Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - WARNING! glitch can delete save data upon starting a new character

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tolrag
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Too hardcore for Polygon
by tolrag » Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:07 pm

NickSCFC wrote:Any good deals on this?



No. The places it was <£40 up til last week are either out of stock or have bumped it up to <£50.

If you have Tesco vouchers coming to you this week then Tesco is probably the best option right now.

Tesco £42
Amazon £42/40 w/prime
Boomerang £38.39 +£1.15 TCB but 5-10 days before dispatch and It's Boomerang

Everywhere else OOS or at least £45.
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Mafro
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Too hardcore for Polygon
by Mafro » Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:57 pm

I honestly thought this and Nier were the same game until this morning.
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Too hardcore for Polygon
by HSH28 » Tue Feb 07, 2017 9:02 pm

Mafro wrote:I honestly thought this and Nier were the same game until this morning.


From the NieR Automata topic back in December...

HSH28 wrote:Guess I'm not the only one to have mixed this up with Nioh in my head at some point.
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Too hardcore for Polygon
by Saint of Killers » Wed Feb 08, 2017 5:52 am

They don't even look alike, though. :? :lol: What're you like, eh.

Anyhoo! The coop in this is supposedly (post below is opinion of a Gaffer) convoluted and poorly thought out...

Nioh is out. Yay...

Lots of people are enjoying it. Sure... (I am don't get me wrong, but not to the extent I was hoping, keep reading...)

But what about the people who played the betas and co-op'ed seamlessly with their friends and decided to buy Nioh because they believed they could do a blind friend co-op playthrough of the entire game together in the final version just like they were able to in the betas (e.g. Last Chance Trial)?

Too bad because Team Ninja just duped you!

In case you were confused as to how co-op works, read the section below, if not skip and read what I have to say afterwards.
_______________________________________________________________________
HOW CO-OP WORKS

From a GameFaq's post I will quote will describe how co-op works:

"You have several options to play co-op in Nioh. Unfortunately co-op with friends is rather restriced. To say it right away: It is NOT possible to play through the whole game mission by mission with a friend as at least one player needs to have beaten a mission in order to be able to join.

Now for the details.

1) Basics

In order to play co-op and summon a companion into your game you need to offer an Ochoko cup. These can bet gotten from dead revenants (the red ghosts from dead players that you can summon/that are summoned via red graves)

You can offer these cups at the shrine menu under the "summon" section.

The game will then start looking for a companion and connect them to you as soon as it finds one.


2) Joining Co-op with randoms:

1. After you beat a mission it is unlocked for proper co-op. You can then
- Highlight the mission on the map, hit X and then it allows you to hit Square to 'Become a Visitor.' In this mode when the host dies you are sent back to your world and you can't be revived either by the host

2. You can use the 'Starting Point' menu. There is an option called 'Torii Gate.' You have two options here:
-Yokai Realm with a Companion: This modes lets you revive each other with a gauge going down if someone dies till you survive the dead player. Just hit Circle at their grave. When the gauge is emptied the mission fails for both players.
-Random encounter: This is similar to 1. You don't get to revive each other in this mode.

Both options let you either randomly search for a game or specify a mission. You can only choose and enter certain missions with these menu options IF YOU HAVE ALREADY BEATEN THEM.


3) Co-op with friends/people using a password:

This is where it gets a bit annoying. The game offers a password system to connect with friends or people using the same password. This seems similar to Dark Souls and Bloodborne... But only at first glance.

You have the same options as stated above but are restricted to only being able to search for and enter missions that you have already beaten. So if two friends haven't beaten Mission 2, yet they won't be able to co-op it together.

So in order to play co-op both players need to

1. Set the same password
2. Set the password to 'On' obviously
3. The player trying to help/trying to join the other players as a companion has to have the mission unlocked/beaten
4. You then have the same options described above.
-via map 'Become a Visitor' option without revives
-via Torri Gate 'Random Encounter' without revives
-via Torri Gate 'Yokai Realm Companion' with the ability to revive each other...."

[url="https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/181161-nioh/74955646"]Credit from GameFaqs User: MercwithMouth82[/url]
_______________________________________________________________________

TL:DR:
Souls-like summoning: One friend needs to have the mission beaten which allows him to join as a visitor for randoms/friends.

Tori-Gate (Yokai with Companion) Co-Op: Both have to beat the mission

This applies to sub-missions and I'm also assuming the Twighlight missions. No clue if the restriction stays in place once the harder difficulty level is unlocked after the game is beaten.
_______________________________________________________________________

Before the single-player elitists come and say "co-op makes the game too easy..."

