KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...

Fed up talking videogames? Why?
User avatar
Preezy
Skeletor
Joined in 2009

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Preezy » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:14 pm

I just don't see why people need to (or want to) label themselves. Why not just eat what you want and get on with your life? Why the need to proselytise?

Image
User avatar
Pancake
Member
Joined in 2008

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Pancake » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:15 pm

Karl wrote:
Pancake wrote:There are other benefits to choosing a vegan diet, e.g. environmental.

Are there any benefits to eating meat other than that it tastes good?

It goes back to my earlier point: you can defend your right to eat meat and point out that eating meat is not inherently wrong but it's difficult to make a case that eating meat is the right thing to do.

I don't have a problem accepting that vegans have made the superior dietary choice. It's not surprising that some of them get a little sanctimonious.


It's primarily down to governments and farms to work together on legislation and iterate towards lowering the carbon footprint of meat. It's not the consumer's responsibility.

We'll end up lab-growing meat eventually which will probably provide meaningful progress on that front.

Combatting climate change has to involve international collaboration of governments, scientists and businesses. Torturing yourself with kale isn't going to save the environment. ;)


We're going in circles. I've said I agree with the above. I'm making a very simple point:

Does a meat based diet provide adequate nutritional benefit and taste nice? Yes.
Does a plant based diet provide adequate nutritional benefit and taste nice? Yes, but maybe not quite as nice.

Is a meat based diet healthy? Certainly can be but probably slightly higher risk than a plant based one, although more research is needed.
Is a plant based diet healthy? Certainly can be.

Are there animal welfare issues related to the neat industry? Yes.
Are there animal welfare issues related to the plant industry? Probably but not nearly as many.

Are there environmental issues arising from the meat industry? Yes.
Are there environmental issues arising from the plant industry? Yes but current evidence suggests not nearly to the same degree.


Whether it's up to governments to legislate for animal welfare and environmental issues is besides the point. As far as I can see, a plant based diet is a better diet because it has fewer issues. When I asked people to give me some benefits to a meat based diet I got the usual tired arguments about meat being nutritious (sure, so are plants) and how there are environmental issues related to a vegan diet (sure but it's not as bad, according to latest evidence).

I'm not telling you what to eat. I'm not telling you to go vegan. I'm not saying eating meat is wrong. I'm just pointing out that a vegan diet is logically better.

User avatar
Jenuall
Member
Joined in 2008
Contact:

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Jenuall » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:53 pm

Skarjo wrote:I don't grasp what is inherently wrong about eating meat. There are environmental and social issues linked to eating meat, sure, but there are also environmental and social issues from having all varieties fruit and veg available all year round.

What's the environmental impact of flying tonnes of exotic plants and veg around the world so that all veg is always available all the time, pesky old-timey concerns like being 'in-season' be damned? What's the social impact of the child labour used on coffee farms? What's the social impact on starving subsistence farmers who're no longer able to feed themselves because the international market for Quinoa has priced them out of their own market?

Unless you grow all your food out of your own personal allotment (ground which could be used for affordable public housing - ah gooseberry fool even that has a social consequence) then every dietary choice we make is a trade off. There's no 'superior' choice.


Any vegan/veggie advocates addressed some of these concerns yet? How much of a nutritionally sufficient plant based diet is actually grown locally? How much is it possible to grow locally?

Flying plants around the world is not eco-friendly.

Image
User avatar
BID0
Member
Joined in 2008
Location: Essex

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by BID0 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:56 pm

Jenuall wrote:
Skarjo wrote:I don't grasp what is inherently wrong about eating meat. There are environmental and social issues linked to eating meat, sure, but there are also environmental and social issues from having all varieties fruit and veg available all year round.

What's the environmental impact of flying tonnes of exotic plants and veg around the world so that all veg is always available all the time, pesky old-timey concerns like being 'in-season' be damned? What's the social impact of the child labour used on coffee farms? What's the social impact on starving subsistence farmers who're no longer able to feed themselves because the international market for Quinoa has priced them out of their own market?

Unless you grow all your food out of your own personal allotment (ground which could be used for affordable public housing - ah gooseberry fool even that has a social consequence) then every dietary choice we make is a trade off. There's no 'superior' choice.


