STAR WARS: The Force Awakens Thread (All discussion and spoilers in here)

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Kanbei wrote:

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Too be honest that hadn't crossed my mind at all. Makes a good point.

All I got from that is that the Imperial armies during the OT helped raise Luke and the gang.

Ad7 wrote:
Skippy wrote:

Hadn't thought of that before.

Maeks u fink huh x

Wow. Also hadn't thought of that.

I'd guess that it's pretty strawberry floating hard to be turned to the dark side when you weren't to our knowledge asked to be on the light side.

Finally seen this. Great film. I Agree with those who think it nods to a new hope a little too much.

But for me the standout positives were the new leading characters. Rey, Finn, Poe and Ren were all excellent well developed and with a lot of room for growth and character arcs.

I'm glad the old cast were mostly in the background. This new trilogy mustn't live off nostalgia and old characters. Force awakens played it safe but revitalised the star wars universe and has opened the door for new stories and adventures.

I'm also glad they brought back proper space dog fighting!! The X wing advance over the lake was epic!! And they were restrained on light sabre battles, gritty and angry with no over the top flips jumps or twirls. Felt more personal and less "superhero"

A good film, not without flaws but I'd be nitpicking to highlight them.

FatDaz wrote:Finally seen this. Great film. I Agree with those who think it nods to a new hope a little too much.

But for me the standout positives were the new leading characters. Rey, Finn, Poe and Ren were all excellent well developed and with a lot of room for growth and character arcs.

I'm glad the old cast were mostly in the background. This new trilogy mustn't live off nostalgia and old characters. Force awakens played it safe but revitalised the star wars universe and has opened the door for new stories and adventures.

I'm also glad they brought back proper space dog fighting!! The X wing advance over the lake was epic!! And they were restrained on light sabre battles, gritty and angry with no over the top flips jumps or twirls. Felt more personal and less "superhero"

A good film, not without flaws but I'd be nitpicking to highlight them.

Well summed up Daz.

I would have liked to have seen more of Poe and Phasma, to be honest. But other than that, yes, they were great.

Lucien wrote:How do people square up this film being 'great' against it having so many holes in the story? Basically, this:

Well he's convinced me. I thought I loved it. But now I realise that I was actually shite.
:roll:

I'd like to think I'm not an apologist for the movie. I don't go around trying to conjure up ridiculous theories and backstories to explain every little thing. I accept there are things that are a bit too coincidental (Han and Chewie finding them, R2 waking up) and that it does perhaps immitate ANH a bit too closely at times (Death Star III being the main culprit), but I don't get all the confusion about Rey being good with the force.

What I took away from it was that she'd heard stories about the Jedi (This is brought up several times in the movie) so it's quite likely she knew what a mind-trick is. Kylo Ren flat out says that she's "untrained, but stronger than she knows". For me it's not a stretch at all that she fumbles her first two attempts at it before getting it the third time. But apparently these things need to be spelled out in black and white or its just "a bad movie". We're not allowed to leave anything unexplained it would seem.

I've not got a problem if people don't like it. That's fine and I don't expect to change anyones mind. I do think that there will be a small percentage of those people who are hating on it because its "cool" to not be part of that crowd. The same thing happens with games that come out, get universally praised then after 6-months suddenly become "shite".

I loved the story they told and I'm excited to see where it goes from here. At the end of the day it's not perfect, but some Youtube edgelord with a clickbait video title isn't going to convince me that it was anything other than fantastic.

If the original Star Wars was released today people would complain about it in a similar way

"I wish they'd explained more about about the Clone Wars and the relationship between Kenobi and Luke's dad, that sounded interesting and it would have given us a better understanding of the political state of the galaxy."

"Luke is such a horrible character. He just bitches and moans and then the film just completely drops the fact his aunt and uncle were murdered after about 30 seconds. It's like he doesn't care, what a gooseberry fool!?"

"Why does Luke implicitly trust this Ben Kenobi character when at the start he only describes him as a 'strange old hermit'?"