I like to counter:

1. This was NOT how it was like in the recent Last Chance Trial (only one I played)
2. Tori-Gate Co-op (Yokai with Companion) uses a blue meter that simulates a "shared life" pool that only slightly replenishes when you visit the mission's shrines. You CANNOT interact with the shrines like in SP whatsoever aside from this particular mission. If both of you die in this mode, the mission is OVER. Shortcuts reset. You also start the mission over from the first shrine. So basically you got 1 shot to get through the mission once that blue life meter runs out. Shortcuts are nonexistent. Can't heal/level-up at shrines either. (if any of the details before this are wrong, please correct me, but this is what my friend and I personally experienced!)

So a blind friend co-op playthrough through the Tori Gate is actually CHALLENGING. What doesn't make any strawberry floating sense is why Team Ninja changed it to where you both have to beat the mission?

If one person has to beat the mission to help the other friend, that destroys the sense of challenge for the other friend trying to co-op since the first friend already knows the level layout, enemy locations, secrets, shortcuts, etc.
_______________________________________________________________________

I'm just baffled as to how a game that celebrates on innovating on the Soulsborne formula, decides to regress the co-op mechanic. I beat Dark Souls 1, 2, 3 by myself but I also co-oped DS2, 3, and BB with my friend which was even more fun because I think co-op experiences with friends are just more enjoyable for me. After playing the Last Chance Trial and co-oping so easily with my friend, we thought we could play the entire game blind co-op in the final release only to realize Team Ninja duped us and changed the system for no ********* REASON.

Sorry for the rant, but I'm very salty. It's only because this game was GOTY contender, but this co-op fiasco just soured my gameplay. It's truly a great game. I love everything! Except the regressed co-op system. Just bewildering!

I hope I'm not alone guys.

And before you say the devs are very receptive to feedback, apparently Koei Tecmo does this with all their games. They have very backwards co-op mechanics and it seems that lines up with what we got on release. They actually changed it for the worse. There was literally no backlash to the co-op implementation in the Last Chance Trial, but nope, Koei Tecmo gotta **** everything up. I highly doubt it'll change.


I've only read bits of it and while it's not all bad (shared health is a good idea), getting MP started requires passwords and other hoops to jump through, and you can only play with someone once one of you has beaten the area.
| (•_•)| S: This is the best date I've been on since my last date. PB: This is not a date.
S: Neither was the last one. It was a robbery. M: Really? S: Yeah. She stole my heart. And my crown. (❍ᴥ❍ʋ)
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Samuel_1
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Too hardcore for Polygon
by Samuel_1 » Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:03 am

Saint of Killers wrote:They don't even look alike, though. :? :lol: What're you like, eh.

Anyhoo! The coop in this is supposedly (post below is opinion of a Gaffer) convoluted and poorly thought out...

Nioh is out. Yay...

Lots of people are enjoying it. Sure... (I am don't get me wrong, but not to the extent I was hoping, keep reading...)

But what about the people who played the betas and co-op'ed seamlessly with their friends and decided to buy Nioh because they believed they could do a blind friend co-op playthrough of the entire game together in the final version just like they were able to in the betas (e.g. Last Chance Trial)?

Too bad because Team Ninja just duped you!

In case you were confused as to how co-op works, read the section below, if not skip and read what I have to say afterwards.
_______________________________________________________________________
HOW CO-OP WORKS

From a GameFaq's post I will quote will describe how co-op works:

"You have several options to play co-op in Nioh. Unfortunately co-op with friends is rather restriced. To say it right away: It is NOT possible to play through the whole game mission by mission with a friend as at least one player needs to have beaten a mission in order to be able to join.

Now for the details.

1) Basics

In order to play co-op and summon a companion into your game you need to offer an Ochoko cup. These can bet gotten from dead revenants (the red ghosts from dead players that you can summon/that are summoned via red graves)

You can offer these cups at the shrine menu under the "summon" section.

The game will then start looking for a companion and connect them to you as soon as it finds one.


2) Joining Co-op with randoms:

1. After you beat a mission it is unlocked for proper co-op. You can then
- Highlight the mission on the map, hit X and then it allows you to hit Square to 'Become a Visitor.' In this mode when the host dies you are sent back to your world and you can't be revived either by the host

2. You can use the 'Starting Point' menu. There is an option called 'Torii Gate.' You have two options here:
-Yokai Realm with a Companion: This modes lets you revive each other with a gauge going down if someone dies till you survive the dead player. Just hit Circle at their grave. When the gauge is emptied the mission fails for both players.
-Random encounter: This is similar to 1. You don't get to revive each other in this mode.

