DML wrote:GrinWithoutaKat wrote:I don't think he's really done better than anyone previously. Just got nicer fixtures than anyone previously. People act like embarrassing exits are the norm for England, but Iceland was the only one in ages. 2014, knocked out by a very good Italy side and a good Uruguay side that had considerably home advantage in the South American climate. 2012 knocked out by a very good Italy side, and 2010 by a very good German side. Think England should have actually expected to beat both Croatia in 2018 and Italy in 2021, more than they should have beaten any of those previous sides. The German win in 2021 was at least good, but the World Cup in 2018 they absolutely beat nobody of the caliber that usually knocks them out.
I think people underestimate beating Denmark last time, they are surely at the moment dark horses to win the World Cup. They looked really excellent before they played us and gave us a really tough game.
2002 was the year we should have won it. Beat Brazil (who I don't think were at the height of their powers, not far off mind) and we would have taken that World Cup.
Yep, 2002 was there for the taking. Brazil weren't great - the 98 side was arguably better - but were the most consistent side in the tournament. And the tournament was pretty dire in terms.of quality.
We were beating Brazil 1-0 until just before half time, when Beckham (rushed back from injury) leapt out of tackle and they hit us on the break. We were knocked out by a fluke goal/terrible goalkeeping.
Had we progressed, we'd have played Turkey in the semi final and Germany in the final. We would later go on and play Turkey in 2003 for Euro 2004 qualifying and we beat them at home and drew 0-0 away (in a game where a draw meant we would top the group).
The Germany side was probably one of the worst finalists in living memory and was seen as the dying embers of some.of the great 90s sides. The final was in July 2002, and we'd beat them 5-1 in qualifying in September the previous year.
I take umbridge with the idea with some of the previous WC results being okay. WC 2010 does not get a pass because we got knocked out by Germany (who I think got knocked out themselves next round). The group stage was absolutely sure - 1-1 with the USA, 0-0 with Algeria and a very fortunate 1-0 win against Slovenia.
Our group games in the Euros were decent. Beating Czech Republic and Croatia is decent, and a draw with Scotland was okay, in what is effectively a fiery derby.
We also have to remember that in literally every tournament since beating Ecuador in WC 2006, we've been eliminated in our first knockout game I think? Southgate has won 5. And the two he hasn't won, one went to extra time and one to penalties.
Now, I don't think his record is without criticism - both of those games, we sat back and tried to defend a 1-0 lead. We went too deep, got too nervous and too passive. But in both, we had chances where we arguably should have scored a second (think it was Kane before times too?).
He's earned the right to have a go at this World Cup. If we badly underperform, then the FA should have a look at his position and see if they can make a change. It probably would be a good time to make a change (3 tournaments is a lot, and more than most get).
