Brexit Thread 2

[Moggy]

Who is his dad?

Some dead bloke that raised a complete banana split.

[Squinty]

Who is his dad?

Some dead bloke that raised a complete banana split.

[Tomous]

If the UK went completely green, and emitted as little emissions as possible how big of an effect would it have on a global scale? How many extra years would the tipping point be pushed back?

I know it isn't going to happen, I'm just wondering if this small country will make that much of a difference when you have places like the US, China, India and other places 100s of times the size of the UK pumping gooseberry fool into the atmosphere. I'm also not saying we as a country shouldn't bother reducing stuffs. I'm just curious, is all.

Well we are one of the worst polluters as we consume so much stuff. While countries like India and China have large populations, they don't consume on the scale we do (food and clothing being 2 of the biggest populating industries)

We are also in that situation where people in other countries say the same thing... "what's the point, what will we really be able to change". If one country makes a radical change then that should be enough for other countries to follow, and if they don't follow then we are strawberry floated anyway. At least we tried.

And if we survive this climate problem then we have do deal with the automation and AI problem hopefully those can be used to aide the climate issue.

Also, is it not the case that because we effectively consume so many Chinese made goods, we (and much of the Western world) are effectively "outsourcing" our carbon footprint to places like China? It doesn't seem fair to be responsible for a lot of their production output and then turn round and blame them for their waste etc.

[BID0]

As I said, I wasn't saying what's the point, I was merely asking how long would the UK going green push back the tipping point?

Yes sorry I wasn't blaming you!! It is however almost impossible to predict how much longer we could add on the clock because...

Also, is it not the case that because we effectively consume so many Chinese made goods, we (and much of the Western world) are effectively "outsourcing" our carbon footprint to places like China? It doesn't seem fair to be responsible for a lot of their production output and then turn round and blame them for their waste etc.

Of the above. And also it was brought up in recent interviews during the last extinction rebellion event when Michael Gove claimed we have never been doing better on our climate targets, that in fact the UK doesn't record our emissions properly (shipping amongst other things are not counted by our government).

But despite being a small island with a "small" population, we would certainly make a big impact even if we were to be the only country to change.

Also China and India are always (I think) unfairly labelled as the worst polluters when they are making some great strides in solar etc. Growing economies have the benefit of not having the infrastructure there so it's easier for them to slap a solar panel up on their house in the middle of nowhere and get their electric without building massive fossil fuel plants.

[Mini E]

There’s something reassuring about a Twitter dickhead being GRcade’d.

[Moggy]

There’s something reassuring about a Twitter dickhead being GRcade’d.

Christ, I’m turning into Glowy.

[BID0]

I'll add that to my end of the world list

[Squinty]

That is top quality Twitter posting right there

[Moggy]

twitter.com/independent/status/1134480402561753088

It’s not a “furious tirade” and yes Iraq, Iraq, Iraq, but he’s completely correct in that video.

[Meep]

As I said, I wasn't saying what's the point, I was merely asking how long would the UK going green push back the tipping point?

Yes sorry I wasn't blaming you!! It is however almost impossible to predict how much longer we could add on the clock because...

Also, is it not the case that because we effectively consume so many Chinese made goods, we (and much of the Western world) are effectively "outsourcing" our carbon footprint to places like China? It doesn't seem fair to be responsible for a lot of their production output and then turn round and blame them for their waste etc.

Of the above. And also it was brought up in recent interviews during the last extinction rebellion event when Michael Gove claimed we have never been doing better on our climate targets, that in fact the UK doesn't record our emissions properly (shipping amongst other things are not counted by our government).

But despite being a small island with a "small" population, we would certainly make a big impact even if we were to be the only country to change.

Also China and India are always (I think) unfairly labelled as the worst polluters when they are making some great strides in solar etc. Growing economies have the benefit of not having the infrastructure there so it's easier for them to slap a solar panel up on their house in the middle of nowhere and get their electric without building massive fossil fuel plants.

100% agree. China are actually on par with the UK if you measure emissions per capita, which is amazing when you consider how much more industrial output they have. The main reason the UK has managed to beat so many other developed countries is because Thatcher devastated so much of British industry and closed factories don't generate emissions. However, everyone still needs the stuff factories produce so there is a huge import of 'embodied carbon' into the UK in the form of products that required significant emissions to produce. If we start counting that then the UK does not look anywhere near as favourable.

If we want to take things seriously we need to measure the environmental impact of everything we consume.

[poshrule_uk]

twitter.com/independent/status/1134480402561753088

It’s not a “furious tirade” and yes Iraq, Iraq, Iraq, but he’s completely correct in that video.

But we won two World wars... (jokes)

Do people think remain could do with a charismatic figurehead like farage or Johnson? Why can't we have someone who can play them at there own game

[That]

Right wing politics is very emotive. We're being attacked by so-and-so, defend yourself! These people are lazy &/ weird, punish them! This country is better than that country, be proud!

