Brexit

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Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?

Remain a member of the European Union
222
80%
Leave the European Union
57
20%
 
Total votes: 279
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Squinty
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Location: Norn Oirland

PostRe: Brexit
by Squinty » Fri Apr 28, 2017 7:54 am

Meep wrote:Won't a huge victory make that much harder though? If they get a huge majority they won't be able to point the finger at anyone in two years time. Their party brought about Brexit, their party negotiated leaving, their party is to blame for any damage. If they mess up particularly badly the other parties could be beating them with this stick for decades.


As others have said, it will be spun in such a way that it isn't their fault. I fully expect 'the EU are bullies!' in a few years time, from the gutter press.

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Errkal
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PostRe: Brexit
by Errkal » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:05 am

Squinty wrote:
Meep wrote:Won't a huge victory make that much harder though? If they get a huge majority they won't be able to point the finger at anyone in two years time. Their party brought about Brexit, their party negotiated leaving, their party is to blame for any damage. If they mess up particularly badly the other parties could be beating them with this stick for decades.


As others have said, it will be spun in such a way that it isn't their fault. I fully expect 'the EU are bullies!' in a few years time, from the gutter press.


It won't be in a few years, it will be within weeks. They need to drill it onto people so it is all they thing from the word go.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:07 am

Errkal wrote:
Squinty wrote:
Meep wrote:Won't a huge victory make that much harder though? If they get a huge majority they won't be able to point the finger at anyone in two years time. Their party brought about Brexit, their party negotiated leaving, their party is to blame for any damage. If they mess up particularly badly the other parties could be beating them with this stick for decades.


As others have said, it will be spun in such a way that it isn't their fault. I fully expect 'the EU are bullies!' in a few years time, from the gutter press.


It won't be in a few years, it will be within weeks. They need to drill it onto people so it is all they thing from the word go.


It's already started but you can expect it to ramp up considerably as we approach the 2022 election.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:08 am

Squinty wrote:Not sure we are ready.

In saying that, I think it would be a good thing and it's only a matter of time.


Northern Ireland probably isn't ready, all the EU are doing is laying the groundwork in case it ever does happen. In the same way that the Republic, Northern Ireland and the UK did in 1998.

It's a shocking story of EU bullying. :x

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Squinty
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Location: Norn Oirland

PostRe: Brexit
by Squinty » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:32 am

Moggy wrote:
Squinty wrote:Not sure we are ready.

In saying that, I think it would be a good thing and it's only a matter of time.


Northern Ireland probably isn't ready, all the EU are doing is laying the groundwork in case it ever does happen. In the same way that the Republic, Northern Ireland and the UK did in 1998.

It's a shocking story of EU bullying. :x


And that's fair enough, people should have the right to choose. EU BULLYING THOUGH :x

bear
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PostRe: Brexit
by bear » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:32 am

Moggy wrote:As the article says, it would just be following the terms of the Good Friday agreement. So no change to anything at all.

And people think Remain were "Project Fear". :lol:

Removing any bit of doubt during Brexit negotiations would still be seen as a good bit of work by Enda Kenny as it'd be hard to argue that he wasn't pushing the idea of a United Ireland forward.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:34 am

Squinty wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Squinty wrote:Not sure we are ready.

In saying that, I think it would be a good thing and it's only a matter of time.


Northern Ireland probably isn't ready, all the EU are doing is laying the groundwork in case it ever does happen. In the same way that the Republic, Northern Ireland and the UK did in 1998.

It's a shocking story of EU bullying. :x


And that's fair enough, people should have the right to choose. EU BULLYING THOUGH :x


Maybe the papers will go the other way and we will see headlines like "CATHOLIC Ireland attempts to steal Ulster - the Vatican supports the breakup of the UK!". ;)

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 12:45 pm

I'll put these in here rather than the comments thread.

The UK is drawing up post-Brexit sanction plans: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39741773/comments

Great just get on with it. These decisions must be made in the interests of the UK and not the EU (Germany). The liberation has started.


#5
Parallel
Wonder what else they haven't yet realised?
++
I don't think *anyone* realised what a bunch of cry-baby snowflake losers the remain voters would turn out to be, still hanging onto every biased word the bbc publish like its some stone tablet coming out of a cave.

GROW UP.


Germany may not want us having the same sanctions as the EU. after all what sort of message would that send to the other 27.


