Super Mario Bros. Wonder | NSW | 20/10/2023 | 4.3mil units sold through worldwide!

Right, all of world 1-5 and petal isles done including finding their respective special world stages.

The special stage location within world 5 was a bit obtuse given

Barnsy! wrote:

You just had to repeat the level you receive the royal seed. Especially as it's an inactive 'plot' level. You're signalled to go back there as it didn't have the blue tick. But it would be awkward feeling repeating that level even if you didn't have to, 'haha, we don't learn, we came back thanks for rescuing us again'

Yeah I found this quite odd too!

Barnsy! wrote:Right, all of world 1-5 and petal isles done including finding their respective special world stages.

The special stage location within world 5 was a bit obtuse given

You just had to repeat the level you receive the royal seed. Especially as it's an inactive 'plot' level. You're signalled to go back there as it didn't have the blue tick. But it would be awkward feeling repeating that level even if you didn't have to, 'haha, we don't learn, we came back thanks for rescuing us again'

It's not the only one either. What were they thinking

I've been playing this since Christmas, I reckon I'm about 80% through it so far.

Objectively speaking, this is an excellent game, but for some reason I'm not feeling it. SMW and SMB3 still hold the (interchangeable) crown for me.

Barnsy! wrote:

kazanova_Frankenstein wrote:I played about 3 hours of this and I don't have any motivation to return to it. I mean it's... fine, but I really expected the level transformations to be more exhilarating / fun than just wacky.

I do enjoy the talking flowers though, so no regrets.

Sorry to read it's not quite clicking with you yet Kaz.

I do hope you stick with it, but where's there's some games I'd say 'carry on, it gets better', whilst the best is yet to come; 3 hours in you have a pretty good taste of what this game is about (you don't have to plough through super easy levels to get to moderately challenging one's (but probably not the 5 star one's yet), you've seen the map, some of the more wonder seeds are quite early on and you probably have a good feel of the overall game). You're not wrong the wonder seeds can be a bit hit and miss, some being more spectacle than exhilarating gameplay.

If you're fundamentally not into 2D Mario, the wonder seeds alone are unlikely to change this for you. Enjoyed the new Mario Bros games but knew they could be better camp here. For me, in terms of how it looks, plays, attention to detail and creatively this is everything I could hope for a 2D Mario. Weird is the theme with this game and I love it. Nintendo apply changes to 2D Mario so incrementally, but they've really done a lot to refresh the formula here. Wonder seeds are of course the most obvious shake up, but I appreciate what they've done with the map, the expressive little stretch-and-play-dreamworks-style-character animations, level background details etc. I'd also say take away the wonder seeds and the base conventional levels are still more fun than the other 2D Mario games.

I just want to say that your in depth reply motivated me to pick this game up again yesterday. I have put another couple of hours in to it (I’m now part way through world 3), and I’m starting to really enjoy it. So thanks!

It certainly feels best played in small doses, but that’s no bad thing. It’s not like I’m going to forget the story or the controls if I put it down for a week (something that terrifies me with 75% of the games I play).

And I still love the talking flowers. Every. Damn. Word.

kazanova_Frankenstein wrote:.
I just want to say that your in depth reply motivated me to pick this game up again yesterday. I have put another couple of hours in to it (I’m now part way through world 3), and I’m starting to really enjoy it. So thanks!

It certainly feels best played in small doses, but that’s no bad thing. It’s not like I’m going to forget the story or the controls if I put it down for a week (something that terrifies me with 75% of the games I play).

And I still love the talking flowers. Every. Damn. Word.

Happy to hear you've picked it up again and are enjoying it.

It is great to play in small doses. I also like quick little bursts of the game and yes it does lend itself nicely to playing a quick couple of levels. I basically don't want this game to end (and there does seem to be way more levels in this game than other new Mario Bros games? But I maybe wrong about that). I like playing a quick 10 minutes really early in the morning whilst drinking my first coffee and just having a little moment with myself before I start my day. This game just makes me feel really happy.

You mentioned you was really into 1991 Mario World (as I am too - no nostalgia here, I first played it in 2020 and the game is pure class. Mario World is clearly more than Mario Bros 4 - Mario World is to 2D Mario what Odyssey is to 3D Mario) I get why Wonder might not have grabbed you at first. The thing is Wonder clearly has ambitions greater than being another New Bros, it's a complete reinvigoration of 2D Mario and different enough that it could be its own thing, but it tethers itself to the constraints of Bros games; it would be healthier to think of itself as a spiritual successor to Mario World (i.e. lose the "Bros" and just call it Mario Wonder). I played all the new Mario Bros games in the space of a year and a bit. I don't dislike them but the new Bros are very sterile, uninspired safe and formulaic. All with basically the same aesthetic, with little individual identity. Almost deliberately so. Rather than just being an evolution of the Bros games Mario's whole linage is apparent in Wonder. I would say Wonder draws more inspiration from fan created Mario Maker levels than Nintendo's own New Bros games, taking conventional 2D levels and applying foundational Mario platforming building blocks in weirder and more creative ways. You can see lots of traces of 3D World in here which I really like.

