The Proposed Increase To Student Fees

John Galt wrote:

Elfhours wrote:

John Galt wrote:With the increase to fees I would be in £36,000 of debt but I still think this is a small price to pay considering the money I'm likely to earn after the course compared to the amount I would be earning had I have gone straight in to employment.

LOLZ. Just you wait. Unless your degree is highly specialised, you'll more than likely be swimming in the same pond as the rest of the fish. And if that specialism is something Science-based... oh dear. You'll have to move abroad to get any real money.

What's your degree, fella? I might cringe less at your post if it's the right answer, as there are exceptions!

I'm doing a MEng in Electronic Engineering. I know for a fact that Electrical Engineers are in short supply (the scholarships they're giving out at the moment are ridiculous) and I could go in to any numeracy literate job with the degree too. It helps that I'm doing it at one of the best departments in the UK but then if I had no hope of going somewhere good I wouldn't have bothered. This may all sound naive and pretentious but I genuinely believe that I could come out of Uni in fours years with a 1st and a £25,000+ salary.

You should be ok. I left Uni with a degree in Engineering and could have walked into a job at Microsoft, which wasn't that well payed in the first year, a job in BT that was good and a job at BAE that was very good and another good one, amongst others, in supply chain. I'm very good at interviews which helped a lot. I decided against all of them and went into teaching instead, for many different reasons. I'm just backing you up to be honest, I specialised in Engineering and Business and came out with plenty of oppertunities, so whoever it was (Eight?) that said science degrees were gooseberry fool can strawberry float right off sideways.

They aren't, if you go to the right place...and get the right degree. Something else that should be considered now we're on the subject of education. If the government wants to improve education they need to attract the best graduates. They can only do this with some incentive beyond a good salary whilst training and a taxed Golden Hello. They should write off student debt. Maybe limit the amount, but still write it off. Why they don't is beyond me.

When I was training there were some people who managed to get on the course that were useless. They couldn't command a basic grasp of grammar, failed most if not all essays and were crap at public speaking, which is essentially the job. If you want a brilliant education system you have to have a brilliant set of teachers, and that extends to primary as well. The less said of primary the better in some cases.

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:*never went to uni*

*is in the market for jobs paying 28k*

That's funny, that's just a bit less than the salary my girlfriend is earning at her first post-uni job at the age of 23.

Skarjo wrote:

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:*never went to uni*

*is in the market for jobs paying 28k*

That's funny, that's just a bit less than the salary my girlfriend is earning at her first post-uni job at the age of 23.

To be fair, I'm only 24, and I have left a job that was paying 25 and a half grand a year. And I didn't get myself into debt to do it.

It's not all about money folks!

JNR wrote:It's not all about money folks!

Of course it is! Why else would people do it?

Elfhours wrote:What's your degree, fella? I might cringe less at your post if it's the right answer, as there are exceptions!

I wonder how many people out there realise the potential in certain courses.

Out of interest what would you say if I said I had a degree in electrical engineering?

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:

Skarjo wrote:

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:*never went to uni*

*is in the market for jobs paying 28k*

That's funny, that's just a bit less than the salary my girlfriend is earning at her first post-uni job at the age of 23.

To be fair, I'm only 24, and I have left a job that was paying 25 and a half grand a year. And I didn't get myself into debt to do it.

What are you doing now?

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:

JNR wrote:It's not all about money folks!

Of course it is! Why else would people do it?

o/

JNR wrote:

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:

Skarjo wrote:

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:*never went to uni*

*is in the market for jobs paying 28k*

That's funny, that's just a bit less than the salary my girlfriend is earning at her first post-uni job at the age of 23.

To be fair, I'm only 24, and I have left a job that was paying 25 and a half grand a year. And I didn't get myself into debt to do it.

What are you doing now?

Looking for jobs. Applying to many. These past couple of weeks I have had my eyes opened to just how much I can earn with my meagre qualifications (NVQ Level 3 in Maintenance Engineering, HNC in Electronic Engineering and City & Guilds 2391 16th Edition). Many CVs have been sent. Admittedly, I did pretty much sit on my arse since January, but that's all changed now.

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:

JNR wrote:It's not all about money folks!

Of course it is! Why else would people do it?

Oh I don't know, going home feeling like you've made a difference could always be a bonus. Doing something exciting and interesting could be a bonus. Why throw that away to make an extra few dollar mayne?

They should write off student debt. Maybe limit the amount, but still write it off. Why they don't is beyond me.

That's a very good point, and it would encourage those who don't take it seriously enough to buck up and make themselves useful. It would have to be a significant amount to matter though.

I also echo the comments on the literacy of some students. I'm with a lot of people who haven't the greatest grasp of English, and while it's fairly accurate to say that international students outnumber British natives and as such have an excuse for not being able to write beautiful prose, there are still plenty of English folk who don't have a clue. I have to proofread a lot of it and it's a genuine headache.

I really think that the barrier has been left a little too low in this regard.

And more sense from JNR. Money's not the only motivator. You could give a creatively minded person a £70k salary to answer the phone and sign paperwork for 8 hours a day and he wouldn't be happy. Give him a job where he can, say, teach people how to draw or make music, or to get out and organise things without having to answer to someone higher up, and offer £30k for it and, chances are, he'd jump for that without second thought. Theoretically.

