Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid

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Cheeky Devlin
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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Cheeky Devlin » Sat Aug 25, 2018 1:57 pm

Nice. I have to assume Mercury Steam are working on a new 2D game at this point. Samus Returns was well received so hopefully they're getting to make a brand new one.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Mafro » Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:02 pm

They originally wanted to do a remake of Super but Nintendo wouldn't let them. I think a remake of that is inevitable now.

And Other M was a decent game, the outcry over Samus' characterisation was hilarious.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Cheeky Devlin » Sat Aug 25, 2018 4:12 pm

Mafro wrote:They originally wanted to do a remake of Super but Nintendo wouldn't let them. I think a remake of that is inevitable now.

And Other M was a decent game, the outcry over Samus' characterisation was hilarious.

I really hope they aren't doing a Super Metroid remake. Unlike the original or 2 there's nothing that needs an overhaul. It still looks gorgeous, sounds gorgeous and plays extremely well. I'm afraid they'd lose a lot of the games soul remaking it. I'd much rather they did a whole new game. But I'm afraid you might be right.

You're definitely right about Other M.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Mafro » Sat Aug 25, 2018 4:27 pm

It's a classic but it could definitely do with a few quality of life changes that were introduced in Fusion and Zero Mission. Switching between missiles, super missiles, super bombs etc. gets very annoying.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Starquake » Sat Aug 25, 2018 5:08 pm

Just ordered Samus Returns as I had some Amazon Gift vouchers. I really don’t know much about it. Is it any good? I’m a fan of Super and Fusion - so if it’s close to those I’ll be happy!

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Alvin Flummux » Sat Aug 25, 2018 5:09 pm

Starquake wrote:Just ordered Samus Returns as I had some Amazon Gift vouchers. I really don’t know much about it. Is it any good? I’m a fan of Super and Fusion - so if it’s close to those I’ll be happy!


It's a lot like them, with better abilities. You'll enjoy it. It has a different feel to those other games, though.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Starquake » Sat Aug 25, 2018 6:01 pm

Ok cool. I’ll likely be playing it in small chunks. What sort of length is the game for average skill?

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Johnny Ryall » Sat Aug 25, 2018 6:16 pm

8-10 hours probably?

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Alvin Flummux » Sat Aug 25, 2018 6:19 pm

Starquake wrote:Ok cool. I’ll likely be playing it in small chunks. What sort of length is the game for average skill?


I don't know, as I'm only part way through, myself. :slol:

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by The Watching Artist » Sun Aug 26, 2018 1:52 pm

Mother of god the boss fight in Returns against the massive robot for the power bombs. So damn satisfying. :datass: :datass: :datass: Took me about 6 attempts. :lol: Then I got to blow this gooseberry fool out of its corpse :datass: :datass: :datass: :lol: But the little cut scene at the end. https://youtu.be/R0MlYfz6D58?t=229 :lol: :lol: :lol: :wub:

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Metroid 30th Birthday and Metroid 2 Remake on Page 15
by Johnny Ryall » Sun Aug 26, 2018 2:54 pm

Yeah the bosses in returns are epic. I kinda hope it gets a switch rerelease as my only complaint was controller ergonomics.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by Cheeky Devlin » Sun Aug 26, 2018 4:47 pm

Cleared all the temples in Echoes this afternoon and got the Light Suit. Now it's artefact hunt time which will be a pain as I've no idea where they are and the menu system makes it a slog to get into the clues.

Joy.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by Johnny Ryall » Sun Aug 26, 2018 4:58 pm

I've not given up on prime 1, but I'm definitely taking a break. Definitely think the genre works better in 2d.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by Squinty » Sun Aug 26, 2018 9:52 pm

Cheeky Devlin wrote:Cleared all the temples in Echoes this afternoon and got the Light Suit. Now it's artefact hunt time which will be a pain as I've no idea where they are and the menu system makes it a slog to get into the clues.

Joy.


Just use a guide to speed this up. You are almost there. The artifact hunt is a bit annoying.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by Alvin Flummux » Mon Aug 27, 2018 1:53 am

Johnny Ryall wrote:I've not given up on prime 1, but I'm definitely taking a break. Definitely think the genre works better in 2d.


See, as much as I adore 2D Metroid games, I have to disagree with you. I think it works phenomenally well in 3D, but due to the extra dimension and altered view perspective, it has to play a bit differently to work as well as the 2D games.

I think the Prime games are the very definition of the ideal 2D-3D transition. They're not perfect, they have their issues, but there's not a whole lot they could've done to improve them - at the time, at least.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by Hime » Mon Aug 27, 2018 6:17 am

Alvin Flummux wrote:
Johnny Ryall wrote:I've not given up on prime 1, but I'm definitely taking a break. Definitely think the genre works better in 2d.


See, as much as I adore 2D Metroid games, I have to disagree with you. I think it works phenomenally well in 3D, but due to the extra dimension and altered view perspective, it has to play a bit differently to work as well as the 2D games.

I think the Prime games are the very definition of the ideal 2D-3D transition. They're not perfect, they have their issues, but there's not a whole lot they could've done to improve them - at the time, at least.

