^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^

Fed up talking videogames? Why?
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Preezy
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by Preezy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:01 pm

More annoyances:

- Where were the Knights of Ren? That vision that Rey had in TFA was cool and the Knights of Ren were hinted at as being his disciples or special Sith Squad™, but nope there's zero mention of them at all. Maybe they'll get shown in the final part of the trilogy but introducing them, establishing them, giving something to do and then getting rid of them in 1 film would be a bit gooseberry fool. They should have been introduced in TFA. Lame.

- Rey's lineage - what a strawberry floating anti-climax. The speculation was that she might have been a descendant of Kenobi, or maybe another Skywalker, or Palpatine etc, but nope, child of junkers. No backstory. Such a wasted opportunity to make her background cool.

- The Porgs. Whilst they weren't as annoying as I thought they'd be, they existed purely to be something that Disney can now sell to kids. They were completely superfluous to the plot. At least the Ewoks took casualties and played a part on Endor.

- The custodians on Luke's island - so they're his slaves? Where do they live? They weren't anywhere to be seen at the end of TFA or when Rey's initially following Luke around the island as he drinks walrus milk and catches fish, but then all of a sudden these nuns appear to fix holes in the wall and wash Luke's undercrackers.

- The opening joke with Poe and Hux on the intercom, tonally didn't start the film off in a good way. We're supposed to be experiencing this tense evacuation of a base and the counter-attack against a Dreadnought and Poe's cracking jokes. Reminded me of the jarring opening to Revenge of the Sith when there's a decapitation mixed in with droids slipping on oil. Terrible :fp:

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by DML » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:11 pm

Preezy wrote:More annoyances:

- Rey's lineage - what a strawberry floating anti-climax. The speculation was that she might have been a descendant of Kenobi, or maybe another Skywalker, or Palpatine etc, but nope, child of junkers. No backstory. Such a wasted opportunity to make her background cool.


This was actually one of the best things of the film for me, a proper surprise and the end of the boring 'everyone is linked by the force'. Far from being a waste I thought it set a precedent that you shouldn't always be expecting someone to have a past.

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by Alvin Flummux » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:12 pm

Preezy wrote:- Where were the Knights of Ren? That vision that Rey had in TFA was cool and the Knights of Ren were hinted at as being his disciples or special Sith Squad™, but nope there's zero mention of them at all. Maybe they'll get shown in the final part of the trilogy but introducing them, establishing them, giving something to do and then getting rid of them in 1 film would be a bit gooseberry fool. They should have been introduced in TFA. Lame.


I assume the Knights have only so far been referenced because to add them in too would just overcrowd the villain team - having too many big bad characters would be detrimental to the story.

I can only assume that, now Snoke is out of the way, the Knights of Ren will fill the gigantic void he left.

Preezy wrote:- The Porgs. Whilst they weren't as annoying as I thought they'd be, they existed purely to be something that Disney can now sell to kids. They were completely superfluous to the plot. At least the Ewoks took casualties and played a part on Endor.


The Porgs exist because the film crew couldn't keep the puffins on the island from getting in the way.

Preezy wrote:- The custodians on Luke's island - so they're his slaves? Where do they live? They weren't anywhere to be seen at the end of TFA or when Rey's initially following Luke around the island as he drinks walrus milk and catches fish, but then all of a sudden these nuns appear to fix holes in the wall and wash Luke's undercrackers.


They take care of the structures built by the First Jedi, presumably it's a cultural tradition thing for them. I assume they live in similar buildings out of sight, or in the island's cave system.

Preezy wrote:- The opening joke with Poe and Hux on the intercom, tonally didn't start the film off in a good way. We're supposed to be experiencing this tense evacuation of a base and the counter-attack against a Dreadnought and Poe's cracking jokes.


It was pretty funny to me, but I didn't feel like it needed to be at the beginning of the film. They could've done it a bit later on, after the hyperjump, and been fine.

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by Frank » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:27 pm

Preezy wrote:At least the Ewoks took casualties and played a part on Endor.