This is why the last thing I want to do is work in an office 9-5. Where are the responsibilities and creative freedom in that?

Yes let the government get further into debt by writing off the debt off students!

The day universities are free (In England.) is the day hell freezes over.

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:Looking for jobs. Applying to many. These past couple of weeks I have had my eyes opened to just how much I can earn with my meagre qualifications (NVQ Level 3 in Maintenance Engineering, HNC in Electronic Engineering and City & Guilds 2391 16th Edition). Many CVs have been sent. Admittedly, I did pretty much sit on my arse since January, but that's all changed now.

Best of luck with it, have you had anything back?

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:Looking for jobs. Applying to many. These past couple of weeks I have had my eyes opened to just how much I can earn with my meagre qualifications (NVQ Level 3 in Maintenance Engineering, HNC in Electronic Engineering and City & Guilds 2391 16th Edition). Many CVs have been sent. Admittedly, I did pretty much sit on my **** since January, but that's all changed now.

Have you thought of applying to companies that work in electrical distribution?

Its a sector that is never mentioned in schools as a career option yet you can earn serious money and has excellent job security.

The thing that I really wish I'd been more informed about over the years is graduate training schemes. Anyone with a degree should really look into them. Not quite sure what Eighty has against Science degress, as most training courses demand one that has a scientific or mathematical basis. Still, my Medical Microbiology degree seemed pretty useful when HSBC put me on the Commercial Management scheme.

Hime123 wrote:

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:Looking for jobs. Applying to many. These past couple of weeks I have had my eyes opened to just how much I can earn with my meagre qualifications (NVQ Level 3 in Maintenance Engineering, HNC in Electronic Engineering and City & Guilds 2391 16th Edition). Many CVs have been sent. Admittedly, I did pretty much sit on my **** since January, but that's all changed now.

Have you thought of applying to companies that work in electrical distribution?

Its a sector that is never mentioned in schools as a career option yet you can earn serious money and has excellent job security.

You couldn't give me the websites of some, could you? It would be much appreciated.

Skarjo wrote:The thing that I really wish I'd been more informed about over the years is graduate training schemes. Anyone with a degree should really look into them. Not quite sure what Eighty has against Science degress, as most training courses demand one that has a scientific or mathematical basis. Still, my Medical Microbiology degree seemed pretty useful when HSBC put me on the Commercial Management scheme.

I'm having a look through them all now, but our lecturer didn't really instil much faith when he said you could go through 30 or 40 interviews and fail the lot of them. It doesn't really do much to encourage you.

I've got half filled in applications for BAE and the Co-Operative. To be honest it's not a line of work I want to take but I'd be a strawberry floating idiot if I didn't make use of the opportunity.

EDIT: You say graduate training, I'm looking at placement year stuff, but they all seem to offer both. Just on different terms.

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:

Hime123 wrote:

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:Looking for jobs. Applying to many. These past couple of weeks I have had my eyes opened to just how much I can earn with my meagre qualifications (NVQ Level 3 in Maintenance Engineering, HNC in Electronic Engineering and City & Guilds 2391 16th Edition). Many CVs have been sent. Admittedly, I did pretty much sit on my **** since January, but that's all changed now.

Have you thought of applying to companies that work in electrical distribution?

Its a sector that is never mentioned in schools as a career option yet you can earn serious money and has excellent job security.

You couldn't give me the websites of some, could you? It would be much appreciated.

Certainly.

What part of the country do you live in? I work for a company that is now national so I'll send you the website but I also know a few regional companies and there is always your local distribution network operator.

Hime123 wrote:

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:

Hime123 wrote:

Merry Christmas, Noobs! wrote:Looking for jobs. Applying to many. These past couple of weeks I have had my eyes opened to just how much I can earn with my meagre qualifications (NVQ Level 3 in Maintenance Engineering, HNC in Electronic Engineering and City & Guilds 2391 16th Edition). Many CVs have been sent. Admittedly, I did pretty much sit on my **** since January, but that's all changed now.

Have you thought of applying to companies that work in electrical distribution?

Its a sector that is never mentioned in schools as a career option yet you can earn serious money and has excellent job security.

You couldn't give me the websites of some, could you? It would be much appreciated.

Certainly.

What part of the country do you live in? I work for a company that is now national so I'll send you the website but I also know a few regional companies and there is always your local distribution network operator.

I'm in the north-east. I appreciate the help.

JingleJay wrote:Yes let the government get further into debt by writing off the debt off students!

The day universities are free (In England.) is the day hell freezes over.

That isn't what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that for those students who wish to funnel their education back into education, give them a break. Make it a desirable option for quality graduates, not for Food and Nutrition graduates studying to be Biology teachers. These people are going to be teaching the graduates of the future and a serious investment in teacher recruitment is something that should be done. Let's put it this way, in a horribly anecdotal example...

When you want to be a teacher you have to pass special exams in ICT, English and Maths, to prove you are capable in what the government must see as mundane and every day maths and english. The ICT exam is very easy. English and Maths proved to be a challenge for some, to the point where 5 or more goes were required for either, or both.

I did all three, first time, in one go, in one afternoon. And I'm not a genius, far from it sadly. That is the calibre of students that are attracted to teaching.