Brexit

Fed up talking videogames? Why?

Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?

Remain a member of the European Union
206
79%
Leave the European Union
54
21%
 
Total votes: 260
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Photek
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PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:10 am

lex-man wrote:
Photek wrote:
lex-man wrote:Why is the apple thing necessary? Is it just that they would leave if they had to pay extra tax in Ireland.

if The EU force Apple to pay the €13bn they could leave and move to another low tax country which would mean a massive deficit to the Irish Economy.


But they need a base in Europe and they're not going to do any better than Ireland. They might as well stay.

It's the small end of a strawberry floating huge wedge. We have to be seen to fight for our sovereign tax laws so the Googles, Facebooks, Twitter, Pfizer and Linkedin's boosting our economy have confidence that we will maintain our corporate tax rate.

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Errkal
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PostRe: Brexit
by Errkal » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:10 am

Moggy wrote:
lex-man wrote:
Photek wrote:
lex-man wrote:Why is the apple thing necessary? Is it just that they would leave if they had to pay extra tax in Ireland.

if The EU force Apple to pay the €13bn they could leave and move to another low tax country which would mean a massive deficit to the Irish Economy.


But they need a base in Europe and they're not going to do any better than Ireland. They might as well stay.


Ireland have one of the lowest corporate tax rates in Europe, but others are very close to it and would become very attractive if Ireland increased their rates.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_rates_in_Europe


They wouldn't need to increase the rate, just charge apple that rate.

Isn't the issue here that Apple is being charged something like a 2% rate because they are Apple. It isn't that the EU want Ireland to up the rate, just to ensure they charge everyone the same rate making the system fair.

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lex-man
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PostRe: Brexit
by lex-man » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:17 am

Moggy wrote:
lex-man wrote:
Photek wrote:
lex-man wrote:Why is the apple thing necessary? Is it just that they would leave if they had to pay extra tax in Ireland.

if The EU force Apple to pay the €13bn they could leave and move to another low tax country which would mean a massive deficit to the Irish Economy.


But they need a base in Europe and they're not going to do any better than Ireland. They might as well stay.


Ireland have one of the lowest corporate tax rates in Europe, but others are very close to it and would become very attractive if Ireland increased their rates.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_rates_in_Europe


Wouldn't the EU just go after Iceland. Also could Apple get enough skilled people to relocate to Iceland?

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:20 am

Errkal wrote:
Moggy wrote:
lex-man wrote:
Photek wrote:
lex-man wrote:Why is the apple thing necessary? Is it just that they would leave if they had to pay extra tax in Ireland.

if The EU force Apple to pay the €13bn they could leave and move to another low tax country which would mean a massive deficit to the Irish Economy.


But they need a base in Europe and they're not going to do any better than Ireland. They might as well stay.


Ireland have one of the lowest corporate tax rates in Europe, but others are very close to it and would become very attractive if Ireland increased their rates.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_rates_in_Europe


They wouldn't need to increase the rate, just charge apple that rate.

Isn't the issue here that Apple is being charged something like a 2% rate because they are Apple. It isn't that the EU want Ireland to up the rate, just to ensure they charge everyone the same rate making the system fair.


Ahh I misunderstood.

It's not like Ireland are the only country to ignore big companies tax though. I guess the Irish government sees it as a positive overall and have decided that it's best for their economy. If they started charging Apple the proper rate, then another EU nation might tempt Apple with a better deal than Ireland was then offering.

It's wrong though, no company should get away with avoiding tax just because they are big, when smaller businesses and individuals have no choice.

I guess to stop it you'd have to have an EU wide ruling on tax rates/tax collection rules.

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Errkal
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PostRe: Brexit
by Errkal » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:22 am

Moggy wrote:
Errkal wrote:
Moggy wrote:
lex-man wrote:
Photek wrote:
lex-man wrote:Why is the apple thing necessary? Is it just that they would leave if they had to pay extra tax in Ireland.

if The EU force Apple to pay the €13bn they could leave and move to another low tax country which would mean a massive deficit to the Irish Economy.