I thought that's why people didn't like the ewoks :shifty:

Also all that complaining but nothing about Admiral Holdo being terrible.

I liked Rose, too :shifty: But it would've been a much better film if Finn had died at the end rather than her coming in to save him. His whole character arc is pretty much "the first order are unbeatable let's run away" so it would've been interesting to see him do something like that and be the only person not running away and saving the day (especially after he beats Phasma up so his main antagonist is gone, too). Instead it just wimpers out with the last few rebels squeezing into the Falcon and running away.

I think the biggest weakness with this trilogy is that there's obviously no overall arc laid out by the big Star Wars bosses. So everything that Abrams laid out as potentially interesting points for the trilogy gets overruled by Rian, and now JJ's back in charge for episode IX is he going to try and retcon everything again?

Also the ship design is proper uninspiring. The bombers were awful and the First Order are still using crappy ordinary TIE fighters :x

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by Preezy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:32 pm

Frank wrote:Also all that complaining but nothing about Admiral Holdo being terrible.

Ellie Sattler is immune to criticism, I'm sorry but Laura Dern was my first crush :lol: :wub:

Seriously though, she wasn't terrible. She didn't have to explain her plan to a lowly pilot (especially an insubordinate one that cost hundreds if not thousands of lives), and if Finn & Rose hadn't strawberry floated up with their stupid plan then Holdo's plan would have been a complete success.

I don't know why they couldn't have got a droid to do the suicide run though, didn't have to be Holdo.

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by The Watching Artist » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:56 pm

DML wrote:
Preezy wrote:More annoyances:

- Rey's lineage - what a strawberry floating anti-climax. The speculation was that she might have been a descendant of Kenobi, or maybe another Skywalker, or Palpatine etc, but nope, child of junkers. No backstory. Such a wasted opportunity to make her background cool.


This was actually one of the best things of the film for me, a proper surprise and the end of the boring 'everyone is linked by the force'. Far from being a waste I thought it set a precedent that you shouldn't always be expecting someone to have a past.

I agree but it would have worked better if they hadn't played up the who are her parents angle so much. It also could have explained why she is so super awesome at everything all the time. But no she is just a nobody who can do Jedi mind tricks without ever seeing them done before and fight trained super guards better then the powerful well trained descendant of Annikin Skywalker.

I'd have had her be the younger sister of one of Lukes students that Kylo killed. Use that to give a bit more of a reason for why Ben was struggling (maybe a love triangle*) rather then just "Snoke did it". Might also explain the whole "what girl?" stuff whenever someone spoke about her in TFA.

*he liked Reys sister but she was with another and the jealousy is what starts to tempt him over before Snoke gets at him. Then now when Rey is older he can see the love he killed in her and it gets a bit creepy when he projects that on her but its also why he cant quite kill her. Why he keeps offering her the chance to join him. But in the end Rey will always say no because of what he did.
Preezy wrote:with their stupid plan then Holdo's plan would have been a complete success.

apart from the whole go to a planet and be destroyed unless an old guy with some gold dice turns up bit ;)

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by Errkal » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:57 pm

Vadar was from nothing so why can't Rey be.

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by Preezy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:59 pm

The Watching Artist wrote:
Preezy wrote:with their stupid plan then Holdo's plan would have been a complete success.

apart from the whole go to a planet and be destroyed unless an old guy with some gold dice turns up bit ;)

The First Order wouldn't have known they were heading to the Rebel planet if Finn and Rose hadn't been captured and sold out by the codebreaker. That was the whole point. It was a secret evacuation and their actions exposed that.

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by Poser » Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:01 pm

Preezy wrote:More annoyances:

- Where were the Knights of Ren? That vision that Rey had in TFA was cool and the Knights of Ren were hinted at as being his disciples or special Sith Squad™, but nope there's zero mention of them at all. Maybe they'll get shown in the final part of the trilogy but introducing them, establishing them, giving something to do and then getting rid of them in 1 film would be a bit gooseberry fool. They should have been introduced in TFA. Lame.



