Paid content in videogames (DLC, season passes, micro transactions and loot boxes)

Anything to do with games at all.
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BID0
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by BID0 » Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:33 am



I can't see how anyone can find these kind of systems fun. It's effectively a fruity machine where you just have to keep "playing" until the system lets you win. I don't have a lot of free time, so when I do have some, I'd rather use it to play an actual game.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Moggy » Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:51 am

Gemini73 wrote:I've no problem with some MTs either and have indulged across various titles, but for the AAA industry they do seem to be the key focus when an idea for a new game reaches the development process, with everything else taking a back seat. It's not uncommon these days to get bombarded by publishers with plans for season passes, DLC and MTs before any in depth details (beyond the initial announcement) of a new game come to light.


I agree, it seems to be rather than trying to make an amazing game that everyone will want to buy, they just spend their time wondering how they can fleece even more money out of people.

It’ll backfire spectacularly on them eventually.

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Hime
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Hime » Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:56 am

BID0 wrote:

I can't see how anyone can find these kind of systems fun. It's effectively a fruity machine where you just have to keep "playing" until the system lets you win. I don't have a lot of free time, so when I do have some, I'd rather use it to play an actual game.

It's the same hook that makes people gamble, buy scratch cards, football stickers, Pokemon cards, etc.

I can't think of angry console games that have been negatively affected so far but it's obviously what most mobile free to play games are about.

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KjGarly
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by KjGarly » Wed Oct 18, 2017 11:09 am

Titanfall Assault is the only 'game' that's given me trouble against nob jockeys who have paid £8.99 for a strawberry floating over powered character card (Jack strawberry floating Cooper :x ) ridiculously over powered and pair him up with a twatting Boomer and you get destroyed. strawberry float you, you bunch of mugs.

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Trelliz
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Trelliz » Wed Oct 18, 2017 11:38 am

Hime wrote:I can't think of any console games that have been negatively affected so far but it's obviously what most mobile free to play games are about.


The difference between them being that the former are charging £30+ THEN piling on the money-gouging. At least with mobile/f2p games you know the deal going in; you can play this game for free but they're going to try and get cash out of you as a result.

Tragic Magic wrote:I'm giving esteem a name of crafty Fu mining pinitz strawberry float me I live roasted ponuts

Never pre-order or pre-purchase a console, game or season pass.
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Gemini73
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Gemini73 » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:10 pm

"Activision patents matchmaking system designed to encourage microtransactions"

"This system would deliberately pair you with someone who had a premium item to show off, in the hope you would see and then spend money on it yourself"

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017- ... ansactions

:dread:

Last edited by Gemini73 on Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here".
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Saint of Killers
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Saint of Killers » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:13 pm

Gemini73 wrote:"Activision patents matchmaking system designed to encourage microtransactions"

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017- ... ansactions

:dread:


*cough* :P

| (•_•)| S: This is the best date I've been on since my last date. PB: This is not a date.
S: Neither was the last one. It was a robbery. M: Really? S: Yeah. She stole my heart. And my crown. (❍ᴥ❍ʋ)
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Gemini73
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Gemini73 » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:25 pm

Saint of Killers wrote:
Gemini73 wrote:"Activision patents matchmaking system designed to encourage microtransactions"

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017- ... ansactions

:dread:


*cough* :P


It was so bad I thought it was worth posting twice.

:shifty:

“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here".
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Saint of Killers
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Saint of Killers » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:32 pm

:lol:

Makes you wonder what kind of BS they would introduce to further entice players to buy DLC. Maybe the kill cam/round replays would now come with detailed info on what your opponent was wearing and using along with handily placed in-game links to take you to them in the console store.

| (•_•)| S: This is the best date I've been on since my last date. PB: This is not a date.
S: Neither was the last one. It was a robbery. M: Really? S: Yeah. She stole my heart. And my crown. (❍ᴥ❍ʋ)
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Gemini73
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Gemini73 » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:37 pm

Saint of Killers wrote::lol:

Makes you wonder what kind of BS they would introduce to further entice players to buy DLC.


How about "spend X amount on DLC to remove the ads"?

“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here".
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Hime
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Hime » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:42 pm

Trelliz wrote:
Hime wrote:I can't think of any console games that have been negatively affected so far but it's obviously what most mobile free to play games are about.


The difference between them being that the former are charging £30+ THEN piling on the money-gouging. At least with mobile/f2p games you know the deal going in; you can play this game for free but they're going to try and get cash out of you as a result.

But in console games it's normally cosmetic things that make no difference or items that can be aquired in game. There aren't any console games that put you at a severe disadvantage for not buying loot boxes and in some cases allow the game to be supported with maps that would otherwise have to be purchased and split the user base.

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Trelliz
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Trelliz » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:49 pm

Hime wrote:But in console games it's normally cosmetic things that make no difference or items that can be acquired in game.


The contents of the boxes are irrelevant - their delivery and business model encourage addictive personalities and tap into our brains in the same way, a process which is inherently anti-consumer. I long for the days when spending money got you a thing instead of paying to roll the dice.

EDIT: It's even sadder that a game NOT having lootboxes is now newsworthy.