Just shows how much sovereignty we lost to the EU which remainers always deny. The EU has reached well beyond a trading hub. It needs bringing down.


we will be free to impose them against the EU then?

freeze all EU assets say in London :)


Let's slap sanctions on Germany for the crimes committed by Merkel in allowing Europe to be infested by even more terrorists and their sympathisers


Great,
We'll be able to impose sanctions on any EU country who blocks something we want in brexit negotiations


Tusk has said that UK trade deal is not a priority: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-39742949

The reason that the EU is opposing / punishing the UK is all about ensuring that no further EU member states dare to try to leave like the UK. France and Germany can try to prop up a failing project for a few more years, but with the level of unsustainable debt and mantra to "federalise" Europe, they will eventually learn the hard way. It will all come crashing down. I'd rather be out before this.


EU posturing and blackmail.

We should just leave it's much simplier and easier and we would know exactly where we stand and the markets and businesses will get the certainty they so plead for.

WTO rules are far better than letting EU still dictating what we can or cannot do.

Eu says cough up, guarantee our citizens and trying to dictate re NI which is nowt to do with them.

Out no deal


Just stop all payments to the EU and see how fast they start negotiating properly.

They only want our money!


Our entire structure has crumbled under the weight of the EU, it has stretched our services to breaking point and I am sorry but it is down to immigration. My mother was an immigrant from Greece in the 60's so I am not some right-wing loon. It's just a hard to swallow fact


Now remainers know who to blame if it takes longer than 2 years


Do any of the remainers read this bitter, aggressive, greed and fear driven bile from EU leaders and still regret our decision to leave?


More of the same - we know the EU reaction to Brexit. We want a hard Brexit and the EU want the same, we are in agreement already. Only Corbyn and Sturgeon, plus the defeated Remoaners think otherwise!


Donald tusk is a little rat.... yes we may be poor for a while but we will dust ourselves off and continue to march on. Let the other Eu members sleepwalk and continue their undemocratic nonsense whilst we, as always continue to better ourselves even with libtards and ginna miller type people who try and slow the process down.


Brexit was created by the EU. We voted to leave because of what the EU is and what is has done to our country. Would the politicians please get us out of this appalling dictatorial organisation as soon as possible.


A clear message to other EU countries, then. Stay or be bullied.


The EU seems to think they hold all the cards (which they don't).

We absolutely hold the cheque book though.

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Photek
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Location: Dublin

PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Fri Apr 28, 2017 12:53 pm

Moggy wrote:
"We have seen Chancellor Merkel's comments today. She says the UK has 'illusions' about the process and that the 27 member states of the European Union agree.

"We can see how tough those negotiations are going to be at times," she said.

"Yet our opponents are already seeking to disrupt those negotiations, at the same time as 27 other European countries line up to oppose us.

"That approach can only mean one thing, uncertainty and instability, bringing grave risk to our growing economy with higher taxes, fewer jobs, more waste and more debt.

"So we need the strongest possible hand, the strongest possible mandate and the strongest possible leadership as we go into those talks."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39737216


:fp:

I don't....wait what? We're in a union, we didnt 'gang up' specifically just now to f*ck the UK off!

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 12:57 pm

Photek wrote:
Moggy wrote:
"We have seen Chancellor Merkel's comments today. She says the UK has 'illusions' about the process and that the 27 member states of the European Union agree.

"We can see how tough those negotiations are going to be at times," she said.

"Yet our opponents are already seeking to disrupt those negotiations, at the same time as 27 other European countries line up to oppose us.

"That approach can only mean one thing, uncertainty and instability, bringing grave risk to our growing economy with higher taxes, fewer jobs, more waste and more debt.

"So we need the strongest possible hand, the strongest possible mandate and the strongest possible leadership as we go into those talks."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39737216


:fp:

I don't....wait what? We're in a union, we didnt 'gang up' specifically just now to f*ck the UK off!


You are just a bully. Why won't you just give us ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING we want and let us give you NOTHING AT ALL in return?

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Photek
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Location: Dublin

PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:17 pm

As for a united Ireland, I can't see that happening in my life time, just far too many things to negotiate that'd take too long. I mean just one would were would the Government be? The Dail?

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:17 pm

Photek wrote:As for a united Ireland, I can't see that happening in my life time, just far too many things to negotiate that'd take too long. I mean just one would were would the Government be? The Dail?


London.

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Photek
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Location: Dublin

PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:20 pm

:lol:

I'm sure Norn Iron folk would like it in Belfast and all non Dublin Counties would want it in their own but we already have Cork calling themselves (unironically) 'the real capital'.

Cork folk saying that or wearing those T-shirts cracks me up all the time, vast amounts of salt down that neck of the woods. :datass:

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Garth
Emeritus
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Location: Norn Iron

PostRe: Brexit
by Garth » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:22 pm

Lol, they all sound so bitter even though they're getting exactly what they voted for. They're a bunch of idiots for thinking the EU would just roll over and give us everything we want. The EU is in a much stronger negotiating position the UK, suck it up you ignorant fools and accept the reality of the situation you've created.