The wonder flowers are the big talking point of game and nice deviations; stretching and twisting the traditional levels into potentially anything not even confined within the realms of still being a 2D platformer, but even if one does indeed just want another Mario Bros game, its strengths as a straight Mario platformer in such oversaturated market also shouldn't be overlooked. Take away the wonder seeds you still have really tightly crafted level design, tons of personality, a diverse move set thanks to the badges, really lively animations, responsive controls (not too floaty etc) and has a real focus on discovery and innovation.

100% completion

Yeah final-final level was tough after losing like 100lives I missed the golden flag pole. Just messed up with the pressure. So lost the check points then had to do whole level again. Thing is because I had to repeat each section so many times, I got the level down and blasted through it pretty quickly through muscle memory. Good level but basing arguably one of the toughest levels in any Mario game around the games built in easy / assist mode the badges (which I hardly used in the game upto then). It's arguably harder than the last level in 3D World, but also maybe more forgiving and I'd say less fun- I have real affection for 3D World final level and still replay that one level- not sure I will with final-final level.

The special stages were the best in the game, but though all 5 star difficulty there was a real variance in difficulty between those stages - the jump to the beat one was my favourite and took me a few tries. The others not so much. I really liked the one with rolling ball on timed platforms too and the singing Piranha plant one.

The one where you play as the Goomba was my least fave special stage, so sluggish to move (I get that's the point). Like it was alright in the earlier in the game the level being recontextulised such that things which weren't a challenge for Mario are now major hurdles for him as a Goomba, quite interesting idea and as there are so many levels, not every wonder seeds has to be a banger. But when there's a limited number of special stages to base one around the games most boring gimmick. I did it two goes, only messed up the first because I was bored so was 'rushing' through it then had to repeat the whole level!

Great game though obviously.

I never completed the final final level but if I finally did and didn't make the flag pole I think I would properly lose it

Despite the game not doing much for me it's still nice to read Barnsy's and others' enthusiastic posts about it. I've been playing a couple of levels at a time (mainly because that's all I can tolerate at a time unfortunately) just because I'm so close to the end anyway.

Have just done the first three Bowser levels and they're probably some of the best so far. The electricity one was great and the wonder seed might be the first to make me properly Yay with delight - partly because of the surprise but also because of the banging music (I do not like the Wonder seed music much in general!)

Also I liked the slime being used more than once in the mushroom stages - nice to get to know a gimmick instead of it just being a one-and-done spectacle, though I realise this is probably anti-The Whole Point!

deathofcows wrote:Despite the game not doing much for me it's still nice to read Barnsy's and others' enthusiastic posts about it. I've been playing a couple of levels at a time (mainly because that's all I can tolerate at a time unfortunately) just because I'm so close to the end anyway.

Have just done the first three Bowser levels and they're probably some of the best so far. The electricity one was great and the wonder seed might be the first to make me properly Yay with delight - partly because of the surprise but also because of the banging music (I do not like the Wonder seed music much in general!)

Also I liked the slime being used more than once in the mushroom stages - nice to get to know a gimmick instead of it just being a one-and-done spectacle, though I realise this is probably anti-The Whole Point!

The bowser levels were good. Some of the flying battle ship ones - not so much (the hit the conveyor belt button once to break the machine being used in multiple levels = pointless).

Did you get to the final pre-credits boss - nothing overly challenging, but fairly interesting idea and a bit different - I liked it.

Sorry to read it wasn't a complete hit for you. Reading earlier replies in this thread there's people after having played a handful of levels either saying they loved or dislike it quite strongly. It's funny - you really know how you feel about this game with very little time and I don't really have anything much more insightful to say about the game than "I love it and just do", the opposite view is equally valid.

Gameplay aside what did you think of the aesthetic and general vibe of Wonder. It's interesting you like Yoshi story (as I do) but not Wonder so much, can I infer you like Yoshi Story more because of the vibe more than the gameplay? And does Wonder not evoke similar feelings? Wonder might not be deepest experience gameplay wise, but the game just imbues joy and I just find it really comforting to hang out in this world. Wonder seems to have picked up the baton from the Mario Movie, giving Wonder's Mario real emphasis on cartoony animation and expressive character, in the same way that NSMBU informed the aesthetic for Mario 3D World and the Wii U Mario sports game (which I found a little bland) I hope the 'Disneyfied' feel, vibe and look of Wonder is carried over to the other Mario games.