"So Luke is a pilot sometimes and flies around Tatooine, so why is so good in an X-Wing? It's a complete different vehicle, and he's good enough to mae the trench run when all but like two other pilots are killed? Doesn't make any sense."

"This 'Force' thing is just so convenient. Written yourself into a corner? Oh yeah, The Force will sort that out."

"Vader is such a shallow character. Good look, big booming voice but he doesn't actually do much. Obi-Wan lets him win and then he gets shot and spins off at the end like a little bitch lol"

"Peter Cushing's character was wasted. It's like the script's entire character description was 'British villain archetype'."

"How are we supposed to fear for the main characters' safety when the Stormtroopers can't shoot for gooseberry fool? Robs the movie of any tension during the Death Star escape"

"Luke swinging over that big gap with Leia holding on to him was such a cliché. What is this, an Eroll Flynn movie?"

"I hope someone starts a parody Twitter account for the Catina Band, the bar dude's arm or Owen and Beru's burnt corpses lol"

And so on. It's mostly because the internet has given a small group of nerds who want to know everything, every little detail about a film or game's lore, the kind of people that read and write Wookiepedia entries, it's given them a better platform for their cries to be heard. They're still overwhelmingly in the minority, but its a minority studios know they can absolutely cash in on with expanded universe books and comics.

Oh god, you're one of those people who needs everything to be spelled out especially for you, don't you? God forbid you should have to fill in some gaps with your own imagination (if you have one, that is). Every single thing must be spelled out or you'll cry out "plot hole" like a little bitch. A nihilist super-nerd who likes to cry about "plot holes" when there isn't mountains of exposition. Could you be any more of a cliche?

...did you enjoy all that stuff about Darth Vader's suit because it filled the "plot holes" where none of the movies adequately explained what the buttons on the chest plate were for?

MCN, why do you feel the need to become so dramatic and use 'insults' such as "little bitch"? It almost makes me want to change my mind and side with Lucien instead of you.

Lucien wrote:I asked the question, btw, because I've heard things like "There were a lot of issues" followed by "... but it's an excellent film". I've never heard that before. This actually has nothing to do with Star Wars - if someone said there were a lot of issues with any film's story and then said it was brilliant afterwards, I'd wonder why they gave the issues a free pass - where does the excellence come from?

Entertainment.

I find this whole line of thinking utterly bizarre. If you can only enjoy films you deem to be faultless, with no or very few plot holes, then there aren't many films that you truly enjoy. My favourite film ever is Jurassic Park - I LOVE it - but it's not perfect. The characters are all puddle-deep and there's the whole plot hole involving the T-Rex paddock and the 100 foot drop. I love the film regardless though, and it's an easy five stars. Five stars, 10/10, whatever, does not mean something is perfect, it is just the highest possible score, the highest praise you can give. No film is perfect.

Also everything I pointed out about A New Hope I came up with there and then. I couldn't care less about any of those made up criticisms

Lucien wrote:I asked the question, btw, because I've heard things like "There were a lot of issues" followed by "... but it's an excellent film". I've never heard that before.

Bullshit.

Skippy wrote:My favourite film ever is Jurassic Park - I LOVE it - but it's not perfect. The characters are all puddle-deep and there's the whole plot hole involving the T-Rex paddock and the 100 foot drop.

Got you covered...

Lucien wrote:Anyway, that's a wide and general question about movies in general (that's why I cut the video, unluckily Devlin caught it ) so I'll leave it there.

Too slow Lucien, too slow.

I will freely admit that I almost always look for the good in a movie. strawberry float I even came out of Spider-Man 3 trying to defend it. :lol:

That opinion lasted about a day when I had to admit to myself that it was utter trash.

I'm not bothered by minor inconsistencies and plot holes (Of which there are a couple in Force Awakens, but nothing huge) and I can generally overlook them if I'm entertained enough. If it hadn't been as good as I felt it was I'd maybe be asking more questions and being more critical of it. But I've been to see it five times now and everytime I walk out of the cinema I've got a massive grin on my face. I said this after my first viewing and I still feel the same way about it, but the problems are so minor for me as to be almost not worth mentioning.

