Destiny 2: The Witch Queen out now

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Tafdolphin
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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:21 am

Y'all know there are

mods


that





counteract them













right?

They're there to encourage mod/build interaction, which is one of the most interesting parts of Destiny 2 right now. If that's all it took for you to peace out then...

Cool. I guess. :simper:

Although it is strawberry floating criminal Bungie still hasn't integrated a loadout system by this point.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Parksey » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:25 am

Why?

They're basically no more annoying than a regular yellow bar enemy. Despite the nerf, one player can kill them with Fallen Guillotine without needing any mods. If three focus their fire on them it's even quicker.

Then you have the mods. Are you using the mods?

What you're encouraged to do is mix things up and try the different mods/weapons each season. It tells you exactly what champions are coming up, and it's only even two out of three types, so stick the mods on the weapons.

They're only really a pain in the high level stuff - the Grandmaster Nightfall and the solo Master Lost Sectors. In regular nightfalls they barely register, and are doable with a team of blueberry randos.

I find "Immune" phases and ground pounds from bigger enemies more annoyong and an antithesis to quick, grindabe process.

Again, the problem with difficulty in Destiny is that it's hard to implement. Create complex mechanics like this in raids, and people complain about needing a mic'd up fireteam. Create mechanics that are too fiddly or difficult with randoms and peooe moan about failing (like the Season of the Worthy event). People moan that strikes are too easy, but then complain about Champions being harder to kill in Nightfalls.

How exactly are they supposed to further implement difficulty in a game where 90% of it needs to be doable with voiceless randoms or solo, and needs to be repeatable as you're supposed to grind for loot.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:27 am

Exactly.

Parksey wrote:How exactly are they supposed to further implement difficulty in a game where 90% of it needs to be doable with voiceless randoms or solo, and needs to be repeatable as you're supposed to grind for loot.


Without getting overly defensive of the game, I genuinely think some people just want D1 back. D2 isn't D1.

It's better.

The mod system is, as I said, super interesting and really leans into the MMORPG elements that simply weren't there in D1. The Champions are an extra challenge that, as far as I'm concerned, have no downsides besides being something new that some people don't immediately understand. They're the very minimum of changes to the formula, and it seems even that is enough to send people running.

It's bizarre.

EDIT: Like, VoG is made immeasurably more interesting with the presence of Champions, as is DSC. You have to actually plan for them, either assigning a fireteam member to deal with them or else equipping the correct mods.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Hexx » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:31 am

Forcing you you use a shortlist of weapons - which might actively go against those MMO style builds, bounties/objectives or just personal preference is utter shite

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:34 am

Hexx wrote:Forcing you you use a shortlist of weapons - which might actively go against those MMO style builds, bounties/objectives or just personal preference is utter shite


It doesn't force you to do anything. This season for eg the list of Champion modded weapons include

Grenade Launchers
SMGs
Scout Rifles
Auto Rifles
Sidearms
Hand Cannons
Grenades
Anything that generates Warmind Cells
Any exotic with an intrinsic champion mod eg Eriana's Vow, Divinity, The Lament.

As Parksey mentioned you can also brute force every variant with a sword and Breach and Clear means this now extends to almost any burst damage heavy.

Hardly forcing you down a single route... And even if it did...why is that shite? D1 had plenty of encounters that forced you to use long or short range weapons, or that encouraged certain loadouts. How is this different?

All they force you to do is consider the way you want to play, and Bungie turned that consideration into a mechanic.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Hexx » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:39 am

Break it out for each type of champion (eg barrier) and the list is much less impressive.

And other things require certain sub classes.

It’s strawberry floating terrible design that limits choice for no. Champions aren’t interesting to fight. You either bring the ‘instant win’ counter or you suffer.

Mechanically dull and actively limits player choice. For no redeeming positives other than trying to make artefacts seem ‘relevant’

Comparing that to ‘hey this is a long range fight - how do you adapt?’ is…something,

Last edited by Hexx on Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:41 am

Hexx wrote:Break it out for each type of champion (eg barrier) and the list is much less impressive.

And other things require certain sub classes.

It’s strawberry floating terrible choice that limits choice for no. Champions aren’t interesting to fight. You either bring the ‘instant win’ counter or you suffer.

Mechanically dull and actively limits player choice. For no redeeming positives.


Did you...


did you read



my






post?

Tafdolphin wrote:They're there to encourage mod/build interaction, which is one of the most interesting parts of Destiny 2 right now.


If you hate them, you hate them but don't try to transpose that hate onto the game design. It's a solid mechanic that, as stated, encourages mod/build interaction.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:41 am

Hexx wrote:Break it out for each type of champion (eg barrier) and the list is much less impressive.

And other things require certain sub classes.

It’s strawberry floating terrible choice that limits choice for no. Champions aren’t interesting to fight. You either bring the ‘instant win’ counter or you suffer.

Mechanically dull and actively limits player choice. For no redeeming positives.


Did you...


did you read



my






post?

Tafdolphin wrote:They're there to encourage mod/build interaction, which is one of the most interesting parts of Destiny 2 right now.


If you hate them, you hate them. It's fine! It really is! But don't try to transpose that hate onto the game design. It's a solid mechanic that, as stated, encourages mod/build interaction. There's your redeeming positive.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Hexx » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:55 am

Tafdolphin wrote:
Hexx wrote:Break it out for each type of champion (eg barrier) and the list is much less impressive.

And other things require certain sub classes.

It’s strawberry floating terrible choice that limits choice for no. .

Mechanically dull and actively limits player choice. For no redeeming positives.


Did you...


did you read



my






post?

