Brutal honesty

Elfhours wrote:Sure, it's an "every interviewer asks it" question, but that's because it can reveal stuff about the candidate you're interviewing that you need to know.

...Presumably how good their powers of prediction might be? Why not just get a crystal ball in and go the whole hog? Who the f*ck knows where or what they'll be doing in the future? And how does such total nonsense help any employer decide on the worthiness of a candidate?

I've interviewed countless art school graduates for jobs in graphic design. I can honestly say I never considered their ability to predict the future a vital part of the final selection process. Such an idiotic question shows a complete lack of imagination and failure to keep the questions asked of the candidate both relevant and practical.

It's an almost superfluous question, as so many interviewees just tell the employer what they think they want to hear. But it does catch some people out, when they let their guard down a little, or if they're just bad at lying, so Eighty has a point.

Here, Mike, your fiancé works in recruitment, doesn't she? She must've had a lot of 2nd (or final) interviews for candidates go completely wrong just when they looked like a sure thing for adding to her commission that month. I've had a fair few, almost perfect, candidates strawberry float up because they've suddenly revealed that their plans for the future don't quite coincide with the interviewing company's.

Gil-Martin wrote:Here, Mike, your fiancé works in recruitment, doesn't she? She must've had a lot of 2nd (or final) interviews for candidates go completely wrong just when they looked like a sure thing for adding to her commission that month. I've had a fair few, almost perfect, candidates strawberry float up because they've suddenly revealed that their plans for the future don't quite coincide with the interviewing company's.

I'm sure you could swap war stories! Like the candidate who was doing really, really well in her interview. She was coasting it, easy stuff, definitely getting the job. And then she was asked: "What do you consider to be your greatest weakness?" Her reply? "Men."

Or the girl the other week who was being interviewed for a personal tax position and told the interviewer how much she really wanted to work in audit.

Or the girl a month ago who was told by my fiancee that one thing you really can't do is discredit a previous employer, and in the interview proceeded to slag off her former managers and workmates, saying how she didn't get on with them and how she doesn't naturally warm to people. And then proceeded to say exactly the same thing about her previous two jobs ("Yeah, I left because I hated the people"), which wasn't what she told Jo at all. Why did she give proper, calm interview-esque answers on the phone to my fiancee during her interview preparation, but then turn into a raving nutcase for the interview proper?

Then there was the candidate for a senior role who was offered the position, accepted, and then two days before he was due to start, pulled out because he'd decided to move to Australia on a whim. Bye bye Jo's £10k fee.

I tell you, if it wasn't for candidates and clients, recruitment would be grand!

Cal wrote:...Presumably how good their powers of prediction might be? Why not just get a crystal ball in and go the whole hog? Who the f*ck knows where or what they'll be doing in the future? And how does such total nonsense help any employer decide on the worthiness of a candidate?

You seem to have completely ignored my example that showed the value of the question when it comes to certain candidates.

Jesus. It all rings true.

The slagging-off previous employers problem was a bloody irritating one for me. People just don't add 2 and 2 together and just go off on a massive rant. Also, that fee Jo lost due to the inconsiderately flighty chap - I feel her pain. It only happened to me a couple of times when I was working as a recruitment consultant many moons ago, but when I finished work on the day that it happened, I would go on a horrific booze bender with as many colleagues as I could drag along with me, cursing the unpredictability of the human commodity. God, that job ripped a good deal of my soul away, and almost turned me into an alcoholic.

Gil-Martin wrote:Jesus. It all rings true.

The slagging-off previous employers problem was a bloody irritating one for me. People just don't add 2 and 2 together and just go off on a massive rant. Also, that fee Jo lost due to the inconsiderately flighty chap - I feel her pain. It only happened to me a couple of times when I was working as a recruitment consultant many moons ago, but when I finished work on the day that it happened, I would go on a horrific booze bender with as many colleagues as I could drag along with me, cursing the unpredictability of the human commodity. God, that job ripped a good deal of my soul away, and almost turned me into an alcoholic.