To me that Youtube video symbolises everything that's wrong with modern pop-culture, especially online. Nothing is allowed to just be what it is. It all has to critically examined, reduced down to its component elements and ripped to bits. It's the reason I absolutely hated those RLM reviews of the prequel trilogy (Aside from the guys stupid strawberry floating voice). it's a culture of systematically sucking the joy out absolutely ever moment by pointing out every flaw, inconsistency and mistake no matter how minor it is. Well strawberry float that. Nothing is perfect and I'd rather live in a world where I can overlook some stuff and enjoy myself rather than be utterly miserable because nothing lives up to these impossible standards that I've set.

EDIT: That's not directed at you Lucien by the way. :lol:

Skippy wrote:If the original Star Wars was released today people would complain about it in a similar way

"I wish they'd explained more about about the Clone Wars and the relationship between Kenobi and Luke's dad, that sounded interesting and it would have given us a better understanding of the political state of the galaxy."

"Luke is such a horrible character. He just bitches and moans and then the film just completely drops the fact his aunt and uncle were murdered after about 30 seconds. It's like he doesn't care, what a gooseberry fool!?"

"Why does Luke implicitly trust this Ben Kenobi character when at the start he only describes him as a 'strange old hermit'?"

"So Luke is a pilot sometimes and flies around Tatooine, so why is so good in an X-Wing? It's a complete different vehicle, and he's good enough to mae the trench run when all but like two other pilots are killed? Doesn't make any sense."

"This 'Force' thing is just so convenient. Written yourself into a corner? Oh yeah, The Force will sort that out."

"Vader is such a shallow character. Good look, big booming voice but he doesn't actually do much. Obi-Wan lets him win and then he gets shot and spins off at the end like a little bitch lol"

"Peter Cushing's character was wasted. It's like the script's entire character description was 'British villain archetype'."

"How are we supposed to fear for the main characters' safety when the Stormtroopers can't shoot for gooseberry fool? Robs the movie of any tension during the Death Star escape"

"Luke swinging over that big gap with Leia holding on to him was such a cliché. What is this, an Eroll Flynn movie?"

"I hope someone starts a parody Twitter account for the Catina Band, the bar dude's arm or Owen and Beru's burnt corpses lol"

And so on. It's mostly because the internet has given a small group of nerds who want to know everything, every little detail about a film or game's lore, the kind of people that read and write Wookiepedia entries, it's given them a better platform for their cries to be heard. They're still overwhelmingly in the minority, but its a minority studios know they can absolutely cash in on with expanded universe books and comics.

Bravo. Great post.

Yeah but that might be because that film is straight up gash

Don't know if anyone has seen this.

Young Harrison Ford:

Adam Driver:

Pretty good casting actually. It's just hard to see when compared to old Solo.

Lucien wrote:The only thing I want to throw out there is the majority of people who don't like... any film... are not a bunch of nerds looking for things to hate. At least I don't believe that, and I'm certainly not - I tend to rate movies higher than other people, though next to none get 9's or 10's.

Terminator: Genysis as an example - Skippy's and my opinion vastly differ on that. He literally (no offence here Skippy, not intending to have a go) wants that series to die, but I don't consider him a super nerd at all.

As Dan. said, that isn't a great example as Genysis is awful.

There will certainly be people out there that hated The Force Awakens for no other reason than they disliked the movie. And there will be those that hate it because they hate anything popular or because they like to pick apart movies that don't need picking apart.

I am not a massive Star Wars fan but I am having trouble understanding why people that like Star Wars dislike or hate The Force Awakens. I can't think of anything (other than petty little gripes) in the movie that would cause a fan of the series to dislike this one.

STAR WARS: The Force Awakens Thread (All discussion and spoilers in here)

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