DIY thread...

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Errkal
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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Errkal » Wed Mar 31, 2021 7:37 am

Dowbocop wrote:I think the way I described pulling the cable down made my wife think I'd rappelled off the stepladder with it when I actually just gave it a gentle tug for an extra inch of give when wiring it up. I'd be massively surprised if I have disconnected anything so with any luck just using the right wires will do the trick. When I put a bulb in the new fitting it does light up so I've done something right!


You'de be surprised, I replaced a ceiling light and in the process managed to cause a break in the cable between the switch and lamp. It was quite old wiring and my guess is it had the break already but somehow worked as the light always took a second to come on, but by changing it totally bust it and I had to have the cable between the light and the switch replaced.

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Dowbocop
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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dowbocop » Wed Mar 31, 2021 5:16 pm

darksideby182 wrote:
Dowbocop wrote:Had some lighting bants today. Got a new front room light fitting which needed wiring in rather than just screwing on. Hit up the fuse box, isolated the downstairs lights and was working my way through the job. Needed a bit more length in the earth cable so gently pulled it down, then as I was moving the neutral wire across to the correct clamp on the fitting the whole of our downstairs lost electricity for about ten/fifteen minutes. Wired it up, fuses came back on and appliances are fine, but now the light switch in our front room doesn't work and the kitchen lights are completely out of action. Wife is cooking via a reading lamp, a Stormtrooper lamp and an LED lantern. It's like she's on one of those back in time for dinner things :slol:

But joking aside I've strawberry floated up my house :dread:


So you probably have RCD protection on the half of the fuseboard this is why half of the house went off, the reason is that the RCD monitors earth leakage so when you touched the earth to the neutral it will have tripped the fuse even if you have isolated the lighting circuit as the RCD covers more than one fuse. As for non working lights sounds you may have connected the light up wrong or not connected the cable into the terminal properly if you can take some pics of the wiring i may be able to help from the pics.

Yes I'm an Electrician

Edit:the blue wire with the brown sleeve is probably your switch live from the light switch.

Right, so I got it all working!

Attached is a picture of my wiring - I used little square brass junction blocks to connect. The earth is just 1:1 (although there were three copper cores on the house's earth wire I've just folded two of those back so it would fit in the hole). All the brown live wires are connected to a 3-hole block with no output. The switch live is connected to a 2-hole block outputting to the fitting's live wire. The two remaining blue neutral wires are in a 3 hole block outputting to the fitting's neutral wire.

I spoke to my local electrical shop as I was buying the right bulb for the fitting to see if they had any insulated junction blocks. They said they were all too big for the fitting so just wrap everything conductive in electrical tape (which I always have anyway because black tape is really useful!)

Picture below - am I going to burn down my house? Oh, I also tripped the RCD again as I was fitting the working unit to the ceiling - not really sure why that's happening :dread:

Really appreciate your help on this. Obviously at any point feel free to duck out and tell me to get a local electrician in for a proper look :D

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Victor Mildew
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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Victor Mildew » Wed Mar 31, 2021 5:33 pm

Dat earth wire electromagnet

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darksideby182
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PostRe: DIY thread...
by darksideby182 » Wed Mar 31, 2021 6:15 pm

I would recommend you get some good insulated connected block or push fit connectors (https://www.toolstation.com/connector-strip/p85099 or https://www.toolstation.com/spring-leve ... ors/p45879)
Then you need to find which cable had the brown sleeving on as the will be you switch live back from the light switch. From there you will have 3 brown wires (permanent live) connected together 2 blue wires (neutral) connected to together and the 3 green/yellow (earth) connected together and the blue/brown on its own. Then you can connect the cable to the new light fitting into the brown/blue (switch live) and ther blue (neutral) connector blocks.

Also the person you spoke to about wrapping tape around the blocks shouldn't be suggesting that. If you put a photo up with the fitting i can maybe recommend something to help tidy it up with good connectors if the others above are too big or a different method all together.

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dowbocop » Wed Mar 31, 2021 6:44 pm

darksideby182 wrote:I would recommend you get some good insulated connected block or push fit connectors (https://www.toolstation.com/connector-strip/p85099 or https://www.toolstation.com/spring-leve ... ors/p45879)
Then you need to find which cable had the brown sleeving on as the will be you switch live back from the light switch. From there you will have 3 brown wires (permanent live) connected together 2 blue wires (neutral) connected to together and the 3 green/yellow (earth) connected together and the blue/brown on its own. Then you can connect the cable to the new light fitting into the brown/blue (switch live) and ther blue (neutral) connector blocks.

