'Are You A Grinch?' - Grinches, Grinches Everywhere!

[sawyerpip]

Banjo was a major turning point, I'm not convinced we'd have won without that.

Me seeing Staydead's post also helped, I knew I could trust Ironhide then.

I most enjoyed misleading Oblomov early on. I blagged him into believing I had a role (as he was gunning for me!) and he seemed convinced I was the third wise man

Great game Drummy! Although next time the minimum post count should be set much much higher.

you mean this post:

strawberry floating hell

What was your thinking behind that post Qikz? Did you think Ironhide was lying after Vlasoul died?

[Drumstick]

What did people did think about the changes?

The Seer only receiving alignment was supposed to encourage contact with the seered players, as the option of waiting to seer a special role had been removed.

The lack of a Mayor, someone to be accountable for the day's vote, went better than I expected. People seemed to adapt quickly and began to see the advantages of this setup.

Role names listed in OP, but not the number of, or role descriptions... I think was a good change. It allows people to know which roles are in the game, but it still allows players to falsely claim a role if they need to.

Edit: Oh yeah and the variable post quota

[Preezy]

I honestly didn't miss the mayor voting at all, it was a nice change of pace.

[Moggy]

The changes were a nice change, it's always good to mix things up and keep us guessing.

I have never been a fan of inactive culls and so wasn't a big fan of the post per day quota. Even though I was in no danger and it really helped us (Banjo!).

[Pancake]

What was the intention behind the quota? I'm not sure it really solved the problem of inactivity if that was the idea, rather I felt that it just moved the goalposts since there were plenty of people making enough posts to fill the quota but they were still inactive to all intents and purposes.

[Dual]

Well done villagers.

[Drumstick]

What was the intention behind the quota? I'm not sure it really solved the problem of inactivity if that was the idea, rather I felt that it just moved the goalposts since there were plenty of people making enough posts to fill the quota but they were still inactive to all intents and purposes.

The complaint of 'active' players being killed off, skewing the ratio of active to inactive players and thus leaving the game ripe for manipulation by the wolves is a very, very long-standing one, which is why this step of a quota has been taken. Parksey will remember DML's 'spaceship' version, where he was basically the last hope for the Human cause because by Day 5 or so all the other active players had been wiped out and player apathy then set in. A quota doesn't guarantee worthwhile context, but it does at least tell everyone that, despite some folks appearing inactive, they are actually paying attention to the game enough to make the bare minimum number of posts required to avoid culling.

The way I see it there are two types of inactives: true inactives that are disengages from the game; and others that don't necessarily have a great deal to say or contribute but who are following the game. The quota allows us to distinguish between those but it isn't a guarantee of top-tier, higher echelon posts.

The question then becomes; why is someone appearing to make the most minimal of efforts to seem active? Do they have something to hide? And is understanding the cause for their alleged lack of effort in itself a legitimate reason for killing them in the day phase?

We saw in this game several people were killed for skating along on the brink of the quota.

[Qikz]

Banjo was a major turning point, I'm not convinced we'd have won without that.

Me seeing Staydead's post also helped, I knew I could trust Ironhide then.

I most enjoyed misleading Oblomov early on. I blagged him into believing I had a role (as he was gunning for me!) and he seemed convinced I was the third wise man

Great game Drummy! Although next time the minimum post count should be set much much higher.

you mean this post:

strawberry floating hell

What was your thinking behind that post Qikz? Did you think Ironhide was lying after Vlasoul died?

Exactly, I got spooked when Vlasoul died and assumed Ironhide was lying the whole time.

What did people did think about the changes?

The Seer only receiving alignment was supposed to encourage contact with the seered players, as the option of waiting to seer a special role had been removed.

The lack of a Mayor, someone to be accountable for the day's vote, went better than I expected. People seemed to adapt quickly and began to see the advantages of this setup.

Role names listed in OP, but not the number of, or role descriptions... I think was a good change. It allows people to know which roles are in the game, but it still allows players to falsely claim a role if they need to.

Edit: Oh yeah and the variable post quota

The seer only recieving allignment was great, but because the alpha could still be seered as good (or could he?) it meant the seer couldn't be sure that someone wasn't the alpha. I personally would remove the Alpha's immunity and make them immune to night kills or something.

I preferred not having to vote twice a day so no mayor was good.

I think role names were great, but naming something Rudolph... when there was two lead to us killing Hypes thinking he was bullshitting lol.

[Tsunade]

Was I the only villager not in some sort of group?

