David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'

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tomvek
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PostDavid Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by tomvek » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:37 pm

Heavy Rain creator David Cage has predicted that photo-realistic graphics will be possible within the next six years - and revealed that he is unconvinced by the long-term potential of new facial capture techniques used to make Rockstar's L.A Noire.

Speaking to CVG, Cage said that Quantic Dream is already employing new technology to capture full body performance in unannounced games. He claimed these projects were already showing "significant progress" on what the studio achieved with Heavy Rain last year.

L.A Noire benefits from DepthAnalysis' Motion Scan technology, which requires in-game actors re-record scenes whilst just their head is filmed by hundreds of cameras. This has allowed developer Team Bondi to represent subtle facial movements during gameplay. Bondi and L.A Noire co-creator Rockstar have proudly boasted that MotionScan represents a "revolution" for motion capture in games, but Cage is less convinced.

He told CVG: "What to say about L.A Noire? I think it's an interesting solution to a problem for now. But it's also an interesting dead end. That's exactly what I feel. Their technique is incredibly expensive and they will never be able to shoot body and face at the same time."

Cage revealed that Quantic Dream is using performance capture that reads both actors' body and faces in one shot - which he believes will lead to real graphical advancement.

"We are doing that now [at Quantic], and our next games will be shot with performance capture," he explained. "We see a huge difference between shooting the face and body separately and shooting everything at the same time. Suddenly you've got a real sense of acting that is consistent. You can't imagine how related what you say with your face is to what your body does.

"[Those using MotionScan] will never be able to do that. The other thing is that they can't have real time lighting. Their technique means they can't have lighting the way I think we should do it. Basically, they take pictures; they take scans several times per frame. They also have limitations on the shaders they use, they can't re-target the eyes because they eyes are captured. When you have actors in real time you like to to re-target the eyes to make sure they look at each other [convincingly] etc. etc.

"It's a list of important problems that cannot be solved with their technology. I think L.A Noire looks good - honestly, it does - but I don't think they'll go much further than where they are. With the technology we use, we can improve; there is a lot of room for improvement and we hope to show very soon where we are now. We've made significant progress since Heavy Rain and will continue to make progress until we reach the stage of Avatar. That is probably three, four five years from now."

When we asked if Cage was referring to the photo-realistic visuals seen in James Cameron's blockbuster movie, he replied:

"Yes. Four or five years. Maybe it's going to require a new [gaming] platform, but when you look at where real-time is right now, it's probably where CG was five, six years ago. You can say there's a five-year gap between CG and real time. Avatar was released last year, so that's where we should be in five, six years from now."

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/29 ... he-future/

Sounds like an opportunity to talk up his own tech though we'll see what he produces when he reveals his new game.

In the meantime the technology they're using for L.A Noire does look amazing.

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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Ginga » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:42 pm

It's one thing to make games look pretty, another to make them play well. If his vision for the future is as comical and cringeworthy as Heavy Rain then I've got little faith in what he says...

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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Mafro » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:43 pm

He's just jelly.

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jiggles
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by jiggles » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:49 pm

Someone shut this man up.

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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Cuttooth » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:52 pm

Mafro wrote:He's just jelly.

About to post the same thing. :lol:

What a hack.

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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by SEP » Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:21 pm

Ginga wrote:It's one thing to make games look pretty, another to make them play well. If his vision for the future is as comical and cringeworthy as Heavy Rain then I've got little faith in what he says...


I dunno, the guy could do a pretty convincing remake of Dragon's Lair.

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HSH28
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by HSH28 » Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:23 pm

He probably does have some valid points, it doesn't mean that the tech they are using for LA Noire isn't the best possible solution for right now.

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satriales
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by satriales » Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:24 pm

This is an area where he actually knows what he's talking about as Quantic Dream have their own high-end motion capture studio. On the other hand, he could just be trying to downplay a rival technology.

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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Floex » Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:40 pm

I'm guessing I'm the only one who isn't graphically impressed with LA Noire. It still has that horrible R* animation to it

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Harry Bizzle
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Harry Bizzle » Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:02 pm

I don't see the big deal. He's only talking about the technical side of things.


I'm just happy there's more and more narrative heavy games coming out. :wub:

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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Fade » Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:24 pm

Cuttooth wrote:
Mafro wrote:He's just jelly.

About to post the same thing. :lol:

And me.

I wonder if they do actually have better technology in development. Or if they just put more dots on people's faces.

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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by NickSCFC » Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:43 pm

By the looks of things LA Noire's technique actually makes 3D polygonal models just as Heavy Rain does, but the results are much more impressive.

Also, what if you want to make the character walk around and movie via player input while his head's talking, wouldn't that be impossible with Quantic's proposed technique?

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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Tineash » Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:37 am

Dead end?
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Nah

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Octoroc
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Octoroc » Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:45 am

Maybe he's right, he's certainly better placed to talk about mocap than I am. Technology moves on. I don't understand why people are being so defensive about this.

*** goes back to sprite engine ***

So far this year, I have eaten NO mince pies.
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Christopher
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Christopher » Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:54 am

Isn't he just saying that the tech in L.A. Noire is pushed as far as it can go? And that he feels there is better tech out there? Admittedly he has an invested interest in this.

Or he is just jelly.

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Beans
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Beans » Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:57 am

Jelly.

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Octoroc
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Octoroc » Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:59 am

On a plate?

So far this year, I have eaten NO mince pies.
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Beans
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Beans » Fri Apr 01, 2011 9:01 am

Wibble wobble

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Octoroc
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Octoroc » Fri Apr 01, 2011 9:35 am

They call it Wackelpudding in Germany you know.

So far this year, I have eaten NO mince pies.
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PostRe: David Cage: L.A Noire tech is 'interesting dead end'
by Drunken_Master » Fri Apr 01, 2011 9:42 am

David Cage wrote:I think L.A Noire looks better than Heavy Rain, but I can't admit this. So I'm just going to be snidey

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