I have really come around on this. It’s great for playing the odd 45 mins to an hour. In fact, I’m going to do that right now.

This game is brilliant Nintendo had a banger year last year but this was the number 1 game from them for me in 2023.

Wonder if they will add DLC, would love new maps and badges

I finally did the final final level on this last night. The final section was particularly frustrating, it took me a couple of days and in that time my other half described me as “emotionally distant” I also missed the flagpole on my first go and had to repeat. But I did it pretty much straight away. A really good game and it’s nice that it is accessible for everyone. My son, who has just gone 2, managed to play the first level with me, which is his first foray into computer games. I’m glad they’ve changed the art style but would still like them to go a bit more removed from the New style in the next one.

Barnsy! wrote:

deathofcows wrote:Despite the game not doing much for me it's still nice to read Barnsy's and others' enthusiastic posts about it. I've been playing a couple of levels at a time (mainly because that's all I can tolerate at a time unfortunately) just because I'm so close to the end anyway.

Have just done the first three Bowser levels and they're probably some of the best so far. The electricity one was great and the wonder seed might be the first to make me properly Yay with delight - partly because of the surprise but also because of the banging music (I do not like the Wonder seed music much in general!)

Also I liked the slime being used more than once in the mushroom stages - nice to get to know a gimmick instead of it just being a one-and-done spectacle, though I realise this is probably anti-The Whole Point!

The bowser levels were good. Some of the flying battle ship ones - not so much (the hit the conveyor belt button once to break the machine being used in multiple levels = pointless).

Did you get to the final pre-credits boss - nothing overly challenging, but fairly interesting idea and a bit different - I liked it.

Sorry to read it wasn't a complete hit for you. Reading earlier replies in this thread there's people after having played a handful of levels either saying they loved or dislike it quite strongly. It's funny - you really know how you feel about this game with very little time and I don't really have anything much more insightful to say about the game than "I love it and just do", the opposite view is equally valid.

Gameplay aside what did you think of the aesthetic and general vibe of Wonder. It's interesting you like Yoshi story (as I do) but not Wonder so much, can I infer you like Yoshi Story more because of the vibe more than the gameplay? And does Wonder not evoke similar feelings? Wonder might not be deepest experience gameplay wise, but the game just imbues joy and I just find it really comforting to hang out in this world. Wonder seems to have picked up the baton from the Mario Movie, giving Wonder's Mario real emphasis on cartoony animation and expressive character, in the same way that NSMBU informed the aesthetic for Mario 3D World and the Wii U Mario sports game (which I found a little bland) I hope the 'Disneyfied' feel, vibe and look of Wonder is carried over to the other Mario games.

You're absolutely right with the undeniability (?) of just loving something, it just working on you.

On that note, I'm not 100% I'll get this right, as I know I don't really care for the game, but might be mistaken as to why exactly. Often I find these things are pretty tight Venn diagrams - i.e. I love Mario 64 and Sunshine so you'd think I'd be in the cohort of People Who Like 3D Mario Games but don't like Galaxy when everyone else did - I guess we were liking slightly different things! Recently I've been playing Sonic 2 and comparing it to the same level equivalents in Sonic Mania, and like the new ones less which sounds mad I know. But I guess the just-so of games I like is more specific (and fragile?) than it might seem you know? I literally can feel my eyes glaze over slightly in disinterest in Mania compared to Sonic 2 (is it the slightly numbing over-fullness of the more garish sounding remixes? Is it the increased visual fullness and animation detail in general that takes away some of the crisp, punchy purity and clarity? Is it the lonelier empty space of same-sized sonic in widescreen format? Or something else?!)

Anyway wrt: Yoshi's Story vs Mario Wonder my theories might be something like:

I don't just like Yoshi's story for the vibes, I think it plays great and gamefeel here is very important! I think the frenzied tap-a-tap run animation looks great and has great acceleration, and the lean-back of Yoshi when running/jumping gives real sense of forward momentum. There's also a great sense of (variable) hang-time in the jumps without feeling floaty. And the end-jump flutter feels powerful and like another lilt instead of just a jump-extension. Also the tongue is quick and snappy and the tongue-stuff like the gulp of fruit or those red balls that fling you spinning feel great in terms of platforming machinery. Etc. etc. There's just an immediate sense of right-on rightness to the gamefeel which automatically has me sold.