But they need a base in Europe and they're not going to do any better than Ireland. They might as well stay.


Ireland have one of the lowest corporate tax rates in Europe, but others are very close to it and would become very attractive if Ireland increased their rates.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_rates_in_Europe


They wouldn't need to increase the rate, just charge apple that rate.

Isn't the issue here that Apple is being charged something like a 2% rate because they are Apple. It isn't that the EU want Ireland to up the rate, just to ensure they charge everyone the same rate making the system fair.


Ahh I misunderstood.

It's not like Ireland are the only country to ignore big companies tax though. I guess the Irish government sees it as a positive overall and have decided that it's best for their economy. If they started charging Apple the proper rate, then another EU nation might tempt Apple with a better deal than Ireland was then offering.

It's wrong though, no company should get away with avoiding tax just because they are big, when smaller businesses and individuals have no choice.

I guess to stop it you'd have to have an EU wide ruling on tax rates/tax collection rules.


Yeah you would need a rule that says you have to charge your tax rate, which I imagine will follow from this ruling.

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Rocsteady
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PostRe: Brexit
by Rocsteady » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:48 am

Photek wrote:Well it's how I feel. Collating right wing opinion with a government in power is disingenuous. It's also the typical argument from the right, the 'what aboutism' is truly the most vacuous of all.

Now I don't claim that the Republic is a haven nation, I have major problems with the Housing Crisis, the HSE, the gooseberry fool show of Irish Water and the current Garda enquiry but you said pick a country at random and they will have right wing policies about curbing migrants, I gave you 2 countries off the top of my head and the best you have is to say that 8% of the German electorate holds the same views.

We all have racists, there is no nation on earth that doesn't have the banana splits but if that document is an indication of the mindset of the UK government who I must stress again are in power, then I feel strongly that they shouldn't be part of the EU. Whether or not they can legally enact such policies is not the point. I'd also point out that the Conservatives are power sharing with the DUP who are massively Anti Abortion and Anti Gay Marriage.

As for the Apple thing, that's a completely different argument but I support the Irish Government because it benefits RoI massively.

This is ridiculously stupid and I'm not wasting anymore time on it beyond this: i said likely, eg not implying every single nation. Germany thus has a larger far right party than the UK. You're ignorant to many eastern EU countries' policies and rhetoric if you think even the implementation of this document would amount to further right policies than already exist within the Union.

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Photek
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PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:52 am

What about the Eastern European countries?

Good job man. :wub:

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Grumpy David
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PostRe: Brexit
by Grumpy David » Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:09 pm

Didn't France have the National Front get into final 2 presidential candidates? That's pretty right wing.

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lex-man
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PostRe: Brexit
by lex-man » Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:26 pm

Grumpy David wrote:Didn't France have the National Front get into final 2 presidential candidates? That's pretty right wing.


Austria almost elected a far right leader. It shows the popularity of the far right parties by percentage of vote.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 43816.html

bear
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PostRe: Brexit
by bear » Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:32 pm

The main differences between Ireland and some other European countries is that the angry, deliberately misled class of voters have been targeted by far left parties like AAA/PBP/Solidarity/whatever new horseshit label they are now operating under in an attempt to suck that states teat dry and that we simply haven't had a Farage or Le Pen style politician who has been able to exploit mistrust of foreigners. As much as I'd like to think that mistrust isn't there the unfortunate truth is that there's a vein of it waiting to be exploited. Ian O'Doherty and Kevin Myers have built lucrative careers out of being arseholes who "tell it like it is". If people like that decided they'd make more by engaging in politics then their profile would give them a decent chance of being elected.

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Photek
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PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:42 pm

bear wrote:The main differences between Ireland and some other European countries is that the angry, deliberately misled class of voters have been targeted by far left parties like AAA/PBP/Solidarity/whatever new horseshit label they are now operating under in an attempt to suck that states teat dry and that we simply haven't had a Farage or Le Pen style politician who has been able to exploit mistrust of foreigners. As much as I'd like to think that mistrust isn't there the unfortunate truth is that there's a vein of it waiting to be exploited. Ian O'Doherty and Kevin Myers have built lucrative careers out of being arseholes who "tell it like it is". If people like that decided they'd make more by engaging in politics then their profile would give them a decent chance of being elected.