Both options let you either randomly search for a game or specify a mission. You can only choose and enter certain missions with these menu options IF YOU HAVE ALREADY BEATEN THEM.


3) Co-op with friends/people using a password:

This is where it gets a bit annoying. The game offers a password system to connect with friends or people using the same password. This seems similar to Dark Souls and Bloodborne... But only at first glance.

You have the same options as stated above but are restricted to only being able to search for and enter missions that you have already beaten. So if two friends haven't beaten Mission 2, yet they won't be able to co-op it together.

So in order to play co-op both players need to

1. Set the same password
2. Set the password to 'On' obviously
3. The player trying to help/trying to join the other players as a companion has to have the mission unlocked/beaten
4. You then have the same options described above.
-via map 'Become a Visitor' option without revives
-via Torri Gate 'Random Encounter' without revives
-via Torri Gate 'Yokai Realm Companion' with the ability to revive each other...."

[url="https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/181161-nioh/74955646"]Credit from GameFaqs User: MercwithMouth82[/url]
_______________________________________________________________________

TL:DR:
Souls-like summoning: One friend needs to have the mission beaten which allows him to join as a visitor for randoms/friends.

Tori-Gate (Yokai with Companion) Co-Op: Both have to beat the mission

This applies to sub-missions and I'm also assuming the Twighlight missions. No clue if the restriction stays in place once the harder difficulty level is unlocked after the game is beaten.
_______________________________________________________________________

Before the single-player elitists come and say "co-op makes the game too easy..."

I like to counter:

1. This was NOT how it was like in the recent Last Chance Trial (only one I played)
2. Tori-Gate Co-op (Yokai with Companion) uses a blue meter that simulates a "shared life" pool that only slightly replenishes when you visit the mission's shrines. You CANNOT interact with the shrines like in SP whatsoever aside from this particular mission. If both of you die in this mode, the mission is OVER. Shortcuts reset. You also start the mission over from the first shrine. So basically you got 1 shot to get through the mission once that blue life meter runs out. Shortcuts are nonexistent. Can't heal/level-up at shrines either. (if any of the details before this are wrong, please correct me, but this is what my friend and I personally experienced!)

So a blind friend co-op playthrough through the Tori Gate is actually CHALLENGING. What doesn't make any strawberry floating sense is why Team Ninja changed it to where you both have to beat the mission?

If one person has to beat the mission to help the other friend, that destroys the sense of challenge for the other friend trying to co-op since the first friend already knows the level layout, enemy locations, secrets, shortcuts, etc.
_______________________________________________________________________

I'm just baffled as to how a game that celebrates on innovating on the Soulsborne formula, decides to regress the co-op mechanic. I beat Dark Souls 1, 2, 3 by myself but I also co-oped DS2, 3, and BB with my friend which was even more fun because I think co-op experiences with friends are just more enjoyable for me. After playing the Last Chance Trial and co-oping so easily with my friend, we thought we could play the entire game blind co-op in the final release only to realize Team Ninja duped us and changed the system for no ********* REASON.

Sorry for the rant, but I'm very salty. It's only because this game was GOTY contender, but this co-op fiasco just soured my gameplay. It's truly a great game. I love everything! Except the regressed co-op system. Just bewildering!

I hope I'm not alone guys.

And before you say the devs are very receptive to feedback, apparently Koei Tecmo does this with all their games. They have very backwards co-op mechanics and it seems that lines up with what we got on release. They actually changed it for the worse. There was literally no backlash to the co-op implementation in the Last Chance Trial, but nope, Koei Tecmo gotta **** everything up. I highly doubt it'll change.


I've only read bits of it and while it's not all bad (shared health is a good idea), getting MP started requires passwords and other hoops to jump through, and you can only play with someone once one of you has beaten the area.


Sounds OK, hopefully they'll patch the silly rule about playing with friends. Should be an easy fix.
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jiggles
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Parts of coop play possibly convoluted and poorly thought out
by jiggles » Wed Feb 08, 2017 3:21 pm

This game is strawberry floatin' great.

