Brexit

NickSCFC wrote:Looks increasingly like we won't get a deal.

Come 2019 we'll be at a point where we have to walk away with "No deal" and I don't see a single MP voting for that.

All that will come from this will be the UK remaining in the EU with it's reputation damaged.

NickSCFC wrote:Looks increasingly like we won't get a deal.

Come 2019 we'll be at a point where we have to walk away with "No deal" and I don't see a single MP voting for that.

All that will come from this will be the UK remaining in the EU with it's reputation damaged.

Parliament and Brexit

A thread.

There are assertions that the UK Parliament can (somehow) stop Brexit, or can vote down a "no deal" Brexit.

The UK parliament cannot, by itself, stop Brexit or vote down a "no deal" Brexit.

UK parliament has no ultimate control of Brexit process.

It lost control with the Article 50 notification.

Cannot now take back control.

The Article 50 notification, which was cheered and clapped by many, was in fact the UK surrendering any control of the Brexit process.

The UK will now, by simple operation of law, cease to be a member of the EU on 29 March 2019.

(Or another date, if agreed by EU27).

There is nothing whatsoever that the UK parliament can do - by itself - to prevent the UK leaving.

Parliament may purport to vot to revoke the Article 50 notification.

But that needs the EU, in some form, to agree.

Either EU27 agree to the revocation.

Or, if not, the ECJ would have to rule that A50 can be unilterally revoked by departing state.

The UK parliament can vote until every legislator is blue in the face, but it is not their decision any more.

They gave the power to EU.

The horse, cat, and genii are all out of their respective receptacles.

Parliament is now, ultimately, impotent on Brexit. It is too late.

And notion that parliament can vote down a "no deal" Brexit is logically absurd.

"No deal" is the default. Parliamentary vote meaningless.

This is not to say that Brexit is inevitable, in general terms.

Just that decision will not be that of UK parliament, or indeed government.

And, of course, parliamentary votes may go into the broader political mix of events which could stop Brexit. But will not by themselves.

If referendum was about UK "taking back control", UK gave away control of if, how and when of Brexit when it triggered Article 50.

twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/919826055791341568

NickSCFC wrote:Looks increasingly like we won't get a deal.

Come 2019 we'll be at a point where we have to walk away with "No deal" and I don't see a single MP voting for that.

All that will come from this will be the UK remaining in the EU with it's reputation damaged.

Hexx wrote:

NickSCFC wrote:Looks increasingly like we won't get a deal.

Come 2019 we'll be at a point where we have to walk away with "No deal" and I don't see a single MP voting for that.

All that will come from this will be the UK remaining in the EU with it's reputation damaged.

It doesn't matter what the hell MPs vote for really.

Parliament and Brexit

A thread.

There are assertions that the UK Parliament can (somehow) stop Brexit, or can vote down a "no deal" Brexit.

The UK parliament cannot, by itself, stop Brexit or vote down a "no deal" Brexit.

UK parliament has no ultimate control of Brexit process.

It lost control with the Article 50 notification.

Cannot now take back control.

The Article 50 notification, which was cheered and clapped by many, was in fact the UK surrendering any control of the Brexit process.

The UK will now, by simple operation of law, cease to be a member of the EU on 29 March 2019.

(Or another date, if agreed by EU27).

There is nothing whatsoever that the UK parliament can do - by itself - to prevent the UK leaving.

Parliament may purport to vot to revoke the Article 50 notification.

But that needs the EU, in some form, to agree.

Either EU27 agree to the revocation.

Or, if not, the ECJ would have to rule that A50 can be unilterally revoked by departing state.

The UK parliament can vote until every legislator is blue in the face, but it is not their decision any more.

They gave the power to EU.

The horse, cat, and genii are all out of their respective receptacles.

Parliament is now, ultimately, impotent on Brexit. It is too late.

And notion that parliament can vote down a "no deal" Brexit is logically absurd.

"No deal" is the default. Parliamentary vote meaningless.

This is not to say that Brexit is inevitable, in general terms.

Just that decision will not be that of UK parliament, or indeed government.

And, of course, parliamentary votes may go into the broader political mix of events which could stop Brexit. But will not by themselves.

If referendum was about UK "taking back control", UK gave away control of if, how and when of Brexit when it triggered Article 50.

twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/919826055791341568

Lagamorph wrote:Parliament will hold a debate on 11th December regarding holding a referendum on the final Brexit deal.

Squinty wrote:Our reputation with the citizens of the EU may take a bit longer. We look like a bag of total banana splits.

Lagamorph wrote:Parliament will hold a debate on 11th December regarding holding a referendum on the final Brexit deal.

Rex Kramer wrote:Gove and Grayling have a track record of absolute incompetency, you only have to look at the current state of the prison system to see just how utterly strawberry floating useless the pair of them are. And yet, they continue to get prominent cabinet positions. I really don't understand how politics works.

KK wrote:

Squinty wrote:Our reputation with the citizens of the EU may take a bit longer. We look like a bag of total banana splits.

I think Brexit is so far down the agenda of most people's thought process; it barely came up in the German elections, Spain is dealing with its Catalan crisis, France is busy hating Macron, Austria with their elections...

It's there, but I don't think it's really a major topic of discussion or of overt concern.

NickSCFC wrote:

Lagamorph wrote:Parliament will hold a debate on 11th December regarding holding a referendum on the final Brexit deal.

Source?

Is this when May finally realises she'll get nothing from these negotiations?

Moggy wrote:Germany, Spain, France and Austria are all capable of thinking of more than one thing at once.

It’s certainly more than just “there” in Europe, it’s a strawberry floating massive story, the same as it would have been here if we had voted to remain and then France, Italy or Spain were in the process of leaving.

twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/920243323415269377

KK wrote:

Moggy wrote:Germany, Spain, France and Austria are all capable of thinking of more than one thing at once.

It’s certainly more than just “there” in Europe, it’s a strawberry floating massive story, the same as it would have been here if we had voted to remain and then France, Italy or Spain were in the process of leaving.

My Gran for example is Polish, watches a lot of Polish TV, reads their newspapers, has a lot of friends over there, and it's so low on their news agenda compared to what else is happening in the country and throughout the world, and the same for French television. It doesn't dominate or lead in the same way Brexit and Donald Trump do here. That's all we care about, day after day after day. At times it's like a broken record.

The political establishment may be talking about it all the time, but the average guy on the street certainly isn't.

Hexx wrote:Interesting words from Davis- basically No Deal might have to be the case because if it's the only way to reflect THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE...(but it'll still be all the EUs fault).