Last edited by Trelliz on Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Tragic Magic wrote:I'm giving esteem a name of crafty Fu mining pinitz strawberry float me I live roasted ponuts

Never pre-order or pre-purchase a console, game or season pass.
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by OrangeRKN » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:54 pm

The problem is that "acquiring in game" is often a long, grindy process. Paying to unlock something instantly has replaced entering a cheat code to unlock something instantly. The latter respected the fact that the user has paid for the game already.

The argument that is sometimes used of paying to unlock stuff quickly being an added option for the time-constrained player is completely backwards. Why should someone with /less/ time to play your game pay /more/?

It's different with DLC added post release at least as you originally paid for the game as it came on release.

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Trelliz
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Trelliz » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:03 pm

OrangeRakoon wrote:The argument that is sometimes used of paying to unlock stuff quickly being an added option for the time-constrained player is completely backwards. Why should someone with /less/ time to play your game pay /more/?


Exactly. If they did want to offer "choice" there'd be a loot doubler mode or something built into the game for free.

Tragic Magic wrote:I'm giving esteem a name of crafty Fu mining pinitz strawberry float me I live roasted ponuts

Never pre-order or pre-purchase a console, game or season pass.
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Hime
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Hime » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:08 pm

Trelliz wrote:
Hime wrote:But in console games it's normally cosmetic things that make no difference or items that can be acquired in game.


The contents of the boxes are irrelevant - their delivery and business model encourage addictive personalities and tap into our brains in the same way, a process which is inherently anti-consumer. I long for the days when spending money got you a thing instead of paying to roll the dice.

EDIT: It's even sadder that a game NOT having lootboxes is now newsworthy.

It's relevant when it's entirely personal choice. People get addicted to lots of things, this forum is full of threads of people giving lists of games they bought and haven't played. Peoples lack of willpower is something they have to deal with.

Those games were also made by tiny teams that didn't have to support the game post release. I really don't mean to be an apologist for this stuff but we also have to be realistic about how companies can afford to support games that have stayed the same price for over 30 years despite the size of teams and development costs drastically inreasing.

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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by OrangeRKN » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:13 pm

Hime wrote:Those games were also made by tiny teams that didn't have to support the game post release. I really don't mean to be an apologist for this stuff but we also have to be realistic about how companies can afford to support games that have stayed the same price for over 30 years despite the size of teams and development costs drastically inreasing.


The points here are still relevant, but it's not true that games have stayed the same price.

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Gemini73
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Gemini73 » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:24 pm

this forum is full of threads of people giving lists of games they bought and haven't played


...looks at Steam back catalogue. :dread:

“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here".
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Trelliz
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Trelliz » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:25 pm

Hime wrote:Those games were also made by tiny teams that didn't have to support the game post release. I really don't mean to be an apologist for this stuff but we also have to be realistic about how companies can afford to support games that have stayed the same price for over 30 years despite the size of teams and development costs drastically inreasing.


Firstly games publishers have been evading tax on a monumental scale for years and making increasingly ludicrous profits so I have no sympathy for them on that front:



Secondly you can no longer buy a game in its entirety for £40 etc anymore with season passes, ultimate/special/gold editions and everything hidden behind lootboxes:


Tragic Magic wrote:I'm giving esteem a name of crafty Fu mining pinitz strawberry float me I live roasted ponuts

Never pre-order or pre-purchase a console, game or season pass.
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by jawafour » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:37 pm

Hime wrote:...we also have to be realistic about how companies can afford to support games that have stayed the same price for over 30 years despite the size of teams and development costs drastically inreasing.

Activision made $3.6 billion in DLC income in 2016; up from $1.6 billion in 2015. Sure, development costs of games have increased but, back in the 90s, you paid a fee and that granted you access to all of the entertainment for that game. Now, when you buy a “Triple A” game, the fee is the entry point; content and enhancements are chargeable extras and, increasingly, in the form of a virtual roulette wheel.

With the big publishers literally raking in billions from this form of charge, I do begrudge it when, say, shaders in Destiny 2 are single use. Or character development progress is dependent upon loot boxes as in Star Wars Battlefront II. This situation is going to increase as enough folk - a relatively small proportion of the audience, but paying large sums - are making this an easy, and hugely profitable, income channel for publishers.

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Hime
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PostRe: Micro transactions in all games (EA)
by Hime » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:10 pm

Trelliz wrote:
Hime wrote:Those games were also made by tiny teams that didn't have to support the game post release. I really don't mean to be an apologist for this stuff but we also have to be realistic about how companies can afford to support games that have stayed the same price for over 30 years despite the size of teams and development costs drastically inreasing.


Firstly games publishers have been evading tax on a monumental scale for years and making increasingly ludicrous profits so I have no sympathy for them on that front:



Secondly you can no longer buy a game in its entirety for £40 etc anymore with season passes, ultimate/special/gold editions and everything hidden behind lootboxes:


Some are making massive profits, some are going out of business. To be honest I hope the whole business model is looked at, I can't think of any other business that puts millions of pounds into projects that take a number of years only to pin all hoped on week one sales.

You can buy a game in its entirety for £40, anything else is just additional content to supplement the main game. As far as I know there are no games that can be purchased for £40 that require additional content. Every bit of DLC I have purchased (which isn't much) has either been stand alone single player content or more maps other than a couple of FUT player packs but this was entirely my choice and not necessary in any way.

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