In Jo's first recruitment job, one of the temps the company placed regularly logged onto their manager's computer using their username/password and surfed the web for bestiality porn. The manager was suspended following this Internet usage being flagged with someone in IT, and had to subsequently prove that the temp had nicked his details (basically, they eventually managed to match up dates and times with this guy's activities). The police got involved, and there were witness statements and all kinds of gooseberry fool for the agency. Poor manager!

NICE.

The thing about recruitment is that you can do the best job possible, and yet it's in the lap of the Gods as to whether the candidate will stuff it all up or get run over by a bus the following day. And the first few weeks of someone's employment are always a nerve-jangling time, hoping they don't quit or get sacked!

I could never do Jo's job. Well, with my stammer it would be impossible anyway, but even without it, I don't think I could cope with having to rely on so many other people all of the time.

The job was to be a trainee conference producer. He had told me that it would be quite salesy, but I went along to the interview to see exactly how mcuh selling there would be. Basically after he told me that my first few weeks would involve me trying to cold call CEOs and directors, that my second few weeks would focus on creating topics and that the rest of the time would be more cold calling to get people to come and attend, I knew the role wasn't for me.

This isn't the first time this has happened. Sometimes my CV seems to be plucked from obscurity and I'm invited to an interview for a job I'm not entirely suited for (the other month a charitable organisation interviewed me to become their first and only marketing officer - except they didn't make it clear that I would have so much responsibility until the interview - if they had read my CV more carefully they would have seen that I don't quite have enough experience for that kind of role yet).

Elfhours wrote:

Gil-Martin wrote:Jesus. It all rings true.

The slagging-off previous employers problem was a bloody irritating one for me. People just don't add 2 and 2 together and just go off on a massive rant. Also, that fee Jo lost due to the inconsiderately flighty chap - I feel her pain. It only happened to me a couple of times when I was working as a recruitment consultant many moons ago, but when I finished work on the day that it happened, I would go on a horrific booze bender with as many colleagues as I could drag along with me, cursing the unpredictability of the human commodity. God, that job ripped a good deal of my soul away, and almost turned me into an alcoholic.

In Jo's first recruitment job, one of the temps the company placed regularly logged onto their manager's computer using their username/password and surfed the web for bestiality porn. The manager was suspended following this Internet usage being flagged with someone in IT, and had to subsequently prove that the temp had nicked his details (basically, they eventually managed to match up dates and times with this guy's activities). The police got involved, and there were witness statements and all kinds of gooseberry fool for the agency. Poor manager!

NICE.

The thing about recruitment is that you can do the best job possible, and yet it's in the lap of the Gods as to whether the candidate will stuff it all up or get run over by a bus the following day. And the first few weeks of someone's employment are always a nerve-jangling time, hoping they don't quit or get sacked!

I could never do Jo's job. Well, with my stammer it would be impossible anyway, but even without it, I don't think I could cope with having to rely on so many other people all of the time.

And add to that (if it's a shark-tank company much like one I've worked for in the past) the immense pressure to compete with not only another team (or teams) in the company, but with those on your own team aswell, and have your monthly figures rawly displayed on a board along with everybody elses, and you've got big time stress. Throw in a psychopathic MD who - during a party thrown at her rather large house in the first week of my employment - tells all the new people that if they're not putting £10K-£20K on the board within the first 6 months, then they'll be out of the door, and no wonder it's a sector with such huge employee turnover.

I'm glad I'm out of it.

Cal wrote:

Elfhours wrote:Sure, it's an "every interviewer asks it" question, but that's because it can reveal stuff about the candidate you're interviewing that you need to know.

...Presumably how good their powers of prediction might be? Why not just get a crystal ball in and go the whole hog? Who the f*ck knows where or what they'll be doing in the future? And how does such total nonsense help any employer decide on the worthiness of a candidate?

It worked with me! If I had landed that job it would have been a complete nightmare for me and him. If it had been a job I had been really interested in I would have poured on the enthusiasm ("In ten years time I see myself as the head of...") that tactic has worked before, but I just couldn't get excited about hours and hours on the telephone. The sickening thing is when people who have no interest in a job lie about how excited they are and their expectations and manage to get the position at the expense of people who have genuine interest and talent.

