Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING

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Jazzem
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PostPerfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Jazzem » Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:12 pm



One of my favourite gaming YT channels just released a superb video on Rare's FPS legacy. They tackle Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, the Timesplitters games and finally Perfect Dark Zero.

They play PD0 for the first time for this video, unfortunately impressions aren't terribly strong for it. Much praise is given to the hilarious ragdoll physics at least :p

As odd as I find it to think of a X360 game aging poorly, PD0 does look pretty rough by today's standards, surprisingly strong texture bump mapping aside. Curious as to what the general thoughts of PD0 on GR are, I know there were a lot of X360 fans on here in its heyday

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more heat than light
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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by more heat than light » Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:25 pm

Loved PDZ at the 360 launch. Playerbase was huge and the multiplayer modes were varied and fun (infection was a particular highlight). Single player was an absolute travesty, but the original Perfect Dark was gooseberry fool too so no surprise there.

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Garth
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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Garth » Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:29 pm

Yeah, I recall the single player being crap but having some fun on the multiplayer with people from here.

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by HSH28 » Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:52 pm

Jazzem wrote:As odd as I find it to think of a X360 game aging poorly, PD0 does look pretty rough by today's standards, surprisingly strong texture bump mapping aside. Curious as to what the general thoughts of PD0 on GR are, I know there were a lot of X360 fans on here in its heyday


Perfect Dark Zero looked rough at 360s launch.

EDIT - To me it basically looks like a high res Xbox game.

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rinks
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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by rinks » Sun Oct 21, 2018 2:09 pm

Most of the games mentioned in the OP gave me motion vom-queasiness, so despite enjoying them, I also hated them.

And my opinion of PD0 is summed up by the fact it's one of the few games I ever traded in without completing it first.

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Vermilion
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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Vermilion » Sun Oct 21, 2018 2:33 pm

I still remember the hype surrounding the first Perfect Dark, various Nintendo mags were in overdrive about it for years before it was actually released.

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Pedz » Sun Oct 21, 2018 2:36 pm

I thought this was something you did Jazzem!!!! I'm assuming not???

Disappointed.

I enjoyed the MP infection games with the GR crew. Was fun. Not a great game or even a good game though tbh. I remember we were all playing it and we encouraged Hugo to get it. He did not enjoy the game.

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Parksey
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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Parksey » Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:50 pm

more heat than light wrote:Loved PDZ at the 360 launch. Playerbase was huge and the multiplayer modes were varied and fun (infection was a particular highlight). Single player was an absolute travesty, but the original Perfect Dark was gooseberry fool too so no surprise there.


You're joking about the original PD being crap, right? He's joking.

PDZ was originally developed for the Xbox and then shifted to the 360. It probably even had some parts of designed for the GameCube before the buyout. It's not surprise that it was ropey.

I enjoyed it though. By 2005 it's single player structure was quite old-fashioned (failing levels due to messing up an objective isn't really a thing now in triple-A shooters in 2018) and it was a sort of weird bridge between where FPS games had been, and where they were going.

The multiplayer was great though, before everyone went off and did their own thing. Some of the game modes were different, it had decent weapons and there was quite a lot of customisation if I remember correctly.

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by the eponymous bollock » Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:03 pm

Watched a bit of Kyle Bosman play the original PD for the first time a week or so ago and was reminded what a bloody fantastic game it is, how jam packed it is with stuff to do and what a fantastic style it has.

The Chicago (I think it’s Chicago) level for example has such a cool Blade Runner style atmosphere and it just looked brilliant on the N64 (admittedly it ran like a toilet filled with glass). The levels are so interesting to explore and many have vast areas to explore that have nothing to do with the missions. Some of the bases in Area 51 for example you can take lift rides to entire floors that serve no purpose other than exploration. The unfolding mission structures are fantastic too and an avenue of FPS game design when everything just got Halo’ised.

I’d love to glimpse an alternate reality where Halo never existed and FPS’ continued to develop down the Rare style template.

Never played the sequel properly. How much from the original did it develop on.

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Parksey » Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:13 pm

Yep, the levels changed depending on what difficulty you played as. Like you mentioned, there were huge areas you didn't have to visit on normal or easy. The fact that each difficulty added objectives and areas meant it wasn't just a case of scaling up damage.

Not many FPS games approach difficulty in this way. There was a sense that the "easy" version of the level wasn't the true experience, and only be playing with the full set of objectives was everything available to you.

What's more, one or two of the levels even changed your starting position depending on the difficulty. It doesn't sound like much, but for the Vila stage, easy and normal had you dropped in on the outskirts, from a decent vantage point where you could slowly approach enemies from afar. Hard had you basically start the level at gunpoint.

There was actually a reason to play the game on the various difficulties. Let alone the fact that each stage had secrets, quirks and easter eggs in them, as well as the speed run/cheat unlocks.