Also the person you spoke to about wrapping tape around the blocks shouldn't be suggesting that. If you put a photo up with the fitting i can maybe recommend something to help tidy it up with good connectors if the others above are too big or a different method all together.

I think I do have it pretty much set up as you describe don't I?

That first one looks promising to be honest, it's about the size of the one I removed (I would have reused that in full except the brass parts were integrated into the previous fitting so I could only use them and not the insulating plastic bits).

If I set it up using the first product as follows would that work? EDIT: added in the other two earth wires I'd been ignoring.

Code: Select all

HOUSE SIDE O-O FITTING SIDE
EARTH         O-O EMPTY
EARTH         O-O EMPTY
EARTH         O-O EARTH
NEUTRAL     O-O NEUTRAL
SWITCH L    O-O LIVE
NEUTRAL     O-O EMPTY
LIVE            O-O EMPTY
LIVE            O-O EMPTY
LIVE            O-O EMPTY

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darksideby182
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PostRe: DIY thread...
by darksideby182 » Wed Mar 31, 2021 7:00 pm

Yep Looks good hopefully you will have light.

Edit

You will be able to fit more than 1 wire into a connector block, so the 3 browns into 1 connector then the 2 blues into one connector but with one coming out the other side for the light
Like this
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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dowbocop » Wed Mar 31, 2021 10:52 pm

darksideby182 wrote:Yep Looks good hopefully you will have light.

Edit

You will be able to fit more than 1 wire into a connector block, so the 3 browns into 1 connector then the 2 blues into one connector but with one coming out the other side for the light
Like this
Image

That looks very familiar! Cheers again :)

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Jenuall » Thu Apr 01, 2021 9:47 am

I always hate how little room they give you to work with on the inside of light fittings - it makes it more fiddly and you end up cramming wires in there which must be putting more stress onto both them and the fittings in general

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No:1 Final Fantasy Fan
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PostRe: DIY thread...
by No:1 Final Fantasy Fan » Sun Apr 04, 2021 12:37 pm

Need to install a new door handle which requires a massive hole
Thinking of getting a hole saw kit like this but not sure if it's wise to drill it with the door upright installed or should I take the door down and lay it flat?

I also don't have a drill so looking to invest in this one, I probably don't need the hammer function but for £5 extra I might as well

https://www.toolstation.com/holesaw-kit/p23014

https://www.toolstation.com/bauker-18v- ... ill/p45009

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dowbocop » Sun Apr 04, 2021 1:04 pm

It will probably be more stable if you take the door off the hinges, but that's assuming you can adequately secure the door to work on it, which can be quite tricky without multiple clamps/benches (maybe a big kitchen table would suffice). I assume you have no way of clicking the door shut (hence the new handle!). Theoretically you could close the door over from the inside and wedge it against the frame with a door stop. Do that as tightly as you can and it should stay pretty stable, especially if you lean into the door close to the cut site as you drill. Go slow, use pilot holes and widen gradually - all that boring gooseberry fool our dads used to say is right!

This is all assuming you only need a hole for the faces of the door. If you need to drill the side hole too (the bit where the pin goes into the door frame) I think the door needs to come off because the risk of the door moving is too great when you're drilling parallel as opposed to perpendicular.

darksideby182 wrote:

The lights working a treat, thanks a lot! I've got two live wires jammed into one side of a connector block as it was the only way I could get three wires into two holes - that's okay right?

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Mommy » Sun Apr 04, 2021 1:10 pm

Spade bit for making a hole in a door.

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by No:1 Final Fantasy Fan » Sun Apr 04, 2021 1:50 pm

Hey thanks for all the advice
Yeah I'm installing a new handle because I need one with a lock on it.

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dowbocop » Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:04 pm

No:1 Final Fantasy Fan wrote:Hey thanks for all the advice
Yeah I'm installing a new handle because I need one with a lock on it.

So you need a second hole underneath the catch/handle holes for the bolt?

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dual » Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:05 pm

Have you got a picture of the handle you're installing? I can't think of any type that requires a 'massive hole.'

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by darksideby182 » Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:07 pm

Dowbocop wrote:It will probably be more stable if you take the door off the hinges, but that's assuming you can adequately secure the door to work on it, which can be quite tricky without multiple clamps/benches (maybe a big kitchen table would suffice). I assume you have no way of clicking the door shut (hence the new handle!). Theoretically you could close the door over from the inside and wedge it against the frame with a door stop. Do that as tightly as you can and it should stay pretty stable, especially if you lean into the door close to the cut site as you drill. Go slow, use pilot holes and widen gradually - all that boring gooseberry fool our dads used to say is right!