Elfhours wrote:Then there was the candidate for a senior role who was offered the position, accepted, and then two days before he was due to start, pulled out because he'd decided to move to Australia on a whim. Bye bye Jo's £10k fee. ?

Bloody hell, is that what recruitment resultants get?

I'm in the wrong sodding job.

I love how people seem to be shocked that a businessman wants to make money, and wishes to employ people with the same aims.

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:I love how people seem to be shocked that a businessman wants to make money, and wishes to employ people with the same aims.

Yeah but telling him to go home until he grows up and learns the value of money is a really banana splitish thing to say.

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:I love how people seem to be shocked that a businessman wants to make money, and wishes to employ people with the same aims.

I wouldn't work for a company like that. The implication is they don't give a gooseberry fool about you, just the money you bring in.

On the other hand, I can see how telling an employer that you're only bothered about happiness can look bad. You might think it's honourable, but I can't see it giving them much confidence, since you don't know if the job would have worked for you.

I think the "where do you see yourself..." question is horrible. You're not going to tell the truth with it, because you'd never get the job. It's the same with writing a personal statement.

I still think if he had argued against that fact he would have gotten the job.

Its a crappy interview technique, but it weeds out many of the applicants. When you have a gooseberry fool load to go through, you only want people who can sell themselves.

You shouldn't be affraid to question the interviewer. You are doing THEM a favour by working for them, not the other way around.

Festive Exception wrote:I still think if he had argued against that fact he would have gotten the job.

As I said, I wan't too fussed, I could have lied to him and said that I want to be looking to be a partner with him or found my company in decade, but I wasn't interested enough by that point to exaggerate what interest I did have. I don't much fancy the idea of weeks of trying to cold call CEOs. If he thought my ideas were good though, it is his loss. The problem he probably faces is that a number of candidates will tell him what he wants to hear and then strawberry float off inside two months because the job isn't them at all.

Festive Exception wrote:You shouldn't be affraid to question the interviewer. You are doing THEM a favour by working for them, not the other way around.

This is a good point, but in practice it is hard to use - if you have valid questions (I plan in advance, but was unable to use any today) then most will respect you. If you have none planned and believe you are quick witted enough to create questions on the spot you can be made to look very silly indeed.

Santa Nan wrote:

Elfhours wrote:Then there was the candidate for a senior role who was offered the position, accepted, and then two days before he was due to start, pulled out because he'd decided to move to Australia on a whim. Bye bye Jo's £10k fee. ?

Bloody hell, is that what recruitment resultants get?

Only for very senior roles. And if you're a normal employee of an agency, then you'll only be getting a smallish percentage of that fee yourself.

Elfhours wrote:

Santa Nan wrote:

Elfhours wrote:Then there was the candidate for a senior role who was offered the position, accepted, and then two days before he was due to start, pulled out because he'd decided to move to Australia on a whim. Bye bye Jo's £10k fee. ?

Bloody hell, is that what recruitment resultants get?

Only for very senior roles. And if you're a normal employee of an agency, then you'll only be getting a smallish percentage of that fee yourself.

Fair enough, she must have done very well then. Congrats to her.

At my last interview, I was asked where I wanted to be when I was thirty. I told them it was three grades above the job I was applying for, and gave them a detailed description of the position I wanted to reach, and how the job I was applying for would get me there. I got the job too.

I don't think it's anything to do with Crystal Balls or any other such nonsense; it's to do with whether the person you're interviewing knows what their new position actually entails and will lead to. Do they see the job as a pay cheque or a stepping stone to a higher role? If I tell them that in five years I want to be managing a Pokemon-themed bar then they probably realise my drive isn't actually behind the role being applied for.

Festive Exception wrote:You realise this was a sales job and he probably thought he was testing you.

You were supposed to argue back with the reasons why you are perfect for the job. You need to be a lot more persistant.

You use that philosophy with girls that turn you down?

O snap.



Generally when an interview is over, it's just over. No going back.

Go back, ask him to pull your finger then gooseberry fool all over his desk.

I'd have probably turned round and told him to strawberry float off before I realised what I was doing. What a prick!