Any vegan/veggie advocates addressed some of these concerns yet? How much of a nutritionally sufficient plant based diet is actually grown locally? How much is it possible to grow locally?

Flying plants around the world is not eco-friendly.

You can get everything the body needs locally other than vitamin B12. What exactly can't you find locally? Type it in to google and it'll tell you what foods contain it.

Last edited by BID0 on Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
jawafour
Member
Member
Joined in 2012

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by jawafour » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:57 pm

Preezy wrote:...Why the need to proselytise?

Blimey, Preezy - I genuinely had to look up the meaning of that word :lol: .

User avatar
mic
Member
Joined in 2008
Location: I'm on my way...

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by mic » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:13 pm

I just read this whole thread and, worryingly, the question that stands out in my mind is this - why is bestiality illegal? If it's a matter of consent, surely they'd rather be shagged than eaten?

Also, is it legal to kill and eat pets?

User avatar
Jenuall
Member
Joined in 2008
Contact:

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Jenuall » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:34 pm

BID0 wrote:
Jenuall wrote:
Skarjo wrote:I don't grasp what is inherently wrong about eating meat. There are environmental and social issues linked to eating meat, sure, but there are also environmental and social issues from having all varieties fruit and veg available all year round.

What's the environmental impact of flying tonnes of exotic plants and veg around the world so that all veg is always available all the time, pesky old-timey concerns like being 'in-season' be damned? What's the social impact of the child labour used on coffee farms? What's the social impact on starving subsistence farmers who're no longer able to feed themselves because the international market for Quinoa has priced them out of their own market?

Unless you grow all your food out of your own personal allotment (ground which could be used for affordable public housing - ah gooseberry fool even that has a social consequence) then every dietary choice we make is a trade off. There's no 'superior' choice.


Any vegan/veggie advocates addressed some of these concerns yet? How much of a nutritionally sufficient plant based diet is actually grown locally? How much is it possible to grow locally?

Flying plants around the world is not eco-friendly.

You can get everything the body needs locally other than vitamin B12. What exactly can't you find locally? Type it in to google and it'll tell you what foods contain it.


Interesting. As someone from the UK what would my locally sourced, nutritionally sufficient diet look like throughout the seasons?

Genuinely curious as my previous understanding was that this was not achievable. If it is theoretically possible then were I to consider adopting it other considerations would have to be cost and, of course, how tasty and varied it can be.

Image
User avatar
BID0
Member
Joined in 2008
Location: Essex

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by BID0 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:52 pm

Jenuall wrote:
BID0 wrote:
Jenuall wrote:
Skarjo wrote:I don't grasp what is inherently wrong about eating meat. There are environmental and social issues linked to eating meat, sure, but there are also environmental and social issues from having all varieties fruit and veg available all year round.

What's the environmental impact of flying tonnes of exotic plants and veg around the world so that all veg is always available all the time, pesky old-timey concerns like being 'in-season' be damned? What's the social impact of the child labour used on coffee farms? What's the social impact on starving subsistence farmers who're no longer able to feed themselves because the international market for Quinoa has priced them out of their own market?

Unless you grow all your food out of your own personal allotment (ground which could be used for affordable public housing - ah gooseberry fool even that has a social consequence) then every dietary choice we make is a trade off. There's no 'superior' choice.


Any vegan/veggie advocates addressed some of these concerns yet? How much of a nutritionally sufficient plant based diet is actually grown locally? How much is it possible to grow locally?

Flying plants around the world is not eco-friendly.

You can get everything the body needs locally other than vitamin B12. What exactly can't you find locally? Type it in to google and it'll tell you what foods contain it.


Interesting. As someone from the UK what would my locally sourced, nutritionally sufficient diet look like throughout the seasons?

Genuinely curious as my previous understanding was that this was not achievable. If it is theoretically possible then were I to consider adopting it other considerations would have to be cost and, of course, how tasty and varied it can be.

It sounds like you're looking at going completely raw then? No processed foods at all?

