Ched Evans - should he play football again?

[iup=3593981]Poser[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3592534]Grumpy David[/iup] wrote:I had a look on the website Evans girlfriend set up for him, there's a video of the girl walking into the hotel and she doesn't look unable to consent if her walking drunk ability is any indication. Also her deleted tweets about "winning big" makes me question whether she wanted justice or money.

I'd not seen that site. The review into his conviction is gathering pace, too, so it will be interesting to see how that pans out and, if he is exonerated, I'll happily eat my previous words.

However, this picture did make me laugh. 'Nobody who climbs a hill with a stick could possibly rape someone...'

If he is exonerated, what happens to the girl who made the accusation?

I don't know. But I don't think he will be. He was found guilty by a group of his peers; his subsequent appeal was rejected.



What is seedy is some of the evidence that has been put forward in his 'defence' on that website.

Friend texts him to say 'I've got a bird'. Ched, who is in a relationship, immediately diverts the taxi he's in to the hotel where his friend and this 'bird' can be found. He has a key and goes in.

(The girl was so drunk she had been falling over - she had been on the floor of the kebab house when she and Ched first encountered each other that night. He had to step over her. She also left her handbag in the kebab place.)

What's more, Ched's brother and another friend are loitering outside the hotel window, attempting to film what went on.


Now, none of this is indicative of whether or not consent was given, which I realise is the central point. But as an illustration of his character and frame of mind on the night in question, it's quite revealing. And Ched's people have put this forward in his defence.

To think, his girlfriend has stood by him through this. I'd like to think my Mrs would have enough self respect to drop me like a stone if I had gone out of my way to strawberry float a girl at all, let alone one who was a) that drunk and b) already being strawberry floated by another man.

It's all here, apart from my additional opinions, obviously.

http://www.chedevans.com/key-and-undisputed-facts

People don't like to believe that people they know are capable of things like rape. You can shut down and go into a state of denial. Plenty of convicted rapists and have friends and family standing by them. Rolf Harris for instance.

Its a tough one though. By the sounds of it, she consented, the video of her entering the hotel shows she was in a fit enough state to remember the pizza (Ched's mate wasn't) and she still had the ability to crouch down in high heels, pick up her pizza, and keep her balance.

I suppose its where you draw the line. For me I think a fair few people could be up on a rape charge for one night stands that are regretted the next day.

[iup=3595001]captain red dog[/iup] wrote:Its a tough one though. By the sounds of it, she consented, the video of her entering the hotel shows she was in a fit enough state to remember the pizza (Ched's mate wasn't) and she still had the ability to crouch down in high heels, pick up her pizza, and keep her balance.

I suppose its where you draw the line. For me I think a fair few people could be up on a rape charge for one night stands that are regretted the next day.

Surely she consented to sleeping with Ched's mate. Not Ched.

[iup=3595001]captain red dog[/iup] wrote:Its a tough one though. By the sounds of it, she consented, the video of her entering the hotel shows she was in a fit enough state to remember the pizza (Ched's mate wasn't) and she still had the ability to crouch down in high heels, pick up her pizza, and keep her balance.

I suppose its where you draw the line. For me I think a fair few people could be up on a rape charge for one night stands that are regretted the next day.

HONK HONK

[iup=3594260]Poser[/iup] wrote:I don't know. But I don't think he will be. He was found guilty by a group of his peers; his subsequent appeal was rejected.



What is seedy is some of the evidence that has been put forward in his 'defence' on that website.

Friend texts him to say 'I've got a bird'. Ched, who is in a relationship, immediately diverts the taxi he's in to the hotel where his friend and this 'bird' can be found. He has a key and goes in.

(The girl was so drunk she had been falling over - she had been on the floor of the kebab house when she and Ched first encountered each other that night. He had to step over her. She also left her handbag in the kebab place.)

What's more, Ched's brother and another friend are loitering outside the hotel window, attempting to film what went on.


Now, none of this is indicative of whether or not consent was given, which I realise is the central point. But as an illustration of his character and frame of mind on the night in question, it's quite revealing. And Ched's people have put this forward in his defence.

To think, his girlfriend has stood by him through this. I'd like to think my Mrs would have enough self respect to drop me like a stone if I had gone out of my way to strawberry float a girl at all, let alone one who was a) that drunk and b) already being strawberry floated by another man.

It's all here, apart from my additional opinions, obviously.

http://www.chedevans.com/key-and-undisputed-facts

Jesus. That's their defence??

Sadly, when a story comes out like this about a footballer, the very cynical side of me automatically thinks "oh just some skank who wants a bit of money and her photoshoot in some rag", but that is pretty sketchy. As for people saying "she can pick up a pizza"...so? I've been so hammered I've not even known how I've got home, but I must have walked as I'm not magic, nor did anyone carry me. Sounds like a creepy set up from what you posted.

Yeah, creepy is right.

The first bloke didn't 'finish', but left the hotel fairly quickly. Ched also didn't finish, and left after about 10 minutes via the hotel's emergency exit.

Certainly gives the impression they both knew something was wrong, and decided to leg it.

The crux of the matter here is that she cant remember what happened in the room at all. How can anyone be accused of rape if no evidence is available.

[iup=3595054]Photek[/iup] wrote:The crux of the matter here is that she cant remember what happened in the room at all. How can anyone be accused of rape if no evidence is available.

If you're too drunk to remember then you pretty much can't consent. The "but she was drunk" excuse isn't a strawberry floating excuse.

[iup=3595061]Fatal Exception[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595054]Photek[/iup] wrote:The crux of the matter here is that she cant remember what happened in the room at all. How can anyone be accused of rape if no evidence is available.

If you're too drunk to remember then you pretty much can't consent. The "but she was drunk" excuse isn't a strawberry floating excuse.

