HORIZON vs ZELDA!

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Photek
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by Photek » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:07 am

jiggles wrote:So you're saying you're forced to keep switching weapons because they always break, rather than choosing to keep switching weapons because it's actually enjoyable to do so.

Fun mechanic.

It is a fun mechanic because you approach every battle differently. When your weapon is near to breaking you can elect to throw it and you get double damage if it connects, also, you can sneak up to enemy out posts and rob their weapons before you alert them leaving them no weapons to fight you with. Throw in holding wooden weapons/arrows near a fire to light them up to set enemies on fire or explode barrels and the whole weapon system makes something boring such as taking an outpost in FarCry (I hear horizon after a while is similar to Far Cry Primal - I like FCP tho) something different every time, that's just a few of the various ways to attempt to do this. During Lightning storms you have to use wooden only weapons, and shields, even bow and I unfortunately have to take off my cool knight armour but again it mixes combat up, constantly keeping options fresh.
Blue Eyes wrote:Jack Wheelchair is crippled again. Poor guy just can't catch a break. Except in his leg.
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mic
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by mic » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:11 am

the eponymous bollock wrote:Having such a variety of cool looking weapons, the challenge of collecting them all, the fun of learning how they're used and the great feeling you get upon completing a challenge or exploring the world and being rewarded with one you've never seen all add way more to the game than a weapon breaking takes away.


Zelda does all the bold stuff too, but I think I take your point.

Preezy wrote:
HSH28 wrote:
Frank wrote:
jiggles wrote:No ridiculous weapon wear

I think this alone makes Horizon the better game.

Well that's just silly.
The weapon wear in Zelda is fine. It'd be an issue if there was a problem getting hold of new weapons...but there never is. All it really does is make sure you use a variety of weapons.

The issue that I've seen with this (on various youtube videos/reviews, not played it myself) is that often you will use up a decent weapon fighting an enemy, who will then drop a weapon that was worse than the one you were using, which encourages you to actually avoid getting into scraps because engaging in combat often leaves you in a worse situation than if you'd avoided it altogether.

Doesn't sound like a particularly fun or helpful mechanic, I know people have their Zelda goggles on but I don't think that's being unfair.


This forces you to use your weapons more judiciously - sure, you can one-hit kill a moblin with your ancient battle axe ++, but was it worth it? Perhaps you should have used you traveller's sword instead?
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suzzopher
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by suzzopher » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:12 am

Weirdly I don't know the answer to this. I love both games but I am finding the core gameplay of Horizon to be much more satisfying, but then again when I am high up in the mountains in Horizon, I am finding myself wishing I could glide down, or when at the foot of a mountain, wishing I could scale it instead of having to find a path round.

The more linear approach of Horizon really suits my style, but then I do miss the freedom and puzzles of Zelda.

I will say this though, the two games are the best first party games that either platform holder has put out.
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by Preezy » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:13 am

mic wrote:This forces you to use your weapons more judiciously - sure, you can one-hit kill a moblin with your ancient battle axe ++, but was it worth it? Perhaps you should have used you traveller's sword instead?

Any game that forces me to do anything has already failed.
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by Photek » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:14 am

Preezy wrote:
HSH28 wrote:
Frank wrote:
jiggles wrote:No ridiculous weapon wear

I think this alone makes Horizon the better game.

Well that's just silly.
The weapon wear in Zelda is fine. It'd be an issue if there was a problem getting hold of new weapons...but there never is. All it really does is make sure you use a variety of weapons.

The issue that I've seen with this (on various youtube videos/reviews, not played it myself) is that often you will use up a decent weapon fighting an enemy, who will then drop a weapon that was worse than the one you were using, which encourages you to actually avoid getting into scraps because engaging in combat often leaves you in a worse situation than if you'd avoided it altogether.

Doesn't sound like a particularly fun or helpful mechanic, I know people have their Zelda goggles on but I don't think that's being unfair.

Without trying to sound condescending, if you're playing Breath of the Wild and hold on to your best weapons in an attempt to horde it, you're playing the game wrong. You can tell visually what weapon an enemy is holding and you choose to fight with it, weighing the plus's and minus's of the battle before hand. Then there's the 2 handed weapons which mean you can't use your shield, Dark Souls style. Later on you get longer lasting weapons but I've no problem pulling out my light saber style jobbie if things get hairy. Seriously the combat and weapon system beat most games bar possibly Dark Souls and all this just another facet of a game packed with brilliance.
Blue Eyes wrote:Jack Wheelchair is crippled again. Poor guy just can't catch a break. Except in his leg.
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mic
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by mic » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:32 am

Preezy wrote:
mic wrote:This forces you to use your weapons more judiciously - sure, you can one-hit kill a moblin with your ancient battle axe ++, but was it worth it? Perhaps you should have used you traveller's sword instead?

Any game that forces me to do anything has already failed.