I also think it's aesthetically great. The Yoshi proportions are cool with their over-sized sneakers and this really adds to the gamefeel too due to the animation. The colour combos are rad. I really like the slightly lo-fi charm of the sprites a la DKC. The backgrounds looks great with real solidity and character. The music is cool and has bright vibes without being too twee (except for the sing-song bits maybe?) - there's also surprising stuff like the Hip-Hop rap stuff in the urban sewer-type levels and so on. For whatever reason it works for me.

Mario Wonder I suppose looks similar in terms of it being bright and colourful and feel-good, but for whatever reason I find myself zoning out with disinterest. I'm not sure if it's the decreased emphasis on bread-and-butter platforming compared to fidgets and gimmicks. Or the fact the platforming is less weighty and momentum-based (and I think of fun platformers as basically momentum-management) with its lighter, sprightly jump, which makes it feel less engaging to me in the moment. Or maybe its that the levels are so fleeting you don't get a chance to bed in to half of the ideas. Or maybe its just that things feel thinner with the pogo-stick boing of the goofier sound effects. Or the slight flatness to the look which has some great colour and so on, but still feels a little tile-y and rigid to me? Or maybe it's the purple streak throughout the whole thing that looks a bit garish to me, or the annoying Wonder flower music that feels like carnival Zany... etc etc.

I couldn't definitively pinpoint The Thing (though I suspect momentum and music might be part of it) because just as it works on you, rendering everything into joyous, obvious, of-course-ness - because it leaves me cold the separate things don't come together in that way that you know you like when you feel it.

My point is: Yoshi's Story has an all-time platforming gamefeel okay

Sorry for long reply!

deathofcows wrote:

Barnsy! wrote:

deathofcows wrote:Mario Wonder I suppose looks similar in terms of it being bright and colourful and feel-good, but for whatever reason I find myself zoning out with disinterest. I'm not sure if it's the decreased emphasis on bread-and-butter platforming compared to fidgets and gimmicks. Or the fact the platforming is less weighty and momentum-based (and I think of fun platformers as basically momentum-management) with its lighter, sprightly jump, which makes it feel less engaging to me in the moment. Or maybe its that the levels are so fleeting you don't get a chance to bed in to half of the ideas. Or maybe its just that things feel thinner with the pogo-stick boing of the goofier sound effects. Or the slight flatness to the look which has some great colour and so on, but still feels a little tile-y and rigid to me? Or maybe it's the purple streak throughout the whole thing that looks a bit garish to me, or the annoying Wonder flower music that feels like carnival Zany... etc etc.

>don't get a chance to bed in to half of the ideas.
It's this, but also there's generally a lot happening on screen at once, particularly during Wonder sections. But in a lot of cases you just keep moving forward in one direction, often invulnerable to any threats, while the screen bombards you with stimuli, without much time to register what's even happening that you just kinda get numb to it. Perhaps it's our adult minds no longer having that wonder and knowing it's not worth investing interest into.

The wonder is the flowers you meet along the way.

Billbones84 wrote:I final section was particularly frustrating, it took me a couple of days and in that time my other half described me as “emotionally distant” .

Congrats yeah last level was pretty touch

]

deathofcows wrote:.

Thanks for a great and thoughtful post.

Doesn't take anything away from my enjoyment of Wonder but fair points and makes me appreciate Yoshi Story even more.

Really enjoyed reading that.

I'm right at the very end - Badge Marathon

I've reached the invisibility stage, and I'm not certain I'll have the patience for it. (I actually think it's a bit cheap sticking this stage of any so far after the last checkpoint.)

I'm really not enjoying it anymore, it's just frustrating. And I genuinely worry that if I somehow do it I'll miss the flag pole or final 10 coin. I think I'd cry.

PuppetBoy wrote:I'm right at the very end - Badge Marathon

I've reached the invisibility stage, and I'm not certain I'll have the patience for it. (I actually think it's a bit cheap sticking this stage of any so far after the last checkpoint.)

I'm really not enjoying it anymore, it's just frustrating. And I genuinely worry that if I somehow do it I'll miss the flag pole or final 10 coin. I think I'd cry.

Well done.

Been there with missing the flag pole! I have never been so angry at a game!

Right, you got this!

1. Remember that emoji button you never use (the X button I think) tap that and it will give you your position. Remember your character will be in the centre of the screen anyway.
2. When you finally get to the pole, you've done the hard bit. But step away from the Switch a minute, get a glass of water, take a breath! You likely too happy to see end in sight, pissed off or adrenalised. Calm down a sec it's easy. No rush - jump on the bouncy thing when you get a flat bit (not a corner)

I will never ever replay that last level.