User avatar
Lucien
Member
Joined in 2008

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Lucien » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:08 pm

Jenuall wrote:
Skarjo wrote:What's the environmental impact of flying tonnes of exotic plants and veg around the world so that all veg is always available all the time, pesky old-timey concerns like being 'in-season' be damned?


Any vegan/veggie advocates addressed some of these concerns yet? How much of a nutritionally sufficient plant based diet is actually grown locally? How much is it possible to grow locally?

Flying plants around the world is not eco-friendly.


It's not the case you'd have to eat locally to cut emissions, if that's your goal. As an example, if you live in the UK, then buying grass-fed lamb shipped from New Zealand is much more eco-friendly than corn-fed UK lamb. With fruit and vegetables, it appears shipping is not much of an issue. Especially if you're replacing meat. This article may interest you:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... miles.html

One recent study suggests adopting a vegetarian or vegan diet would dramatically help fight global emissions, suggesting that shipping plays a small part:

https://www.nbcnews.com/better/diet-fit ... ns-n542886

User avatar
Karl
Daiakuma
Daiakuma
Joined in 2008
Contact:

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Karl » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:23 pm

Pancake wrote:I'm not telling you what to eat. I'm not telling you to go vegan. I'm not saying eating meat is wrong. I'm just pointing out that a vegan diet is logically better.


Sure! There is a rationally-best diet. It would provide the precise nutrients you need with minimal carbon footprint. I don't know exactly what that diet would look like, but I do know that I'd rather choke to death on my own lumpy shite than eat it. ;)

User avatar
Karl
Daiakuma
Daiakuma
Joined in 2008
Contact:

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Karl » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:28 pm

mic wrote:I just read this whole thread and, worryingly, the question that stands out in my mind is this - why is bestiality illegal? If it's a matter of consent, surely they'd rather be shagged than eaten?


Really?

It's possible to kill an animal humanely, and it serves a purpose society recognises as useful. It's probably not possible to screw an animal humanely, and it doesn't achieve anything beyond the perverse.

User avatar
Green Gecko
Director
Joined in 2008
Location: Sussex
Contact:

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Green Gecko » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:30 pm

This thread

Image

RIP in peace Wii U | Support GRcade | t: @GRcade | FB: GRcadeUK | YT: GRcadeVideo | Twitch: GRcadeUK
Image
Image
User avatar
Moggy
"Special"
Joined in 2008

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Moggy » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:31 pm

Karl wrote:
mic wrote:I just read this whole thread and, worryingly, the question that stands out in my mind is this - why is bestiality illegal? If it's a matter of consent, surely they'd rather be shagged than eaten?


Really?

It's possible to kill an animal humanely, and it serves a purpose society recognises as useful. It's probably not possible to screw an animal humanely, and it doesn't achieve anything beyond the perverse.


strawberry float off Karl, Golden Retrievers are asking for it, why else would they have all that luscious yellow fur? :datass:

User avatar
Ad7
Member
Joined in 2009

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Ad7 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:35 pm

jiggles wrote:I have nothing to contribute to this conversation, but this is sort of related and I saw it last night and it made me laugh so maybe it will make you laugh too.





:lol:

So strawberry floating true on the last one too, was speaking to someone the other day and asked how his weekend was.

"Great thanks, we went for a nice walk and as we're vegan, found a nice vegan restaurant to eat at."

:fp:

User avatar
KK
Moderator
Joined in 2008
Location: Botswana
Contact:

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by KK » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:43 pm

"As a gay man..."
"As a vegan..."

Top 2, every time.

Image
User avatar
KjGarly
Member
Joined in 2008
AKA: TheArbiter
Location: Liverpool

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by KjGarly » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:45 pm

mic wrote:I just read this whole thread and, worryingly, the question that stands out in my mind is this - why is bestiality illegal? If it's a matter of consent, surely they'd rather be shagged than eaten?

Also, is it legal to kill and eat pets?


Higher offence than noncing a kid, something I learned watching that 24 hours in Police custody on C4.

Image Image
User avatar
Christmas Name Change
Bizarre Title
Joined in 2008
AKA: Dan.
Location: Bered Kai Nev

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Christmas Name Change » Tue Sep 05, 2017 7:40 pm

Lucien wrote:Soya milk is best for coffees, they say

I don't know who they are but they are wrong - soya milk doesn't dissolve properly in coffee.

