Grumpy David wrote:It's reasonable to expect to see ID and Proof of Address to rent somewhere or get a new job or claim a pension.
But what a cock up for successive governments to never formalise the process and provide actual paperwork to prove that people arriving before 1971 when they had free movement from the commonwealth were then either naturalised or given indefinite leave to remain.
Home office requirements are so tough that from what I understand you needed to prove you lived in the UK for every individual year to qualify which would be tough even today, let alone before the digital era. I couldn't prove what primary school I attended as it's been turned into New Build Flats. Perhaps National Insurance records might help once someone turned 16 though?
Free passports for all affected and obviously compensation for those who might have been deported / lost their job / had state pension delayed is clearly necessary and appropriate to undo any financial loss.
You must realise your Leave vote contributed to this though? You voted for this government to enact these rules.
Non-EU immigration rules are completely separate to the EU/Brexit vote.
The government official position was to Remain. They spent 7 million sending out leaflets to remind us.
Your point would be stronger if it was "You voted for this government" but it's certainly possible to agree with some policies and disagree with others so even then it wouldn't be a particularly worthwhile thing to post.
So that largely immigration vote that happened has nothing to do with immigration? I call BS on that I'm afraid.
Your point of the governments position to remain makes even less sense.
We were always able to control immigration numbers from outside the EU.
The immigration argument was that we have no control over the quality or quantity of EU immigration.
They are separate points. Being in or out of the EU doesn't affect policy on non EU immigration.
You calling BS is irrelevant. You're wrong.
The official position of the government was to Remain but individual cabinet members were free to disagree and support the Leave campaign. You mentioned I voted for this government although the policies were introduced under the previous government which I didn't vote for.
Well clearly they are linked, otherwise this strawberry float up wouldn't have happened!
A spectre is hanging over Britain, and that spectre has come to be known as “gammon”: older men who, despite having all the opportunities that baby boomers enjoyed, are confused and angry at the modern world. It’s a condition that once manifested itself as an affinity to UKIP, but now more so to high blood pressure and a red meat complexion.
Moggy wrote:I could probably come up with a number of things that Thatcher, Major, Blair, Brown and Cameron did that were either decent or competent.
I don't recall the unholy coalition trinity of Cameron/Clegg/Osborne ever doing anything that was either decent or competent.
That was inevitable no matter who was in office, surely?
Probably, but they were the ones who did it.
How much credit do they really deserve, though, if it was an inevitability?
They deserve the credit for actually doing it. Blair didn’t, Brown didn’t, Cameron/Clegg did.
Lots of things are inevitable eventually.
Slavery was always going to be banned eventually, but Wilberforce/Lincoln deserve credit for ending it.
Civil rights would have happened eventually but Martin Luther King deserves credit for his efforts.
The Nazis would have fallen eventually, but the UK/USA/Russia get the credit for stopping it.
The question was based on doing something decent and/or competent, not on doing something that would happen eventually.
I agree with the point, but not the best examples. There's no certainty the Nazis would've failed if they hadn't ballsed their own tactics up and MLK was one part of a massive group of people and organisations who pushed for civil rights in the 1960s, most of whom really don't get enough credit.
Corazon de Leon wrote:I agree with the point, but not the best examples. There's no certainty the Nazis would've failed if they hadn't ballsed their own tactics up and MLK was one part of a massive group of people and organisations who pushed for civil rights in the 1960s, most of whom really don't get enough credit.
He becomes a doctor and then immediately starts lecturing everyone.
You are probably right, I was just writing a quick post and trying to use famous examples of people getting the credit for things that were probably inevitable.
Another Cameron/Clegg thing that I give them credit for is upping the threshold for tax, I think pushing it up to over £12k was a decent thing to do (even if the higher tax rate was reduced).