This is all assuming you only need a hole for the faces of the door. If you need to drill the side hole too (the bit where the pin goes into the door frame) I think the door needs to come off because the risk of the door moving is too great when you're drilling parallel as opposed to perpendicular.

darksideby182 wrote:

The lights working a treat, thanks a lot! I've got two live wires jammed into one side of a connector block as it was the only way I could get three wires into two holes - that's okay right?

That's fine :D :D

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dowbocop » Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:10 pm

Dual wrote:Have you got a picture of the handle you're installing? I can't think of any type that requires a 'massive hole.'

I dunno, I've got a couple of massive holes that need a handle
Image

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dual » Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:16 pm

:lol:

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No:1 Final Fantasy Fan
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PostRe: DIY thread...
by No:1 Final Fantasy Fan » Sun Apr 04, 2021 4:13 pm

Dowbocop wrote:
No:1 Final Fantasy Fan wrote:Hey thanks for all the advice
Yeah I'm installing a new handle because I need one with a lock on it.

So you need a second hole underneath the catch/handle holes for the bolt?

No ts built into the handle

Dual wrote:Have you got a picture of the handle you're installing? I can't think of any type that requires a 'massive hole.'

Yes sure I got it from amazon here https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01 ... UTF8&psc=1
The hole needs to be 54mm apparently thanks! Now I just need to find a 54mm holesaw as the kit. linked above doesn't include that size damn.

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by Dowbocop » Sun Apr 04, 2021 4:52 pm

No:1 Final Fantasy Fan wrote:
Dowbocop wrote:
No:1 Final Fantasy Fan wrote:Hey thanks for all the advice
Yeah I'm installing a new handle because I need one with a lock on it.

So you need a second hole underneath the catch/handle holes for the bolt?

No ts built into the handle

Dual wrote:Have you got a picture of the handle you're installing? I can't think of any type that requires a 'massive hole.'

Yes sure I got it from amazon here https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01 ... UTF8&psc=1
The hole needs to be 54mm apparently thanks! Now I just need to find a 54mm holesaw as the kit. linked above doesn't include that size damn.

I'd hold fire on that. 54mm is, as you say, a massive hole, and the images on that listing don't seem to correspond to it. From comparing the images on the screen to a ruler 54mm seems larger than the handle collar itself! I'm no expert on building regs and have only replaced one door handle myself, but I think most door handle holes are standardized so you can just buy any fitting you like and it'll fit. It also doesn't seem to include the long square bolt that goes between the two handles through the little hole in the mechanism so make sure you retain that from the old fitting in case you need it. You can always go out to B&Q or a local hardware store for extra tools if needed.

By all means consider buying a drill though! Hammer drills are really useful for brick walls, I had to buy one when we moved into our current house because there's only one partition wall in the house so hanging anything is a nightmare. In the end for most pictures/light hangings I just use nails! :lol:

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PostRe: DIY thread...
by No:1 Final Fantasy Fan » Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:39 pm

Dowbocop wrote:
No:1 Final Fantasy Fan wrote:
Dowbocop wrote:
No:1 Final Fantasy Fan wrote:Hey thanks for all the advice
Yeah I'm installing a new handle because I need one with a lock on it.

So you need a second hole underneath the catch/handle holes for the bolt?

No ts built into the handle

Dual wrote:Have you got a picture of the handle you're installing? I can't think of any type that requires a 'massive hole.'

Yes sure I got it from amazon here https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01 ... UTF8&psc=1
The hole needs to be 54mm apparently thanks! Now I just need to find a 54mm holesaw as the kit. linked above doesn't include that size damn.

I'd hold fire on that. 54mm is, as you say, a massive hole, and the images on that listing don't seem to correspond to it. From comparing the images on the screen to a ruler 54mm seems larger than the handle collar itself! I'm no expert on building regs and have only replaced one door handle myself, but I think most door handle holes are standardized so you can just buy any fitting you like and it'll fit. It also doesn't seem to include the long square bolt that goes between the two handles through the little hole in the mechanism so make sure you retain that from the old fitting in case you need it. You can always go out to B&Q or a local hardware store for extra tools if needed.

By all means consider buying a drill though! Hammer drills are really useful for brick walls, I had to buy one when we moved into our current house because there's only one partition wall in the house so hanging anything is a nightmare. In the end for most pictures/light hangings I just use nails! :lol:

Thanks but I just measured it to be sure and it seems 54mm is right as there are some metal tabs sticking out to clip into the 54mm hole.
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