Absolutely and 'forces' was entirely the wrong choice of word - you don't NEED to match your choice of weapon to the level of the enemy you're facing, you can totally do what you want... but I equally don't think you get to complain about it when all you have left is a wooden club.
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by Preezy » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:35 am

Yeah I get that. As I said I haven't played Zelda (or Horizon for that matter), just offering my opinion on aspects that I've seen through various media.
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by gamerforever » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:35 am

Zelda is the reason I haven't even touched horizon since the prologue! I can't wait to get into it, but am playing yakuza 0 too, so horizon will have to wait a good while!
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mic
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by mic » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:37 am

suzzopher wrote:Weirdly I don't know the answer to this. I love both games but I am finding the core gameplay of Horizon to be much more satisfying, but then again when I am high up in the mountains in Horizon, I am finding myself wishing I could glide down, or when at the foot of a mountain, wishing I could scale it instead of having to find a path round.

The more linear approach of Horizon really suits my style, but then I do miss the freedom and puzzles of Zelda.

I will say this though, the two games are the best first party games that either platform holder has put out.


I think that's actually that best answer so far.

For someone that doesn't want to watch videos on the off chance that I'll ever get to play it (my next console will almost certainly be Sony), in what way does Horizon's core gameplay differ from Zelda's, since both seem to involve free-form exploration?
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by suzzopher » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:46 am

It's more traditional in how it plays, in Zelda it feels like I am learning how to play even 20 hours in, where as in Horizon you instantly know how all the systems work. There is a weight to Aloy that really helps when you are moving through the world, where as I feel Link is not so well weighted and often find myself having to adjust Link to the environment.

Horizon you don't have to worry about the cold or the heat, you don't have to find things like arrows, you can just craft them when you run out, which of course is not realistic but for me it works better as I can continue at my pace.

I guess I don't have enough time for Zelda, even if there were not other games to play, my lifestyle means I have only a limited amount of time, in Horizon I can see the progress in a short plays, where as Zelda I find I need to spend hours with the game to really get anywhere.

Hard to explain really re the weight to be honest.
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by KjGarly » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:35 am

mic wrote:In other games, I tend to just only use the most powerful weapon of its type - everything else is sold at the first opportunity or instantly discarded.


Which is something you just don't do in Horizon. Taking down bigger machines is a hell of a lot easier using a combination of weapons. Try taking down a Thunderjaw using a standard arrow rather than also using Tear weapons/ammo to strip it of its weapons/armour/radar.
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by mic » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:40 am

KjGarly wrote:
mic wrote:In other games, I tend to just only use the most powerful weapon of its type - everything else is sold at the first opportunity or instantly discarded.


Which is something you just don't do in Horizon. Taking down bigger machines is a hell of a lot easier using a combination of weapons. Try taking down a Thunderjaw using a standard arrow rather than also using Tear weapons/ammo to strip it of its weapons/armour/radar.


It there is no weapon degradation? Can weapons be upgraded?
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by KjGarly » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:42 am

mic wrote:
KjGarly wrote:
mic wrote:In other games, I tend to just only use the most powerful weapon of its type - everything else is sold at the first opportunity or instantly discarded.


Which is something you just don't do in Horizon. Taking down bigger machines is a hell of a lot easier using a combination of weapons. Try taking down a Thunderjaw using a standard arrow rather than also using Tear weapons/ammo to strip it of its weapons/armour/radar.


It there is no weapon degradation? Can weapons be upgraded?


You can purchase more powerful variations of each weapon, which also requires certain parts from machines to get the best weapons, and then add mods to make certain ammo types even more powerful. There is no degradation with them.
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mic
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by mic » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:11 am

So, when you purchase a more powerful variation of a weapon, what happens to the obsolete version?
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suzzopher
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by suzzopher » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:11 am

mic wrote:So, when you purchase a more powerful variation of a weapon, what happens to the obsolete version?


You can sell it.
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by mic » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:16 am

I see. Can you find duplicates of weapons you already own and sell them too? And do you have unlimited inventory space for excess weapons?
Last edited by mic on Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by Fade » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:19 am

gamerforever wrote:Zelda is the reason I haven't even touched horizon since the prologue! I can't wait to get into it, but am playing yakuza 0 too, so horizon will have to wait a good while!

Horizon is a million times better than Yakuza
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by The Watching Artist » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:46 am

Photek wrote:Then there's the 2 handed weapons which mean you can't use your shield, Dark Souls style.

Please..... this happened in OOT.

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mic
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by mic » Wed Mar 15, 2017 12:03 pm

Dark Souls also has weapon degradation, does it not, if perhaps not quite as severe?
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PostRe: HORIZON vs ZELDA!
by Death's Head » Wed Mar 15, 2017 12:05 pm

Having played neither of these, I don't have much to comment on (and also the discussion will be finished by the time I get onto either one of these). I've never been a fan of Zelda though (tried to get into it unsuccessfully on both the SNES and N64) and I expect that I will have the same issues as Suzz, I want to see progress and I only have a certain amount of time for games. I also enjoy the trophies and achievements found on the PS4 and Steam so this is another thing that works in Horizon's favour.

I've given my Wii U to my son so I guess Zelda will have to wait until he is back from Uni in the summer or if I feel the Switch has good long term prospects and buy one later in the year.
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