Brexit

There are many examples of things governments and their departments could do because it makes more sense, but they don't.

Their interest is generally to their political party and any of their friends. It's why this referendum was held in the first place our own interests don't appear to be taken in to account (right now at least), unless of course you wanted an extreme brexit

KK wrote:I'm actually optimistic going into this that we'll leave with a good deal that works for both sides, because it's in everyone's interest to do so.

The difference is that the EU will barely suffer if no deal is reached.
The UK on the other hand will suffer hugely.

Especially since it appears the EU are going to stick to the UK not being allowed to even begin negotiating any trade deals with anyone else until after March 2019.

KK wrote:I'm actually optimistic going into this that we'll leave with a good deal that works for both sides, because it's in everyone's interest to do so.

It's not really possible though.

A lot of the vocal Leave voters in the UK want the moon on a stick. They want to leave the EU without having to pay a penny in costs, they want all current UK funding to be protected and expect full tariff free trade.

The UK government want...Brexit to mean Brexit? Who knows, May and her cronies don't seem able to actually tell anybody anything. I guess they will be looking to pander to the Leave voters, but in doing so they will be pissing off the whole of Europe.

The EU will want to avoid conflict, but will be forced into (hopefully only verbal/trade!) conflict as it appears May is going to go in shouting "GIVE US ALL WE WANT OR WE WILL HAVE NO DEAL!!". That is only going to result in tariffs which will end up pissing everybody off.

Individual EU nations (who will have a massive say and individual vetoes!) will want what is best for their own nations. Germany will be eyeing up our banking sector, France will want to scare people off of the National Front by showing how bad hard Brexit is. Other nations like Greece will probably be furious if the UK gets an amazing deal while they are still struggling. Just look how the trade deal with Canada almost fell through, just because one region of Belgium didn't like it.

The whole thing will be a mess.

KK wrote:I'm actually optimistic going into this that we'll leave with a good deal that works for both sides, because it's in everyone's interest to do so.

The EU will make zero concessions to the UK for leaving because it sets a bad example, I imagine the exact opposite will happen thus scaring other nations taking the same steps.

Photek wrote:

KK wrote:I'm actually optimistic going into this that we'll leave with a good deal that works for both sides, because it's in everyone's interest to do so.

The EU will make zero concessions to the UK for leaving because it sets a bad example, I imagine the exact opposite will happen thus scaring other nations taking the same steps.

"Da EU iz bulying us 4 dareing 2 leeve!!!"

twitter.com/lisaocarroll/status/845940453430218752

I'll have to try and find the full article somewhere but it's really striking to me how Brexit has made a united Ireland a talking point in the politics of the Republic. When the next election rolls around then the three biggest parties will most likely all include some plan for achieving a united Ireland in their manifestos. It was barely mentioned at the last election. Whether or not those plans admit that we currently can't afford a United Ireland and will need to aggressively tackle our national debt to make it affordable is another story....

I obviously don't think the EU are out to 'punish' us but I also don't think they really care whether we get a deal or not. The deal they offer will be 'if you want to be in the single market you have to pay a fee and accept freedom of movement.' We don't have anything to bargain with that will make them budge on that.

bear wrote:

twitter.com/lisaocarroll/status/845940453430218752

I'll have to try and find the full article somewhere but it's really striking to me how Brexit has made a united Ireland a talking point in the politics of the Republic. When the next election rolls around then the three biggest parties will most likely all include some plan for achieving a united Ireland in their manifestos. It was barely mentioned at the last election. Whether or not those plans admit that we currently can't afford a United Ireland and will need to aggressively tackle our national debt to make it affordable is another story....

Terrible question though, what does "best" mean?

I mean it's definitely the option with the least likelihood of involving a hard border, because they would be no possibility of a border. That doesn't say anything about how "good" an idea it is or how feasible it is. Answering that poll question leans too much on reader interpretation.

Lagamorph wrote:

KK wrote:I'm actually optimistic going into this that we'll leave with a good deal that works for both sides, because it's in everyone's interest to do so.

The difference is that the EU will barely suffer if no deal is reached.
The UK on the other hand will suffer hugely.