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Photek
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Location: Dublin

PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:24 pm

Garth wrote:Lol, they all sound so bitter even though they're getting exactly what they voted for. They're a bunch of idiots for thinking the EU would just roll over and give us everything we want. The EU is in a much stronger negotiating position the UK, suck it up you ignorant fools and accept the reality of the situation you've created.

According to a guy on that LBC James O'Brien show the UK has no skilled negotiators either, the EU have quite a few that recently helped hash out the Canadian deal.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:24 pm

Photek wrote::lol:

I'm sure Norn Iron folk would like it in Belfast and all non Dublin Counties would want it in their own but we already have Cork calling themselves (unironically) 'the real capital'.

Cork folk saying that or wearing those T-shirts cracks me up all the time, vast amounts of salt down that neck of the woods. :datass:


Obviously we have no idea what would happen as N Ireland is nowhere near unifying with the Republic. I would imagine though that Dublin would remain the capital of Ireland.

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Photek
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Location: Dublin

PostRe: Brexit
by Photek » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:25 pm

Moggy wrote:
Photek wrote::lol:

I'm sure Norn Iron folk would like it in Belfast and all non Dublin Counties would want it in their own but we already have Cork calling themselves (unironically) 'the real capital'.

Cork folk saying that or wearing those T-shirts cracks me up all the time, vast amounts of salt down that neck of the woods. :datass:


Obviously we have no idea what would happen as N Ireland is nowhere near unifying with the Republic. I would imagine though that Dublin would remain the capital of Ireland.

and rightly strawberry floating so. :datass:

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:28 pm

Garth wrote:Lol, they all sound so bitter even though they're getting exactly what they voted for. They're a bunch of idiots for thinking the EU would just roll over and give us everything we want. The EU is in a much stronger negotiating position the UK, suck it up you ignorant fools and accept the reality of the situation you've created.


They just can't see it though. I guess they have seen the history of the British Empire and have been told all their lives how great Britain is and they believe that Britain is therefore due anything it wants and that the rest of the world should be grateful to us for enriching them.

The idea that the UK by itself holds the trump cards against the united front of the 27 other European countries. Yeah that's right Mr Smith in Sunderland, the EU needs British trade far more than Britain needs EU trade. :lol:

We will bend over and do what we are told, or else we will end up with nothing. Neither of those options are anywhere near as good as what we had, but we have no choices left.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Brexit
by Moggy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:29 pm

Photek wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Photek wrote::lol:

I'm sure Norn Iron folk would like it in Belfast and all non Dublin Counties would want it in their own but we already have Cork calling themselves (unironically) 'the real capital'.

Cork folk saying that or wearing those T-shirts cracks me up all the time, vast amounts of salt down that neck of the woods. :datass:


Obviously we have no idea what would happen as N Ireland is nowhere near unifying with the Republic. I would imagine though that Dublin would remain the capital of Ireland.

and rightly strawberry floating so. :datass:


Well it just makes sense to keep it in Dublin rather than foul up Cork or Belfast. The capital city is usually the place where a country puts all it's crap while the prettier and nicer cities avoid all that capital city bullshit.

bear
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PostRe: Brexit
by bear » Fri Apr 28, 2017 2:18 pm

Photek wrote:As for a united Ireland, I can't see that happening in my life time, just far too many things to negotiate that'd take too long. I mean just one would were would the Government be? The Dail?

Well it'd have to be Dublin, I doubt that'd even be in question.

If a United Ireland is to happen in our lifetime then the government need to start building towards that possibility now. The national debt would need to be tackled aggressively going forward with a government surplus and a real reduction of the debt, not just a reduction in terms of a percentage of GDP, being the target starting in 2018. If support for a United Ireland hit 40% in the North then I think the government of the Republic would need to start building up a reunification fund to cover the costs of a United Ireland. Those sort of policies would be very hard to implement though due to the popularity of so-called anti-austerity politicians like Paul Murphy and Ruth Coppinger.


I used to think that a United Ireland is something that would never happen and while I still think it's very unlikely anytime soon it's now something I think will eventually happen. A large part of that belief is because the values of the main Unionist parties, the DUP and UUP, are too tied up in hard-line protestant values. Stuff like gay marriage and access to abortion has sod all to do with Unionism but then you see people like Arlene Foster and Edwin Poots put opposing those issues near the top of the DUPs manifesto and it just drives people, especially younger people, towards parties like the Alliance party. They are hurting Unionism with this approach and if they don't change course soon a United Ireland may just become a question of when, not if.


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