Media/older generation's perception that games are for kids and how this can be changed

No. It would be like outgrowing films or music.

I might outgrow certain genres and types of videogames over time but that's it.

NickSCFC wrote:Does anyone know of younger people who have this "gaming is for kids/nerds" mindset, or is it purely a generational thing?

I think there is a divide between "acceptable" gaming and other games. Fifa, COD and Assassin's Creed on PS or Xbone won't raise any objections, but plenty of younger people still see Nintendo as just for kids or PC gaming as very geeky.

The same attitudes exist in film, books and music though, so that's probably more of a mainstream vs subculture thing.

Gemini73

NickSCFC wrote:Does anyone know of younger people who have this "gaming is for kids/nerds" mindset, or is it purely a generational thing?

Not that I can think of, but I know plenty of younger folk who have no interest in gaming.

NickSCFC wrote:Does anyone know of younger people who have this "gaming is for kids/nerds" mindset, or is it purely a generational thing?

There’s a girl my wife works who has that sort of attitude. She’s in her mid-20s and when my wife was telling her that I game, she was saying “well I wouldn’t put up with that from my husband!”, my wife said it didn’t bother her and that I don’t spend that much time doing it, but this girl was adamant that she wouldn’t let her husband play games.

What’s funny is her husband is a professional golf coach and spends all of his free time playing golf. Maybe she just likes getting him out of the house. :lol:

Moggy wrote:As we all get older, gaming is only going to become more mainstream amongst the pensioners. And when we are retired, we might then have the time for those massive sprawling adventures.

This is why backwards compatibility is such an important thing. I'll never be able to complete my backlog of 360 games if I'm spending my twilight years searching car boot sales for non-RROD'd consoles!

NickSCFC

Jenuall wrote:
Moggy wrote:As we all get older, gaming is only going to become more mainstream amongst the pensioners. And when we are retired, we might then have the time for those massive sprawling adventures.

This is why backwards compatibility is such an important thing. I'll never be able to complete my backlog of 360 games if I'm spending my twilight years searching car boot sales for non-RROD'd consoles!

Exactly, the last 20 years worth of physical movie releases play on the latest Blu-ray players, so it should also apply to games.

Gemini73

I believe a lot of people's perception of games and gaming has as much to do with their environment than anything else, regardless of age.

My father, for example, has always taken an interest in my gaming since I was a kid and fully appreciates why both children and adults alike enjoy it. Dad is 71 and likes playing RTS games on his PC, which he specifically asked me help him put together. It's not a monster, but it's sufficient enough to play those RTS games he enjoys. I even got him playing Quake, which he thoroughly enjoys even though it scares the crap out of him! As huge Western movie fan I did show him RDR one time and he was thoroughly impressed at how much it captured the tone of those movie classics. Actually he's consistently astounded by how far video games have come since that C+4 my parents got me one Christmas when I was a nipper.

So yeah, at 71 my dad is not only interested in video games he's a gamer himself.

NickSCFC wrote:
Jenuall wrote:
Moggy wrote:As we all get older, gaming is only going to become more mainstream amongst the pensioners. And when we are retired, we might then have the time for those massive sprawling adventures.

This is why backwards compatibility is such an important thing. I'll never be able to complete my backlog of 360 games if I'm spending my twilight years searching car boot sales for non-RROD'd consoles!

Exactly, the last 20 years worth of physical movie releases play on the latest Blu-ray players, so it should also apply to games.

DVD might have existed 20 years ago but people were still buying VHS. Try fitting one of those into your Blu-ray player.

I'm sure with hammer and patience you can fit VHS in there.

It being working is different matter, however.

NickSCFC

Here's a good article from earlier in the year, sums up how I feel really.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/games/30-04-20 ... ed-gaming/

Despite video games being one of the world’s biggest entertainment industries, there is still an undeniable stigma in telling some people you play video games – especially as you grow older. If you are a gamer, there are probably situations where you are comfortable discussing books, movies and TV, but you wouldn’t openly discuss video game, like at work or family gatherings.

You have to be wary, because many people still see video games as being for children, and as such, any adult who plays them is considered juvenile.