It chugged a lot at times (though SP was okay. MP could really make it slow down), but for me it was better than GoldenEye. GoldenEye had handful of classic stages (Facility, Bunker, the Dam etc) but also a few duff ones (the Surface levels, the tank). PD was a much better single player experience.

EDIT - You're right about everything getting Halo-ised too. By the time PDZ came out, Halo had made it look extremely dated. But we never really went back to the old-school style of shooter. Everything became quite samey in its own way after that.

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by the eponymous bollock » Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:26 pm

Parksey wrote:What's more, one or two of the levels even changed your starting position depending on the difficulty. It doesn't sound like much, but for the Vila stage, easy and normal had you dropped in on the outskirts, from a decent vantage point where you could slowly approach enemies from afar. Hard had you basically start the level at gunpoint.


Are you sure, I thought you only started as the hostage if you played coop.

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Gemini73 » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:04 pm

Lost hours to local multiplayer on Golden Eye and later Perfect Dark. Great memories.

I tried PDZ SP twice. Once at launch, again about 18 months ago to see if my opinion might change given my penchant for enjoying older games while accepting their shortcomings. Sadly not. I was desperate to like it, but it really is a bag of gooseberry fool even in light of its old school approach.

PDZ MP? Kind of missed the boat on that one.

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Oblomov Boblomov
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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Oblomov Boblomov » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:28 pm

more heat than light wrote:Single player was an absolute travesty, but the original Perfect Dark was gooseberry fool too so no surprise there.

What the strawberry float? Are you talking N64?

What the strawberry float?

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by 7256930752 » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:57 pm

Oblomov Boblomov wrote:
more heat than light wrote:Single player was an absolute travesty, but the original Perfect Dark was gooseberry fool too so no surprise there.

What the strawberry float? Are you talking N64?

What the strawberry float?

Despite loving Goldeneye I didn't actually play PD until the HD release and passed the first few levels I didn't enjoy it much at all.

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more heat than light
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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by more heat than light » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:57 pm

Oblomov Boblomov wrote:
more heat than light wrote:Single player was an absolute travesty, but the original Perfect Dark was gooseberry fool too so no surprise there.

What the strawberry float? Are you talking N64?

What the strawberry float?


Yup, I rebought the XBLA port when that came out too and still couldn't get into it. I just find it incredibly dull.

EDIT - I love GoldenEye too.

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Wedgie » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:08 pm

It was great on the N64 while it came out first.

Of course you wouldn't expect it to be that good again many years later. It's like re-watching a favourite childhood film and realise its shite and your childhood memories get destroyed.

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Miguel007
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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Miguel007 » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:13 pm

Perfect Dark and Goldeneye were a massive part of my gaming past and I think they are perfectly playable today [with the caveat you played them originally, as the frame rate will be difficult to stomach for millennials]. I wish other FPS' had their more objectives harder difficulty and time cheats. I still enjoy speed running levels trying to beat my times although I don't have any WR's the XB port was great for this for the Leaderboards.

PD0 is a travesty though, I thought that at the time. I've never been back to it since my initial playthrough, there are only two things I like about it [The opening intro Bond Homage and the Trance Song from the Night Club Level].

Also remember when Smash Bros. Melee [GameCube] had a Proximity Mine trophy hinting at the next Perfect Dark before the Microsoft sale, they couldn't patch that one out :lol:

Also if anyone is interested in speed runs of Goldeneye and Perfect Dark; RWhiteGoose on YouTube has brill breakdowns of levels, speed run history and speed run news well worth taking a look.




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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by 7256930752 » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:50 pm

Wedgie wrote:It was great on the N64 while it came out first.

Of course you wouldn't expect it to be that good again many years later. It's like re-watching a favourite childhood film and realise its shite and your childhood memories get destroyed.

I thought the first few levels were great as they were pretty much Goldeneye but I thought the alien stuff was rubbish and the level design went severally down hill.

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PostRe: Perfect Dark Zero and the Legacy of GoldenEye - MY LIFE IN GAMING
by Parksey » Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:42 am

Hime wrote:
Wedgie wrote:It was great on the N64 while it came out first.

Of course you wouldn't expect it to be that good again many years later. It's like re-watching a favourite childhood film and realise its shite and your childhood memories get destroyed.

I thought the first few levels were great as they were pretty much Goldeneye but I thought the alien stuff was rubbish and the level design went severally down hill.


Yeah, the final two levels where you weren't shooting humans, but big green aliens, were by far the weakest. The Datadyne levels at the start were a highlight, but the villa was great, Area 51 was great, the airport and plane levels were good as was the Carrington Institute (never could finish that on Perfect Agent). It was only really the last two that took a downward turn. They were okay, but I didn't replay then much. You couldn't mess with the enemy A.I. as much with the aliens.

The levels flowed a lot better than GoldenEye too, often moving in to each other and being part of a three-day structure (the Datadyne ones were a group of three, the Area 51 ones were, as were the Air Force One sections).

And yeah, then villa on PA had you start as the hostage:



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