I have a shocking memory when im drunk, if what you're saying is true, then ive been raped a few times.

You're being silly man, not remembering and not consenting are completly different things.

[iup=3595064]Photek[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595061]Fatal Exception[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595054]Photek[/iup] wrote:The crux of the matter here is that she cant remember what happened in the room at all. How can anyone be accused of rape if no evidence is available.

If you're too drunk to remember then you pretty much can't consent. The "but she was drunk" excuse isn't a strawberry floating excuse.

I have a shocking memory when im drunk, if what you're saying is true, then ive been raped a few times.

You're being silly man, not remembering and not consenting are completly different things.

Sadly, this kind of dumb attitude is why rape is so bizarrely dismissed.

So a girl is really drunk, she drunkenly says "yes" after some sleaze bag who is not as intoxicated as her suggest they have sex and takes her back to a hotel or whatever, no doubt holding her up as she keeps falling. The next day she wakes up and has no idea whats happened, and then finds out some guy strawberry floated her whilst she was potentially unconcious from drink?

That's ok? You'd be fine if that happened to your daughter (obviously when she's older)?

Absolute idiocy.

[iup=3595066]SandyCoin[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595064]Photek[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595061]Fatal Exception[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595054]Photek[/iup] wrote:The crux of the matter here is that she cant remember what happened in the room at all. How can anyone be accused of rape if no evidence is available.

If you're too drunk to remember then you pretty much can't consent. The "but she was drunk" excuse isn't a strawberry floating excuse.

I have a shocking memory when im drunk, if what you're saying is true, then ive been raped a few times.

You're being silly man, not remembering and not consenting are completly different things.

Sadly, this kind of dumb attitude is why rape is so bizarrely dismissed.

So a girl is really drunk, she drunkenly says "yes" after some sleaze bag who is not as intoxicated as her suggest they have sex and takes her back to a hotel or whatever, no doubt holding her up as she keeps falling. The next day she wakes up and has no idea whats happened, and then finds out some guy strawberry floated her whilst she was potentially unconcious from drink?

That's ok? You'd be fine if that happened to your daughter (obviously when she's older)?

Absolute idiocy.

You're now making stuff up about holding her up and that she kept falling yet she magically is seen walking to and from the taxi into lobby of hotel one handedly carrying a strawberry floating Pizza so, before moving onto other things, what are you talking about?

[iup=3595064]Photek[/iup] wrote:You're being silly man, not remembering and not consenting are completly different things.

Only if you go by some archaic 'it's only rape if she's held down with a knife' approach.

If your brain was so drowned in alcohol that it can't form memories then it's ability to provide meaningful, informed consent is also in doubt. Rape isn't just a violent crime that happens when someone gets dragged into a van by a man in a balaclava; it's a crime that represents a person not being in a position to provide meaningful consent and 'I was so drunk I can't remember what happened' is pretty strong evidence that their ability to know what was going on around them wasn't exactly tip top.

Pro-tip, if a girl is so drunk it looks like she might well not remember anything you're about to do to her; call her a taxi and put your dick away.

Sorry guys you're all correct then, ill bring a breathliser with me at all times to determine how drunk a girl ive met is.

You're all making assumptions with no evidence, in some cases MAKING UP EVIDENCE but yaknow, keep at it lads.

Skarjo, your tone is ridiculous, I'm not a strawberry floating 10year old, and I realise its not a strawberry floating episode of Law and Order so wind down.

Getting a bit defensive there Photek. Anything you want to share with the group?

To be honest mate if you can't tell not to strawberry float girls who look like they can't form memories then I'd suggest operating your nights out on some kind of buddy system.

[iup=3595078]Skarjo[/iup] wrote:To be honest mate if you can't tell not to strawberry float girls who look like they can't form memories then I'd suggest operating your nights out on some kind of buddy system.

'mate'

Anyway, I can tell but my point is that a girl can consent to sex and then not remember. She got in a taxi, and didnt remember, she got a pizza, and didnt remember, she walked to hotel room, forgot pizza and went back and got it and didnt remember but of course she can't obviously have sex with someone and then not remember, cos thats mentalism.

I think picking up pizza is a bit different to being penetrated by two strangers

[iup=3595068]Photek[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595066]SandyCoin[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595064]Photek[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595061]Fatal Exception[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3595054]Photek[/iup] wrote:The crux of the matter here is that she cant remember what happened in the room at all. How can anyone be accused of rape if no evidence is available.

If you're too drunk to remember then you pretty much can't consent. The "but she was drunk" excuse isn't a strawberry floating excuse.

I have a shocking memory when im drunk, if what you're saying is true, then ive been raped a few times.

You're being silly man, not remembering and not consenting are completly different things.

Sadly, this kind of dumb attitude is why rape is so bizarrely dismissed.

So a girl is really drunk, she drunkenly says "yes" after some sleaze bag who is not as intoxicated as her suggest they have sex and takes her back to a hotel or whatever, no doubt holding her up as she keeps falling. The next day she wakes up and has no idea whats happened, and then finds out some guy strawberry floated her whilst she was potentially unconcious from drink?

That's ok? You'd be fine if that happened to your daughter (obviously when she's older)?

Absolute idiocy.

You're now making stuff up about holding her up and that she kept falling yet she magically is seen walking to and from the taxi into lobby of hotel one handedly carrying a strawberry floating Pizza so, before moving onto other things, what are you talking about?

Making stuff up? Nope. I was clearly using that as an example as you seemed to suggest, also as an example and not just in this case, that not remembering and not consenting are not related.

Then you sarcastically say "oh I better bring a breathaliser out with me". Absolutely amazing. No, just don't be some kind of sex pest.