian bots.

Whether they are fakes or piss takes then end up being the top rated comments, liked and shared in their thousands by real people.

[BID0]

It's nice to read all of the comments to that tweet outlining that the article is in fact wrong, without a single gammon in sight. I must have stepped in to an alternate universe.

[Squinty]

twitter.com/sunpolitics/status/1027831921475309568

That’s literally already allowed under EU rules.

As an aside, unemployment benefit usually ends for EEA nationals after 3 months if there is no prospect of employment (this can be extended to 6 months if it is looking likely that work will be started soon).

So yeah. Government dropped the ball. Massively. They have been able to do this from 2014 if not before.

[Errkal]

twitter.com/sunpolitics/status/1027831921475309568

That’s literally already allowed under EU rules.

As an aside, unemployment benefit usually ends for EEA nationals after 3 months if there is no prospect of employment (this can be extended to 6 months if it is looking likely that work will be started soon).

So yeah. Government dropped the ball. Massively. They have been able to do this from 2014 if not before.

WE DONT WANT THEM TELLING US WE CAN DO IT! WE WANT TO DO IT OURSELVES!! !!