Tafdolphin wrote:They're there to encourage mod/build interaction, which is one of the most interesting parts of Destiny 2 right now.


If you hate them, you hate them but don't try to transpose that hate onto the game design. It's a solid mechanic that, as stated, encourages mod/build interaction.


Yeah. I read it. I assumed you were drunk or joking.

It doesn’t encourage experimentation. It explicitly limits it. Eg only void melee stagger unstoppable this season. Only Arc grenades do do something else. (Hope you don’t get a solar or stasis bounty!)

That’s deliberately constraining choice to certain sub classes. You could take that sub class caveat away and encourage *more* viable builds and experimenting - but instead it restricts them. Which again given the criteria for lots of objectives/bounties is can be putatively punishing. .

Champions aren’t interesting to fight. You either bring the ‘instant win’ counter or you suffer. They bring so little to the gameplay they might as well just be walls in you can’t pass unless you have certain mods equipped. Same basic result. That’s terrible design by any reasonable measure

Piss poor game design. The blatant reason they do it is to force people to rebuild onto the ‘approved’ shortlist that works each season to give a faux sense of ‘progression’ (yey! you overcame the artificial hurdle we put in your way, same as ~4 months ) to overcome the same ‘challenges’ you’ve overcome in previous builds/seasons.

Last edited by Hexx on Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:58 am, edited 2 times in total.
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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:56 am

Ok, my man. Hey you should see if Bungo needs any game designers! They're obviously missing the secret sauce you'd bring.

Also, as someone who has recently entered the realms of game design these sort of views are even more annoying than beforehand. Game design is hard, and game design for a sandbox MMO possibly the hardest version imaginable. Backseat designers are the strawberry floating worst, man.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Hexx » Tue Jun 22, 2021 11:00 am

They obviously couldn’t afford me given their budget issues. :lol:

I think Season of Splicer, including it’s ongoing story, is probably the best iteration of this version of Destiny. But it’s still got the same underlying issues it’s had since Shadowkeep (which is where 95% of friends oquit)

Bring back Foresaken (worried next season is going to piss over all happy memories)

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Buffalo » Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:41 pm

Tafdolphin wrote:I honestly don't know why you lot continue to play. Based on this thread you all (bar Parksey) hate absolutely everything about the game!

Champions are a nice extra challenge on harder tier activities. They're fine.


Umm, Expunge isn’t ‘absolutely everything’ mate.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:46 pm

Buffalo wrote:
Tafdolphin wrote:I honestly don't know why you lot continue to play. Based on this thread you all (bar Parksey) hate absolutely everything about the game!

Champions are a nice extra challenge on harder tier activities. They're fine.


Umm, Expunge isn’t ‘absolutely everything’ mate.


It is to me :(

My point was that unless it's me or Parksey with the last post, you can bet your Bottom Dollar it's a complaint. About...something. Considering the game's in the best place it's been for ages, that's a bit weird.

EDIT: Also this week's Expunge is the first one I'd call difficult so good luck!

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Buffalo » Wed Jun 23, 2021 2:29 pm

Great :x

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Fri Jun 25, 2021 5:56 pm

Welp.

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(Finally got both full sets of Vault of Glass and Deep Stone Crypt armour)

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:26 am

Double post etc but last night me and a mate had the worst raid run I've ever experienced.

We've gotten into the rhythm of doing DSC once per week, going on to the LFG discord to grab the remaining 4 team members needed. For the last 6 weeks since we started, this has been an exceptional experience, with almost everyone we've found being pleasant and capable. Last night though...last night was different.

We were immediately joined by 2 people in a group. This is usually good: if LFG peeps know each other it usually means communication is easier. These two however were what sounded like 2 American teens who would not. Shut. Up. They were constantly talking with their mics apparently in their mouths, but that was fine. People like to chat. It was good! One of them even got us to rate his Titan's outfit which was a nice bit of pre-game nattering. We filled the rest of the team and I knew something was up when one guy was muted on discord from the very start and the other was barely audible.

The Deep Stone Crypt requires a lot of communication, the knowledge of where each specific buff is and who has it is essential. But these two kids wouldn't be quiet. Then they'd demand certain roles and refuse to perform any other, which you absolutely cannot do in DSC. It's a raid where everyone needs to be open the the possibility of filling every role. But they'd flat out refuse when asked. Cue dozens and dozens of wipes as buffs were left on the ground and tasks left unfulfilled.

God it was awful. The worst thing was they just straight refused to listen, even to stop talking long enough to hear. For the final boss, one person should be running Divinity, a weapon that weakens whatever it's pointed at. One other guy clearly stated he was running it. The effect does not stack. Cue getting to the damage phase of the boss and...we have 2 Divinities. One of the kids just wasn't listening. This was after 40 minutes on this encounter alone. Last week the whole raid took that long.

DSC is a relatively easy raid but we had to give up. It wasn't fun and my ears were starting to bleed from the constant screaming of two US teens.

Urgh.

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Hexx » Sun Jun 27, 2021 1:25 pm

Presage soloed Twice :datass:

Can’t imagine doing it in 25mim though

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Sun Jun 27, 2021 1:28 pm

You deffo need a team for the catalyst challenge.

Hop into LFG, you'll find a bunch on there looking for peeps I imagine!

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Hexx » Tue Jun 29, 2021 7:36 pm

The Dreaming Mind killed :datass:

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PostRe: Destiny 2: Season of the Splicer - BAEDA1's about to make you her bitch
by Tafdolphin » Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:17 pm

Yeah, that was a really nice culmination of the Expunge missions (honestly made better imagining Buff desperately trying to get through it!).

But yeah. This wasn't the finale. Not a chance. Summat's coming next week fo sho.

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