Especially since it appears the EU are going to stick to the UK not being allowed to even begin negotiating any trade deals with anyone else until after March 2019.

Yeah the German car manufacturers wouldn't allow that to happen, they need us more than we need them.

Errkal wrote:

Lagamorph wrote:

KK wrote:I'm actually optimistic going into this that we'll leave with a good deal that works for both sides, because it's in everyone's interest to do so.

The difference is that the EU will barely suffer if no deal is reached.
The UK on the other hand will suffer hugely.

Especially since it appears the EU are going to stick to the UK not being allowed to even begin negotiating any trade deals with anyone else until after March 2019.

Yeah the German car manufacturers wouldn't allow that to happen, they need us more than we need them.

The representatives of the German car manufacturers literally laughed in the face of the UK representative who said that whilst in Germany I believe.

Lagamorph wrote:

Errkal wrote:

Lagamorph wrote:

KK wrote:I'm actually optimistic going into this that we'll leave with a good deal that works for both sides, because it's in everyone's interest to do so.

The difference is that the EU will barely suffer if no deal is reached.
The UK on the other hand will suffer hugely.

Especially since it appears the EU are going to stick to the UK not being allowed to even begin negotiating any trade deals with anyone else until after March 2019.

Yeah the German car manufacturers wouldn't allow that to happen, they need us more than we need them.

The representatives of the German car manufacturers literally laughed in the face of the UK representative who said that whilst in Germany I believe.

So you are saying that is time for the resurrection of the glorious UK car industry? BMW and Volkswagen will be shitting themselves.

The world is crying out for a Rover.

The UK does still make the best cars in the world though, it's just that Joe Bloggs has never been able to afford them. Aston do have plans to start diversifying a bit, but they still won't really be mass market vehicles.

KK wrote:The UK does still make the best cars in the world though, it's just that Joe Bloggs has never been able to afford them. Aston do have plans to start diversifying a bit, but they still won't really be mass market vehicles.

Aston Martin is mostly foreign owned and a lot of the components for its cars come from Mercedes.

Rolls-Royce is a BMW company.

Bentley is a Volkswagen company.

Jaguar is a Tata company.

We might have factories making cars in the UK (for now), but we are certainly not leaders in actually producing our own.

Moggy wrote:

KK wrote:The UK does still make the best cars in the world though, it's just that Joe Bloggs has never been able to afford them. Aston do have plans to start diversifying a bit, but they still won't really be mass market vehicles.

Aston Martin is mostly foreign owned and a lot of the components for its cars come from Mercedes.

Rolls-Royce is a BMW company.

Bentley is a Volkswagen company.

Jaguar is a Tata company.

We might have factories making cars in the UK (for now), but we are certainly not leaders in actually producing our own.

You forgot to mention MG which was "accidentally" given away with the Rover sale to China.

It is a terrible sad state of affairs UK car manufacturing is in with everything pinned on the triumphant return of TVR.

And Scotland goes independent...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-n ... d-39406131

Moggy wrote:And Scotland goes independent...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-n ... d-39406131

Interesting. Certainly makes them a bit more viable.

Squinty wrote:

Moggy wrote:And Scotland goes independent...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-n ... d-39406131

Interesting. Certainly makes them a bit more viable.

Ironically it's off Shetland, who want to remain part of the UK however they are considered part of Scotland. Maybe Shetland should seek independence.

Return_of_the_STAR wrote:

Squinty wrote:

Moggy wrote:And Scotland goes independent...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-n ... d-39406131

Interesting. Certainly makes them a bit more viable.

Ironically it's off Shetland, who want to remain part of the UK however they are considered part of Scotland. Maybe Shetland should seek independence.

With all that oil and a small population, Shetland would be richer than any other part of the UK.

Moggy wrote:

Return_of_the_STAR wrote:

Squinty wrote:

Moggy wrote:And Scotland goes independent...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-n ... d-39406131

Interesting. Certainly makes them a bit more viable.

Ironically it's off Shetland, who want to remain part of the UK however they are considered part of Scotland. Maybe Shetland should seek independence.

With all that oil and a small population, Shetland would be richer than any other part of the UK.

They should go for it.