This perception is understandable considering that at the birth of the industry in the ’70s and ’80s video games were specifically marketed to children. But now those young gamers are in their 30s and 40s – changing the demographics of the gaming industry significantly. In fact, since the ’80s the average age of gamers has steadily increased, and the average gamer is now 35 years old.

As a result, the representation of young people in the video game industry has shrunk – as of last year, people under 18 only made up 28% of gamers.

As the players and creators of games have matured, so have the games – both in the type of content being created and the issues and themes they tackle. While ten years ago blood and boobs seemed to be gaming’s main obsessions, now stories deal with familial responsibility and existential crises.

The rest of the article is basically about God of War.

NickSCFC

Gemini73

NickSCFC wrote:Here's a good article from earlier in the year, sums up how I feel really.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/games/30-04-20 ... ed-gaming/

Despite video games being one of the world’s biggest entertainment industries, there is still an undeniable stigma in telling some people you play video games – especially as you grow older. If you are a gamer, there are probably situations where you are comfortable discussing books, movies and TV, but you wouldn’t openly discuss video game, like at work or family gatherings.

You have to be wary, because many people still see video games as being for children, and as such, any adult who plays them is considered juvenile.

This perception is understandable considering that at the birth of the industry in the ’70s and ’80s video games were specifically marketed to children. But now those young gamers are in their 30s and 40s – changing the demographics of the gaming industry significantly. In fact, since the ’80s the average age of gamers has steadily increased, and the average gamer is now 35 years old.

As a result, the representation of young people in the video game industry has shrunk – as of last year, people under 18 only made up 28% of gamers.

As the players and creators of games have matured, so have the games – both in the type of content being created and the issues and themes they tackle. While ten years ago blood and boobs seemed to be gaming’s main obsessions, now stories deal with familial responsibility and existential crises.

The rest of the article is basically about God of War.

While there's no denying the truth of the above it strikes me, and somewhat based on experience, that for those who have firmly made up their mind that video games are solely the pastime of children, (and for those adults who engage in the hobby "need to grow up"), they won't be swayed from that train of thought no matter what evidence one puts forward to the contrary.

NickSCFC wrote:

The video completely fails to recognise that the actual gameplay hasn't matured at all though. Progress in both games can only be achieved by killing your way forwards, with body counts well into the multiple hundreds. As much as people might want games to be considered a normal entertainment medium, until they're able to invent a mainstream gameplay mechanic that doesn't involve acting like an utter psychopath, they'll continue to be viewed as an immature medium, that's invaluable of dealing with the dissonance of having sane and relatable characters, who have to do insane and unrelatable things. Meanwhile, hardcore gamers will shriek about games without combat just being walking simulators, and they get relegated to niche indie status.

Knoyleo wrote:until they're able to invent a mainstream gameplay mechanic that doesn't involve acting like an utter psychopath

Fifa and racing games spring to mind

Gemini73 wrote:
NickSCFC wrote:Here's a good article from earlier in the year, sums up how I feel really.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/games/30-04-20 ... ed-gaming/

Despite video games being one of the world’s biggest entertainment industries, there is still an undeniable stigma in telling some people you play video games – especially as you grow older. If you are a gamer, there are probably situations where you are comfortable discussing books, movies and TV, but you wouldn’t openly discuss video game, like at work or family gatherings.

You have to be wary, because many people still see video games as being for children, and as such, any adult who plays them is considered juvenile.

This perception is understandable considering that at the birth of the industry in the ’70s and ’80s video games were specifically marketed to children. But now those young gamers are in their 30s and 40s – changing the demographics of the gaming industry significantly. In fact, since the ’80s the average age of gamers has steadily increased, and the average gamer is now 35 years old.

As a result, the representation of young people in the video game industry has shrunk – as of last year, people under 18 only made up 28% of gamers.

As the players and creators of games have matured, so have the games – both in the type of content being created and the issues and themes they tackle. While ten years ago blood and boobs seemed to be gaming’s main obsessions, now stories deal with familial responsibility and existential crises.

The rest of the article is basically about God of War.

While there's no denying the truth of the above it strikes me, and somewhat based on experience, that for those who have firmly made up their mind that video games are solely the pastime of children, (and for those adults who engage in the hobby "need to grow up"), they won't be swayed from that train of thought no matter what evidence one puts forward to the contrary.