Here's me taking out the first two bosses:


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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Parts of coop play possibly convoluted and poorly thought out
by jiggles » Sat Feb 11, 2017 12:13 am

You strawberry floatin' people.
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Parts of coop play possibly convoluted and poorly thought out
by NickSCFC » Sat Feb 11, 2017 1:12 am

How does this compare to Bloodborne? Does it make you go back and play the last half hour each time you die?
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Parts of coop play possibly convoluted and poorly thought out
by Parksey » Sat Feb 11, 2017 3:48 am

Well for a start, Bloodborne doesn't actually make you do 30 minutes of gameplay again each time you die. Plus if you aren't getting better and quicker at doing some parts each time you die, then you to look at what you're doing in-game as you should pretty much always be constantly improving or unlocking shortcuts.
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Parts of coop play possibly convoluted and poorly thought out
by Saint of Killers » Sat Feb 11, 2017 9:41 am

jiggles wrote:You strawberry floatin' people.


:lol:

I'll definitely be getting it, but kinda difficult for me to justify the purchase when I still haven't even opened Y0.

I did watch the your videos, though. (Almost all of the first and bits of the second.)
| (•_•)| S: This is the best date I've been on since my last date. PB: This is not a date.
S: Neither was the last one. It was a robbery. M: Really? S: Yeah. She stole my heart. And my crown. (❍ᴥ❍ʋ)
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Parts of coop play possibly convoluted and poorly thought out
by NickSCFC » Sat Feb 11, 2017 1:40 pm

Floex wrote:I thought you was buying it?


I've not finished Resi 7 yet :fp:
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Out now!
by Jordan UK » Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:06 pm

I will be getting this at some point. I love the idea of a Ninja Gaiden / Dark Souls mix. Ninja Gaiden was one of those games that had such a considered difficulty curve that, although it was always challenging, you were always getting better - it allowed a great deal of mastery.
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Parts of coop play possibly convoluted and poorly thought out
by Floex » Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:15 pm

jiggles wrote:You strawberry floatin' people.


*Looks for Nioh prices*

*sees not one place is selling it for under £42*

Me

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HSH28
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Parts of coop play possibly convoluted and poorly thought out
by HSH28 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 4:13 pm

Floex wrote:
jiggles wrote:You strawberry floatin' people.


*Looks for Nioh prices*

*sees not one place is selling it for under £42*

Me

Image


Its £40 on Amazon if you have Prime.

Just started the game, died a lot while getting used to it at the beginning but I think I've got the basics down now, sure there are plenty of difficulty spikes to come though.
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Due Thursday - Too hardcore for Polygon
by Zartan » Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:43 am

HSH28 wrote:
Mafro wrote:I honestly thought this and Nier were the same game until this morning.


From the NieR Automata topic back in December...

HSH28 wrote:Guess I'm not the only one to have mixed this up with Nioh in my head at some point.


Ha Ha I thought it was just me being stupid, well I was even slower, so I guess I probably was
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Out now!
by Gemini73 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 11:14 pm

My copy was despatched yesterday. Hopefully be here by Tuesday. Looking forward to getting my ass kicked.
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - Out now!
by NickSCFC » Mon Feb 20, 2017 10:16 pm

Gemini73 wrote:My copy was despatched yesterday. Hopefully be here by Tuesday. Looking forward to getting my ass kicked.


What's the difficulty like compared to Souls/Bloodborne?
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PostRe: Nioh - PS4 - Team Ninja - WARNING! glitch can delete save data upon starting a new character
by Saint of Killers » Mon Feb 20, 2017 10:17 pm

Nioh is a fantastic, challenging action game, but it's fallen victim to a potentially game-breaking bug.

As reported by many on Reddit and NeoGAF, starting a new character can cause the game to overwrite your previous data.

This isn't simply a flaw in the game's design as you're supposed to be able to have multiple save files. Many do. It appears that only some unfortunate souls are afflicted by this.

Redditor Unkempt_Herald lost a level 98 character this way. "There was no real indication that it would delete my old one. I assumed I could just load it when I wanted to return to that character. I was wrong," they said.

Cosmo-Knight and Brentalina fell victim to the same problem. "I was playing both characters just fine for a couple of days, today both save files are of the same character. My original character just seems to have vanished," the latter said.

We've reached out to publisher Koei Tecmo for an update on what's happening here.

In the meantime, we'd recommend backing your save up to a USB drive or the Cloud before creating a new character, just to be safe.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017- ... -character
| (•_•)| S: This is the best date I've been on since my last date. PB: This is not a date.
S: Neither was the last one. It was a robbery. M: Really? S: Yeah. She stole my heart. And my crown. (❍ᴥ❍ʋ)

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