It's tougher to tap in to that kind of rhetoric when your argument is based on facts. Particularly for centre-left socdems who are arguing for incremental reform rather than sweeping changes.

It's possible and would be good though. @AOC has decent rallying power in the states.

[more heat than light]

David Lammy is probably our best shout. He's really passionate and speaks very well. Good social media presence too.

[Moggy]

twitter.com/independent/status/1134480402561753088

It’s not a “furious tirade” and yes Iraq, Iraq, Iraq, but he’s completely correct in that video.

But we won two World wars... (jokes)

Do people think remain could do with a charismatic figurehead like farage or Johnson? Why can't we have someone who can play them at there own game

Farage or Johnson would completely collapse if they had to deal with facts.

It’s easy to make wild promises that you won’t personally have to keep*, it’s much harder when you are telling people the current situation is better than the alternative.

*if Johnson gets the leadership then he will hopefully get bit on the arse soon when he has to start delivering his bullshit.

[Moggy]

Labour may not campaign for Remain in a second Brexit referendum, Shami Chakrabarti has said.

In comments likely to anger the party’s strongly pro-EU membership, she told the BBC’s Today programme that a fresh vote would “be a reluctant means of breaking a deadlock”.

Asked if Labour would support Remain, she said: “That would be for the party to decide in a general election.”

The shadow attorney general said the party could instead ask voters to get behind a Labour Brexit deal.

https://m.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/la ... ccounter=2

[Outrunner]

The problem with the likes of Farage and Johnson is that they simply don't deal with facts. Confront them with something and they shift the narrative, fact check them and they'll come out with some easily quotable quip and shift the narrative again.

[Lex-Man]

Labour may not campaign for Remain in a second Brexit referendum, Shami Chakrabarti has said.

In comments likely to anger the party’s strongly pro-EU membership, she told the BBC’s Today programme that a fresh vote would “be a reluctant means of breaking a deadlock”.

Asked if Labour would support Remain, she said: “That would be for the party to decide in a general election.”

The shadow attorney general said the party could instead ask voters to get behind a Labour Brexit deal.

https://m.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/la ... ccounter=2

I'm very happy as they're just handing voters to the Lib Dems and Greens. It'll be far better to hand power to them at the moment.

[Moggy]

Labour may not campaign for Remain in a second Brexit referendum, Shami Chakrabarti has said.

In comments likely to anger the party’s strongly pro-EU membership, she told the BBC’s Today programme that a fresh vote would “be a reluctant means of breaking a deadlock”.

Asked if Labour would support Remain, she said: “That would be for the party to decide in a general election.”

The shadow attorney general said the party could instead ask voters to get behind a Labour Brexit deal.

https://m.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/la ... ccounter=2

I'm very happy as they're just handing voters to the Lib Dems and Greens. It'll be far better to hand power to them at the moment.

Trouble is that left wing votes are too split.

Left: Labour, Lib Dem, Green, SNP, Plaid Cymru

Right: Tory, Brexit Party

It wouldn’t be so bad if the left wing parties could agree to cooperate and/or go into coalition. But the daft strawberry floats won’t.

[Lex-Man]

Labour may not campaign for Remain in a second Brexit referendum, Shami Chakrabarti has said.

In comments likely to anger the party’s strongly pro-EU membership, she told the BBC’s Today programme that a fresh vote would “be a reluctant means of breaking a deadlock”.

Asked if Labour would support Remain, she said: “That would be for the party to decide in a general election.”

The shadow attorney general said the party could instead ask voters to get behind a Labour Brexit deal.

https://m.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/la ... ccounter=2

I'm very happy as they're just handing voters to the Lib Dems and Greens. It'll be far better to hand power to them at the moment.

Trouble is that left wing votes are too split.

Left: Labour, Lib Dem, Green, SNP, Plaid Cymru

Right: Tory, Brexit Party

It wouldn’t be so bad if the left wing parties could agree to cooperate and/or go into coalition. But the daft strawberry floats won’t.

I think the smaller ones will other than Labour who are dead set on brexit.

[Moggy]

Labour may not campaign for Remain in a second Brexit referendum, Shami Chakrabarti has said.

In comments likely to anger the party’s strongly pro-EU membership, she told the BBC’s Today programme that a fresh vote would “be a reluctant means of breaking a deadlock”.

Asked if Labour would support Remain, she said: “That would be for the party to decide in a general election.”

The shadow attorney general said the party could instead ask voters to get behind a Labour Brexit deal.

https://m.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/la ... ccounter=2

I'm very happy as they're just handing voters to the Lib Dems and Greens. It'll be far better to hand power to them at the moment.

Trouble is that left wing votes are too split.

Left: Labour, Lib Dem, Green, SNP, Plaid Cymru

Right: Tory, Brexit Party

It wouldn’t be so bad if the left wing parties could agree to cooperate and/or go into coalition. But the daft strawberry floats won’t.

I think the smaller ones will other than Labour who are dead set on brexit.

They probably would but without Labour they wouldn’t have enough seats to take power.