User avatar
Rocsteady
Member
Joined in 2008

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Rocsteady » Tue Sep 05, 2017 7:50 pm

BID0 wrote:
Pedz wrote:
Lucien wrote:
Oblomov Boblomov wrote:What would I put on my Shredded Wheat if not glorious milk? What would I put in long coffee?!


Lots of alternative milks for cereal (I use rice milk). Soya milk is best for coffees, they say: haven't tried it though since I drink green tea.


What if you don't like alternative mills?

There are hundreds of plants milks these days and more and more hit the shelves each day. Although Rice milk is pretty gross when I tried it recently :shifty:



I think the argument is that you can get a lot more nutrients from going straight to the source (plants) rather than getting these things indirectly through consuming animal product that ate those nutrients first. No one here is disputing that meat tastes good etc, that's all subjective. But you really can't claim things like "I hate the argument that humans shouldn't drink milk as since it's primarily for calves it cannot be good for us: it's so easily demonstrably false i don't understand why anyone would make it." and not be able to back it up. Sure you can get some calcium or vitamins but they are available in thousands of every day foods too (and without things like saturated fats and animal hormones etc), so you're getting some of the positives of plants but with the draw backs of consuming animal product, the only positive over plant based food being taste - which I would hope people here could recognise.

We have kind of gone so far from the original point that angry vegan person was trying to make, which was that milk is only produced by a mother X amount of time after having a child to help that child grow quickly in the early part of its life. After that point, the child doesn't need that same growth spurt anymore and can fend for itself/eat its natural diet.

I am guessing when Moggy says "Digesting plants is far slower than meat, it was essential for human development." is talking about how our primitive brains developed quickly historically (which I have no knowledge on really), rather than how our bodies actually digest food today, where plant foods have a far quicker transmit time through our body versus meat and dairy thanks to fiber sources which can only be found in plant based food.

Google Scholar 'milk beneficial to humans' if you like, there are loads of peer reviewed articles on there espousing the benefits of drinking milk. I'm not saying it's some magic elixir but it's a got a great blend of proteins, provides vitamins and calcium, and is a good source of calories. Just because you say other foods also have these doesn't refute the point that milk is good for us.

Image
User avatar
Fade
Member
Joined in 2011
Location: San Junipero

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Fade » Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:22 pm

Karl wrote:
Fade wrote:
Karl wrote:I like animals and I would eat any species that isn't endangered. I like horses and I ate horse last week. I don't think I'm crazy. You're just repeating "no you actually don't like them" -- what do you expect from this? Is it for me to change my thoughts & feelings? :?

If I caught and "humanely" killed and ate a stray cat, I don't think most people would believe me if I told them I loved cats. Why is it different when somebody else kills it for you? Genuinely curious.

If you love cats then you love cats, that would be demonstrated by your enjoyment of spending time with cats. Eating cat meat is irrelevant.

I would personally find it difficult to kill a cat that I had formed a bond with but that's just an emotive response. It doesn't mean there's anything morally wrong with cat meat. I would happily eat cat meat in a restaurant.

Usually when you love something it signifies that you care about it.

I love my family, that is signified by the fact that I care about their well-being and happiness. That's not demonstrated just by spending time with them.

With all due respect Karl you sound like a bit of a robot, "Just an emotive response" :lol: beep boop

Image
User avatar
Karl
Daiakuma
Daiakuma
Joined in 2008
Contact:

PostRe: KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...
by Karl » Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:28 pm

Fade wrote:.


Err? I'm happy to be in touch with my emotions, I just recognise that "it makes me feel bad :( " isn't a relevant argument in this discussion.

I love my cat but I don't connect with him in the same way that I do my mother, close friends, or partner. Because he's a cat.


Return to “Stuff”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: abcd, Albear, Benzin, Denster, Frank, Kanbei, lex-man, Mafro, Monkey Man, more heat than light, Rightey, Samuel_1, smurphy, Tineash, Yahoo [Bot], Yoshimi and 61 guests