I'd agree with this. One thing that 3D games can do much better than 2D is make each location unique looking. I often find that it gets difficult to remember where things are in 2D games as often the 'worlds' will all look very similar.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by Hyperion » Mon Aug 27, 2018 8:21 am

Hime wrote:
Alvin Flummux wrote:
Johnny Ryall wrote:I've not given up on prime 1, but I'm definitely taking a break. Definitely think the genre works better in 2d.


See, as much as I adore 2D Metroid games, I have to disagree with you. I think it works phenomenally well in 3D, but due to the extra dimension and altered view perspective, it has to play a bit differently to work as well as the 2D games.

I think the Prime games are the very definition of the ideal 2D-3D transition. They're not perfect, they have their issues, but there's not a whole lot they could've done to improve them - at the time, at least.

I'd agree with this. One thing that 3D games can do much better than 2D is make each location unique looking. I often find that it gets difficult to remember where things are in 2D games as often the 'worlds' will all look very similar.


I'd disagree with this, it's incredibly easy to make locations unique looking in 2D, see Super Metroid and Fusion as examples

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by Drumstick » Mon Aug 27, 2018 8:32 am

The locations in Prime all look totally unique, so much so that I can remember them with ease despite not playing Prime since 2003 when it first came out.

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by The Watching Artist » Mon Aug 27, 2018 11:43 am

Johnny Ryall wrote:I've not given up on prime 1, but I'm definitely taking a break. Definitely think the genre works better in 2d.

I think I'd agree with this. At least when compared to Prime 1 (and probably 2 from what I know). Whilst I'd agree with Alvin and Hime that being in 3D allows for an extra level of immersion and a better sense of place (as well as cool puzzles) to me the 2D ones have a pace to them that was never really captured in 3D.

For me its how being in 3D slows down traversal. Which in turn makes backtracking such a chore in Prime 1. Why I never finished it yet I've beaten Super and Fusion and will soon beat Returns. Thanks to the teleporting in Returns I even hope to 100% it. Now I enjoyed backtracking in Prime at first. In fact I really did. It got me in that Zelda place. :wub: But after a while..... strawberry float me it was boring. Just going through the same room and corridor over and over. Waiting for doors to load. Getting shot in the back because I couldn't be arsed fighting the constantly respawning enemies. Having to stop to check the map in case I went the wrong way and that moment you got in the wrong elevator and oh god please don't remind me. :dread: I've seen people say its as good a 2D to 3D leap as Mario and Zelda but I don't think I agree. They had a hub area which everything else built off and crucially for me OOT had a warping system. Want to try out the new ability on the thing you spotted earlier? Its not that far away but you can warp or even get on a horse to make the journey quicker. I remember playing Prime when it came out (it was my first Metroid btw) and late on in the game it dawned on me. I have a spaceship. A mothing strawberry floating spaceship. Why am I going through these shitty lava corridors over and over and over and over? Why cant I use it to fly to parts of the map? Probably because it had to be like Super Metroid. Its why I always enjoyed 3 more. Although I still didn't finish it. Please don't put a pointless fetch quest in 4. Pleeeeeeeeeease.

You should see me now in Returns. I'm so much quicker and more agile. Just murdering every little creature in my way. Charging back through areas looking for extra missiles and health tanks. Its awesome. And I can teleport. Which is a godsend because even in 2D having to go back to area one via all the others areas would be such a shitfest. It's like they added anti-slog cream. :wub:

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PostRe: Metroid Appreciation Thread - Come Inside and Talk About All Things Metroid
by Cheeky Devlin » Mon Aug 27, 2018 1:09 pm

Just finished Prime 2: Echoes for the first time and yeah I think it's the weakest of the three so far.

Really didn't like the last two fights which were just a slog. Plus with Prime when you scanned a boss it would show you critical information on the pop-up. Prime 2 will give you "some" information, but then you have to actually go into the menu and read the "full" entry to get critical information on how to beat it because you're expected to do something that you've never had to do at all during the game.

The menu's wouldn't be so bad if they were the same as Prime, but the "rotating" choices and number of them make going into it too time consuming as well.

The automatic damage in Dark Aether is a nice idea, but I'd find myself just standing in the light bubbles waiting for health to recharge. It's arguably too late in the game before you get the Light Suit, but I can see how getting it any earlier would negate the point of the light bubbles.

Enemies are far too spongey (Especially early on) and the world is a lot more of a chore to navigate.

All that said it's still a great game, just maybe a touch too grating at times.

Corruption up next which I remember enjoying so we'll see how it goes.

Oh and Prime 1 is a masterpiece and is easily up there with Mario and Zelda for 2D-3D transitions. Both of them feel different from their 2D counterparts and while Prime isn't quite as good as either Mario 64 or Ocarina of Time, it's easily as impressive as a work of translating the game design to 3D. The backtracking for me isn't particularly bad because everytime I went somewhere to do something, I was getting other stuff on the way as well. 3D in first person was always going to result in a slower, more considered game and the pay-off in terms of a more immersive world was worth the reduction in movement speed and agility and I never once felt like I was hamstrung by it.

You could also argue that there are "lore" reasons why you can't use the ship in Prime. It's mostly set underground and the only real "outdoor" area apart from Tallon Overworld (Where the ship is), is Phendrana, where the Space Pirate base is set up. It's not inconceivable that they have Anti-Air defences. But I admit that's a stretch. :lol:

In Echoes your ship just gets damaged at the start.

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