True, there will always be people who have made up their minds and are simply incapable of seeing something for what it really is rather than the conclusion they have already arrived at.

Awareness and familiarity with the broad spectrum of what actually constitutes "video games" are still probably the things that are most needed in order to change the way the hobby is perceived in wider circles. Many people simply aren't aware that gaming has long since evolved beyond pacman, mario and sonic. In fact even way back when there were always experiences that sought to tackle more "grown up" subjects than this - it's just that most people don't know about it.

Take the article quoted above, despite seeming to offer a sympathetic view of the situation and being written from a position of knowledge, even there the writer still says things like:

While ten years ago blood and boobs seemed to be gaming’s main obsessions

The gaming landscape offered plenty beyond that in 2008! :fp:

It's like judging the film industry just on Star Wars, Fast and Furious and the MCU - "those are the big films therefore movies just care about explosions, fast cars and alien boobies!"

It will take time but eventually awareness will improve and people will realise that gaming is, and has always been, about far more than kids toys, boobs and blood.

Gemini73

Knoyleo wrote:
NickSCFC wrote:

The video completely fails to recognise that the actual gameplay hasn't matured at all though. Progress in both games can only be achieved by killing your way forwards, with body counts well into the multiple hundreds. As much as people might want games to be considered a normal entertainment medium, until they're able to invent a mainstream gameplay mechanic that doesn't involve acting like an utter psychopath, they'll continue to be viewed as an immature medium, that's invaluable of dealing with the dissonance of having sane and relatable characters, who have to do insane and unrelatable things. Meanwhile, hardcore gamers will shriek about games without combat just being walking simulators, and they get relegated to niche indie status.

That's a good point. I read a piece not long back where the author felt that outside of visuals and animation, and the occasional game that tackles real life issues/scenarios, video games generally haven't really evolved at all since 1998.

Be buggered if I remember where I read it though.

Gemini73 wrote:That's a good point. I read a piece not long back where the author felt that outside of visuals and animation, and the occasional game that tackles real life issues/scenarios, video games generally haven't really evolved at all since 1998.

Far, far more than visuals and animation have changed since 1998, from how we play multiplayer and pay for games to UI and control conventions and game structures. You'd have to really narrow down the argument to the approach to combat/conflict and failure states to make a good point I think. Even in failure states you could talk about checkpointing and lives.

Gemini73

OrangeRKN wrote:
Gemini73 wrote:That's a good point. I read a piece not long back where the author felt that outside of visuals and animation, and the occasional game that tackles real life issues/scenarios, video games generally haven't really evolved at all since 1998.

Far, far more than visuals and animation have changed since 1998, from how we play multiplayer and pay for games to UI and control conventions and game structures. You'd have to really narrow down the argument to the approach to combat/conflict and failure states to make a good point I think. Even in failure states you could talk about checkpointing and lives.

It's more to do with the core mechanics of games that haven't really evolved. For example, strip back Uncharted 4's aesthetic and you find nothing has really changed since any other action/adventure game from 20 odd years ago. I think that was the point the author was making. For me it would certainly explain why I'm not as thrilled by many of the new games being released as perhaps I once was. A case of been there, done that.

I think some generations will simply never get video games or see them as a valid form of entertainment. The lady who sits opposite me at work who I think is in her late 50's is always telling me I need to get out more whenever I mention video games whereas she is always talking about shite she watches on TV.

Why is shite TV considered a valid form of entertainment but as a gamer I need to get out more?

NickSCFC

Gemini73 wrote:It's more to do with the core mechanics of games that haven't really evolved. For example, strip back Uncharted 4's aesthetic and you find nothing has really changed since any other action/adventure game from 20 odd years ago. I think that was the point the author was making. For me it would certainly explain why I'm not as thrilled by many of the new games being released as perhaps I once was. A case of been there, done that.

There's definitely a lack of big budget mature games that aren't centred around violence. I'd love a big budget investigation game like a modern day Broken Sword but with graphics and controls similar to Uncharted or Resi 4.

Media/older generation's perception that games are for kids and how this can be changed

Will youever "outgrow" videogames?

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