[Tomous]

lmao - but you couldn't kill us

I got Dan seer'd and I got DML killed. The other two you killed me first you bastards.

StayDead taking all the credit for my kill I see

[Tomous]

If Banjo posts enough posts, I think the grinches win. Ah well. Good game, shame I got killed for a change in post style which was literally dictated by life being busy.

How did your life being busy make your posts feel so grinchy?



Cheers for running Drummy. Another great game for the archives

[Pedz]

Was I the only villager not in some sort of group?

I wasn't.

[Hypes]

What did people did think about the changes?

The Seer only receiving alignment was supposed to encourage contact with the seered players, as the option of waiting to seer a special role had been removed.

The lack of a Mayor, someone to be accountable for the day's vote, went better than I expected. People seemed to adapt quickly and began to see the advantages of this setup.

Role names listed in OP, but not the number of, or role descriptions... I think was a good change. It allows people to know which roles are in the game, but it still allows players to falsely claim a role if they need to.

Edit: Oh yeah and the variable post quota

I thought they were good, lack of mayor stopped the protection circle nonsense.
We still ended up with a main Superfriends group and then some wannabe ones which is always annoying as I feel everything should be in thread.

Liked the variable post quota as it meant people couldn't really hide on the brink of inactivity.

Would have been nice if the vigis could kill at any time but I'm not sure if that's ever been the case and would mean you would have to constantly monitor PM's.

The not knowing numbers of roles I think only really gives an advantage to the Grinches. It might have been good to know what the difference was between the Alpha and the other Grinches as well

Was exciting to finally get a role in one of these games even if I didn't get to use it. Still, not killing anyone is the second best outcome

[sawyerpip]

I'd be interested in a no PMs game. Although from discussion in the death thread the previous attempts weren't particularly successful?

I think the new rules worked well all around. Inactivity culls are hard to get right but I feel like it's something that needs to be part of the game, if there's nothing which prevents inactivity you potentially end up with a lot of bored/inactive players and it's very easy for the wolves to hide amongst them which I think makes things really difficult for the villagers, and also a boring game. I'm not sure what the ideal solution is but I definitely think there needs to be some penalty to complete inactivity.

The new seer rule helped maintain an element of uncertainty until the Alpha was killed. It does seem in previous games sometimes it has been a waiting game until the seer finds special roles, so I think players had to perhaps make more of a judgement based on posting styles in this one. I don't think there were any instances where a player in thread was 100% confirmed as good until Dual was killed.

I think anonymous accounts might be worth a try again. I think one of the first games I was involved in had them, and I know it's a lot of work, but I think Banjo made the point early in the game where a lot of discussion was based on how people have acted previously, and things can end up centred around players who are proven as good players of the game from the last 10+ years of history, which not everyone playing is aware of.

EDIT: I think the rarity of this games is both a help and a hindrance. It keeps the games feeling really special and fun, but if known good players are targeted early then it probably makes it difficult for those people to enjoy as they never tend to last long. Obviously these games are incredibly difficult to run so I appreciate why they are only once or twice a year, but I think that perhaps lends an argument to using anonymous accounts. Which only increases the workload so perhaps it's a catch-22

[Parksey]

I guess I'll be clearing some space on my trophy shelf for the inevitable MVP award.

[satriales]

Was I the only villager not in some sort of group?

I wasn't.

Me neither. I sent one PM all game and that was just asking every remaining player if they were the Grinch.
Kezzer was the only one who said yes.

[satriales]

Catching up up on the death thread...

What if Satriales has played the perfect Grinch game since Ironhide was killed? He fingered Banjo very early on (a classic Grinch move if there is no danger) and now killed the Alpha, who is going to question him now?

I had this same thought after dual was killed. If I was a Grinch I could probably win from there!

In fact with the lack of mourning period after the alpha is killed there is no difference between an alpha and a normal wolf once all seers are gone. Sacrificing the alpha at the point could be a very strong move for the wolves.

[Moggy]

Was I the only villager not in some sort of group?

I wasn't.

Me neither. I sent one PM all game and that was just asking every remaining player if they were the Grinch.
Kezzer was the only one who said yes.

I forgot Kezzer said he was a grinch. That was a ballsy move

[Vermilion]

Well done villagers.

Eeeek, grinch scum!

Exactly, I got spooked when Vlasoul died and assumed Ironhide was lying the whole time.

This was the same for me, even more so when you got killed almost immediately after.

I swear, the paranoia this game creates is really something else.

[That's not a growth]

Nice one for running this Drummy. Damn you Vermi.