Moggy's Mass Debate: Should humans have to work?

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Imagine it is the (hopefully

) near future and machines have advanced to the point where they can do any task at all. From cleaning, to building, to driving, to programming, to babysitting, to growing food, to cooking, to power production, to helplines and everything else that humans currently do.

There is no longer any need for humanity to have to work as the machines will do it for us. And these are friendly machines, not Skynet, which are in every single country in the entire world.

Should humans continue to have to work?

Depends.

Dan. wrote:Depends.

On?

From the wording, "have to work", no of course not. Why should humans be forced to work if there is no practical need?

If people choose to work however, then that's entirely different. Although whether that really counts as "work" is another matter, as people would be free to pursue what interests them.

It's also unclear whether the machines would handle innovation, scientific advancement, and cultural production.

This is the basis for the economy in Star Trek.
Money doesn't exist as all the work can be done by robots and power is unlimited as they have harnessed antimatter so people work to better themselves in fields of study they enjoy. I can see the robotics part of this coming true in my lifetime and if fusion reactors are finally perfected and run by robots the power issue may also be viable along with 3d printing for most of the household stuff we use so I don't think it's totally in the realms of fiction and money could indeed cease to matter.
It would though give us the problem of just how people who have nothing but free time spend that time and social issues need to be dealt with as well so it's not all great.
The next 50 years could see a revolution like no other and it will have to be global in implementation at the same time or we'll have this odd situation of some countries still using money while others don't.

If we don't work, what will we do? Get fat and lazy? Who is going to keep these machines in check?

Corazon de Leon

Death's Head wrote:If we don't work, what will we do? Get fat and lazy? Who is going to keep these machines in check?

Wall-E comes to life. :dread:

In fairness, the biggest thing that stops me from having a dead set exercise and diet regime is my funny work hours. If I wasn't working, I'd be fit as strawberry float. :shifty:

Death's Head wrote:Get fat and lazy?

Arguably that's what work encourages, not not working.

Death's Head wrote:If we don't work, what will we do? Get fat and lazy? Who is going to keep these machines in check?

The machines will have other machines that keep them running and those machines will in turn fix each other.

Surely us non-working humans would still need to be able to pay for our robots and things like energy and food (I doubt either of those commodities will ever be truly free of cost), so we'd still need some way to earn a living?

I think if someone said "you no longer have to work, go and become an expert in whatever field you like", I would sit in a dark room and play videogames until I died.

Death's Head wrote:If we don't work, what will we do? Get fat and lazy? Who is going to keep these machines in check?

What would you do if you won a million pounds? If you'd get fat and lazy, more power to you -- I'd hope you'd enjoy it!

Once we reach a point where machine learning algorithms and robotics can perform almost any task, there is absolutely no need for anyone to have a job. Food can be made by automated agriculture, power stations can run themselves, robots can be built and maintained by other robots. This won't happen in our lifetimes but I'd guess it probably will happen in the next few centuries.

Why would we insist humans work in such a world if they don't want to? I am certain many of the more stimulating 'jobs' would be filled for fun, or for societal perks beyond the basics -- perhaps the social status of being enthusiastic about contributing something would be attractive and satisfying, like having a hobby is now? I would personally continue to be a researcher even in a post-scarcity society, because it interests me and I enjoy it -- but if a job is not enjoyable why would we force someone to do it when a robot could instead?

OrangeRakoon wrote:From the wording, "have to work", no of course not. Why should humans be forced to work if there is no practical need?

Obviously people will always be free to work if they want to. Volunteering, doing your own washing etc.

At the moment, those who don’t work are called lazy and workshy and I guarantee that in a machine dominated future there will be calls for people to have to work, even if it is just pointless tasks, just to keep rich people above them. After all, if there is no need to work in order to obtain money in order to live, what is the point of being a rich person? There will also be people who think that people not working will lead to unhealthyness or a moral decline in society.

Preezy wrote:Surely us non-working humans would still need to be able to pay for our robots and things like energy and food (I doubt either of those commodities will ever be truly free of cost), so we'd still need some way to earn a living?

For the foreseeable future, yes. But eventually, in the distant future when robots themselves completely automatically maintain the power supply, the robot factories, house-building, public utilities, and agriculture, I think a comfortable existence involving food, water and shelter could be provided to everyone for free.

Preezy wrote:I think if someone said "you no longer have to work, go and become an expert in whatever field you like", I would sit in a dark room and play videogames until I died.

You'd totally have the freedom to do that. Is it a bad thing?

Preezy wrote:Surely us non-working humans would still need to be able to pay for our robots and things like energy and food (I doubt either of those commodities will ever be truly free of cost), so we'd still need some way to earn a living?

Well that’s the point of the question. The machines can produce near unlimited amounts of energy (and therefore food and water) by building massive solar arrays that microwave energy back to Earth. Clean, cheap and maintained by the machines themselves.

But would the company/government that creates the original energy collecting machines give that energy out for free (even when there is no cost to them) or will they insist on payment and therefore force people to keep working?

Karl wrote:
Preezy wrote:I think if someone said "you no longer have to work, go and become an expert in whatever field you like", I would sit in a dark room and play videogames until I died.

You'd totally have the freedom to do that. Is it a bad thing?

Of course not, but my wife would be pissed :slol:

Preezy wrote:
Karl wrote:
Preezy wrote:I think if someone said "you no longer have to work, go and become an expert in whatever field you like", I would sit in a dark room and play videogames until I died.

You'd totally have the freedom to do that. Is it a bad thing?

Of course not, but my wife would be pissed

She could spend all day reading OK! magazine or whatever it is women do (I have never met one but they sound awful), so she would be happy too. :toot:

Karl wrote:What would you do if you won a million pounds? If you'd get fat and lazy, more power to you -- I'd hope you'd enjoy it!

Not quite the same as this would be just one person, plus the money would let me do things I might not normally be able to do. In the world where we have no jobs, are we also going to have enough money to do whatever we want? Most (all) economies rely heavily on the service sector so I can't really see Moggy's world leading to a happy society.

I think the more likely outcome is the human battery as seen in The Matrix.

Why would there have to be a service sector any more? I'm not talking tomorrow, I'm talking in 400 years -- imagine we have magic slave robots that can do anything but won't demand compensation.

Whilst I don't like work as much as the next person, I do think people need to have some purpose to their lives. In a world where robots do everything for us, I'd like to think that mankind would then focus on exploration and discovery - conquering our oceans and the local solar system would be a great start!

Moggy's Mass Debate: Should humans have to work?

Should humans work?

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