Was that not them fighting Ren and Rey in Snoke's throne room? That's certainly what I assumed.

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by Preezy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:05 pm

Poser wrote:
Preezy wrote:Was that not them fighting Ren and Rey in Snoke's throne room? That's certainly what I assumed.

No, they were just Snoke's praetorian guards or something.

One other thing - Finn was severely wounded in TFA and it was a "oh is he/isn't he going to be alright" kinda cliffhanger, but then in TLJ he's just fine, no mention of his injury or reflection on it at all by him, no mention of it by Rey when she was talking to Ren, what was the point of him getting wounded again? False peril stuff like that puts me off films so badly. He even fell off the hospital bed in a stupid slapstick way, just because that's funny right :slol:

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by The Watching Artist » Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:10 pm

Errkal wrote:Vadar was from nothing so why can't Rey be.

Anikin was a mysterious virgin birth. Its even implied that the Sith creating life have a hand in this. Rey is the daughter of a couple from Glasgow.
Preezy wrote:
The Watching Artist wrote:
Preezy wrote:with their stupid plan then Holdo's plan would have been a complete success.

apart from the whole go to a planet and be destroyed unless an old guy with some gold dice turns up bit ;)

The First Order wouldn't have known they were heading to the Rebel planet if Finn and Rose hadn't been captured and sold out by the codebreaker. That was the whole point. It was a secret evacuation and their actions exposed that.

They were heading towards a Rebel planet. I'm sure even the First Order could work that one out. Oh wait, maybe not with Hux in charge.

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by Preezy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:20 pm

The Watching Artist wrote:
Preezy wrote:The First Order wouldn't have known they were heading to the Rebel planet if Finn and Rose hadn't been captured and sold out by the codebreaker. That was the whole point. It was a secret evacuation and their actions exposed that.

They were heading towards a Rebel planet. I'm sure even the First Order could work that one out. Oh wait, maybe not with Hux in charge.

No it was explicitly said that the planet was off their course and the ships would fly past them, not at or over them.

Thought about this some more and I think one of the biggest problems with the film is that it really doesn't leave much for Abrams to do in the final part of the trilogy. Where can they go with this now? It'll be another lightsaber battle between Ren and Rey, Leia will have to be shoehorned out in some sentimental goodbye sequence (which they should have done in LTJ), there'll probably be another super-weapon that needs to be destroyed before it gets within range of somewhere (where? strawberry float knows, they'll invent a new planet). Maybe Lando will show up because reasons? As others have said, there's no overarching plan to these films and it really shows.

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by Moggy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:33 pm

Preezy wrote:- Rey's lineage - what a strawberry floating anti-climax. The speculation was that she might have been a descendant of Kenobi, or maybe another Skywalker, or Palpatine etc, but nope, child of junkers. No backstory. Such a wasted opportunity to make her background cool.


Everyone moans that “not everyone has to related to a Skywalker, Kenobi or Solo!” and then everyone moans when somebody isn’t. :lol:

There’s not really anything to say that she isn’t a Skywalker, Kenobi, Yoda or Solo though, the only person to mention her heritage was Kylo and I don’t think he is particularly trustworthy.

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by Preezy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:01 pm

Moggy wrote:Everyone moans that “not everyone has to related to a Skywalker, Kenobi or Solo!” and then everyone moans when somebody isn’t. :lol:

There’s not really anything to say that she isn’t a Skywalker, Kenobi, Yoda or Solo though, the only person to mention her heritage was Kylo and I don’t think he is particularly trustworthy.

I certainly wasn't one of the people that would have said “not everyone has to related to a Skywalker, Kenobi or Solo!”, but that's by the by.

I agree they could still have her be the love child of Lando and Yoda, it could happen but TLJ did seem to squash any speculation completely. And when you consider that the writer and director for this film won't be involved in the next film you'd have to assume that storyline is now over.

OH OH OH and one thing that I strawberry floating hated to my core was the terrible video communication that they had with that character from TFA that told them about the codebreaker (can't remember her name, Kaz? Maz?). That was awful. She must have had one of those special floaty space cameras I guess, so that it could film her from various angles in quick succession and then stay put as she rocketed away with a jetpack. Sigh. It was a like a cheap cutscene in an average videogame.