It's been tried a few times with terrible results. Remember Renua? :lol:

I take your point though, as I said we have racist wankers about but I'd be extremely surprised if they garnered more support than a FF, FG or ultra left independent.

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bear
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PostRe: Brexit
by bear » Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:08 pm

Depends where they run really. Mattie McGrath has a very conservative set of views and it hasn't stopped him getting elected for decades. Fianna Fàil were practically silent during the gay marriage referendum and I'd say that fear of having to be the party to introduce more liberal abortion laws in 2018 is a good part of the reason they haven't collapsed the current government despite multiple chances to do so. They are still a conservative party at heart.

Dublin is booming again but there's an awful lot of the country still struggling and having insanely Dublin-focused ministers like Shane Ross, who is basically the Dublin equivalent of a Healy-Rae, in positions of power is a powerful accelerant for anger in those areas. AAA/PBP won't thrive in those areas so there are seats there waiting for "they took our jobs".

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Photek
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PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:38 pm

What does Shane Ross actually do? During the Bus and Rail Strikes he did absolutely FA. I take the point most are 'Dublin Focused' but more than half the population is in Dublin and surrounding counties. I like the cut of Varadkars gib these days but christ almighty the housing here is mental.

I bought a house months before the Government and central bank destroyed the market with the partial deregulation of deposits needed for a house and the idiots in the Dail giving first time buyers a €10k grant for new builds not foreseeing that the developers would simply increase the price by €10k. My house has gone up 30% in price and I'm not in it a year yet. :fp:

Congrats in the Hurling btw.

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bear
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PostRe: Brexit
by bear » Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:07 pm

Photek wrote:What does Shane Ross actually do? During the Bus and Rail Strikes he did absolutely FA. I take the point most are 'Dublin Focused' but more than half the population is in Dublin and surrounding counties. I like the cut of Varadkars gib these days but christ almighty the housing here is mental.


Congrats in the Hurling btw.

Cheers.


I absolutely understand the need for Dublin to be the centrepiece of the governments economic plans and I think most people get that. The problem with Ross is that he can't seem to disguise the fact that he believes that Ireland outside the M50 simply exists to provide plumbers and burger flippers for those inside the M50.

"I went for spin around Kerry in the back of my good mate Danny's Corolla and I now understand the needs of the people of Kerry"

For strawberry floats sake.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:21 pm

We should have an Irish politics thread.

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Photek
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PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:03 pm

Moggy wrote:We should have an Irish politics thread.

:lol:

Sorry man.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:19 pm

Photek wrote:
Moggy wrote:We should have an Irish politics thread.

:lol:

Sorry man.


It wasn't a criticism, it was a suggestion. There are enough Irish people (plus plastic ones like me!) that might find it interesting.

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KK
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PostRe: Brexit
by KK » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:08 pm

Right enough of this Irish nonsense, back to the Tories having a shitty 24 hours...

According to Sky News' Mark Kleinman today a number of big companies have basically told the government to faaaark off and are refusing to sign a letter backing the government’s Brexit strategy.

And in tonight's Evening Standard, Dominic Grieve (Conservative former attorney general) has said that no proper sovereign parliament would ever pass the EU withdrawal bill in its current form.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:30 pm

KK wrote:Right enough of this Irish nonsense, back to the Tories having a shitty 24 hours...

According to Sky News' Mark Kleinman today a number of big companies have basically told the government to faaaark off and are refusing to sign a letter backing the government’s Brexit strategy.

And in tonight's Evening Standard, Dominic Grieve (Conservative former attorney general) has said that no proper sovereign parliament would ever pass the EU withdrawal bill in its current form.



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Hexx
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PostRe: Brexit
by Hexx » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:20 pm

EU meeting minutes with basically the top boys complaining about how lazy Davis is :D



(We're so strawberry floated)

Last edited by Hexx on Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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