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by Return_of_the_STAR » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:05 pm

Preezy wrote:
Moggy wrote:Everyone moans that “not everyone has to related to a Skywalker, Kenobi or Solo!” and then everyone moans when somebody isn’t. :lol:

There’s not really anything to say that she isn’t a Skywalker, Kenobi, Yoda or Solo though, the only person to mention her heritage was Kylo and I don’t think he is particularly trustworthy.

I certainly wasn't one of the people that would have said “not everyone has to related to a Skywalker, Kenobi or Solo!”, but that's by the by.

I agree they could still have her be the love child of Lando and Yoda, it could happen but TLJ did seem to squash any speculation completely. And when you consider that the writer and director for this film won't be involved in the next film you'd have to assume that storyline is now over.

OH OH OH and one thing that I strawberry floating hated to my core was the terrible video communication that they had with that character from TFA that told them about the codebreaker (can't remember her name, Kaz? Maz?). That was awful. She must have had one of those special floaty space cameras I guess, so that it could film her from various angles in quick succession and then stay put as she rocketed away with a jetpack. Sigh. It was a like a cheap cutscene in an average videogame.


Although it is entirely possible that Kylo just made that all up to beat Rey down mentally so that she would join up with him.

Personally I don't think that's the case and we will never hear of or about her parents again.

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by Moggy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:07 pm

Preezy wrote:
Moggy wrote:Everyone moans that “not everyone has to related to a Skywalker, Kenobi or Solo!” and then everyone moans when somebody isn’t. :lol:

There’s not really anything to say that she isn’t a Skywalker, Kenobi, Yoda or Solo though, the only person to mention her heritage was Kylo and I don’t think he is particularly trustworthy.

I certainly wasn't one of the people that would have said “not everyone has to related to a Skywalker, Kenobi or Solo!”, but that's by the by.

I agree they could still have her be the love child of Lando and Yoda, it could happen but TLJ did seem to squash any speculation completely. And when you consider that the writer and director for this film won't be involved in the next film you'd have to assume that storyline is now over.


I never said you were one of the people that said it, but that’s what people were saying. I think it is a good thing if her parents were unknown nobodies, not everyone has to be connected.

But JJ Abrams is doing the next in the series. As he was the one to introduce Rey if he wants to make her parents important people then it would the simplest thing in the world for him to just write “Kylo Ren: “Lol I was lying about who your parents were coz I wanted to get in your pants, tee hee!”” and then he can make her parents be whoever he wants.

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by OrangeRKN » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:10 pm

Preezy wrote:More annoyances:

- Rey's lineage - what a strawberry floating anti-climax. The speculation was that she might have been a descendant of Kenobi, or maybe another Skywalker, or Palpatine etc, but nope, child of junkers. No backstory. Such a wasted opportunity to make her background cool.


DML wrote:This was actually one of the best things of the film

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by Frank » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:10 pm

It could just be one of those “Vader said you killed my father...” moments.

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by Preezy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:13 pm

Moggy wrote:But JJ Abrams is doing the next in the series. As he was the one to introduce Rey if he wants to make her parents important people then it would the simplest thing in the world for him to just write “Kylo Ren: “Lol I was lying about who your parents were coz I wanted to get in your pants, tee hee!”” and then he can make her parents be whoever he wants.

Frank wrote:It could just be one of those “Vader said you killed my father...” moments.

Yeah I guess that's true. Fair point.

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PostRe: ^|SPOILERS!|^ SW: The Last Jedi Discussion thread - ^|SPOILERS!|^
by Alvin Flummux » Thu Jan 11, 2018 4:17 pm

Poser wrote:Was that not them fighting Ren and Rey in Snoke's throne room? That's certainly what I assumed.


No, those fellas were the equivalent of the red-clad Royal Guards from RotJ.

The Knights of Ren are clad like Kylo.

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