EU withheld $430,000 study that concluded most piracy doesn't hurt sales after all

mic wrote:And no, I wouldn’t steal a car.

Would you download one though?

Lagamorph wrote:Make it easier to stream than it is to pirate and people will pay to stream. Who could've guessed?...

I download most of my music from YouTube, for free - is that piracy?

mic wrote:
Lagamorph wrote:Make it easier to stream than it is to pirate and people will pay to stream. Who could've guessed?...

I download most of my music from YouTube, for free - is that piracy?

Yeah, technically it is I think. If you stream music from the official channel every time you listen, and you watch the ads, then it's not piracy.

Well, I guess the EU is a tyrannical dictatorship then

Strange thing to withhold.

My Spotify trial was great - takes all the effort out of organising playlists and pretty much everything is just there. Pity I have to pay for it, really...

Squinty wrote:Well, I guess the EU is a tyrannical dictatorship then

Strange thing to withhold.

The EU is sincerely pretty bad, it's just not bad in a way that benefits us by leaving.

Irene Demova wrote:
Squinty wrote:Well, I guess the EU is a tyrannical dictatorship then

Strange thing to withhold.

The EU is sincerely pretty bad, it's just not bad in a way that benefits us by leaving.

Any government would withhold that kind of study. Same with that UN drug study from years ago.

Is it that the entertainment/ telecommunications industry is somehow holding government to ransom?

Alvin Flummux wrote:
Knoyleo wrote:
Alvin Flummux wrote:
Knoyleo wrote:I can't believe Youtube is the most popular way to stream music.

Maybe it's the easiest service to use?

It won't even continue playing if you lock your phone.

Maybe it's the easiest service to use on devices that don't lock up?

I bet most of the people using youtube as their main music platform don't even have adblock enabled either. :dread:

Knoyleo wrote:
Alvin Flummux wrote:
Knoyleo wrote:
Alvin Flummux wrote:
Knoyleo wrote:I can't believe Youtube is the most popular way to stream music.

Maybe it's the easiest service to use?

It won't even continue playing if you lock your phone.

Maybe it's the easiest service to use on devices that don't lock up?

I bet most of the people using youtube as their main music platform don't even have adblock enabled either.

I use it at work because I can't be strawberry floated getting a Pandora account. I can't enable adblock there, but it works.

I can't think of a worse way to stream music

Knoyleo wrote:I can't think of a worse way to stream music

It's free, I don't need an account and am not forced to listen to a station of tracks "like" the ones I want to hear. It works.

Plus I don't want to learn how another service works. I'm lazy, sue me.

That sounds beyond awful.

There is a good stream I quite like listening to on YouTube.

mic wrote:Is it that the entertainment/ telecommunications industry is somehow holding government to ransom?

Not exactly but like the news media they do have a lot of influence over certain politicians and other people in positions of power by offering 'financial incentives'.

Lucien wrote:...Piracy is theft to be fair, they might have not wanted to promote its increase.

No, it’s NOT! It’s copyright infringement, which is civil, not criminal law. The onus is on the victim to prove that they’ve actually lost anything, which in most cases they have not, so how is that theft?

Lucien wrote:Whatever you call it it's still immoral.

I think in some scenarios it can be immoral. But if you legitimately would never (or maybe can't in your region!) buy a piece of art, then viewing a copy of it is literally by definition victimless. Can a victimless action be anything bar morally neutral?

EDIT: I don't pirate anything I could (reasonably*) buy by the way, I think as an adult with a job I 'should' support artists I like. I just don't think it's difficult to come up with scenarios where piracy isn't actually impacting anyone. (* I occasionally download works if I could only buy them by actually importing them from Japan -- I would never go through that effort for anything, so the creators haven't really lost out, right?)

Karl wrote:
Lucien wrote:Whatever you call it it's still immoral.

I think in some scenarios it can be immoral. But if you legitimately would never (or maybe can't in your region!) buy a piece of art, then viewing a copy of it is literally by definition victimless. Can a victimless action be anything bar morally neutral?

EDIT: I don't pirate anything I could (reasonably*) buy by the way, I think as an adult with a job I 'should' support artists I like. I just don't think it's difficult to come up with scenarios where piracy isn't actually impacting anyone. (* I occasionally download works if I could only buy them by actually importing them from Japan -- I would never go through that effort for anything, so the creators haven't really lost out, right?)

What are you trying to import. It's pretty easy to order stuff off amazon japan these days.

Lucien wrote:I agree with that Karl. It depends on the circumstances. I can see why the EU would hold back that information, although they shouldn't have, as it could create more of the bad type of piracy.

Sure.

There's an interesting debate in the philosophy of science about when, if ever, results should be withheld. On more realistic scenarios I lean towards 'yes, publish' but obviously there are some situations where you where you'd want to classify it and take steps to mitigate the impact of the research, only making it public years later. If someone discovered a process that allowed a normal person to make a nuclear bomb in their garage out of household goods, you'd need to withhold that until the household products that could be used have been banned/controlled worldwide. In the vast majority of cases though I think all research should be published.

That's just my view, it's an interesting debate!

lex-man wrote:What are you trying to import. It's pretty easy to order stuff off amazon japan these days.

Aye, I should take a look -- an interesting edge case here you might have thoughts on: what about things like fan-translations of light novels? Even if I important an LN I couldn't read it!

Lucien wrote:I agree with that Karl. It depends on the circumstances. I can see why the EU would hold back that information, although they shouldn't have, as it could create more of the bad type of piracy.

The bad, presumably immoral type? What’s that then?

EU withheld $430,000 study that concluded most piracy doesn't hurt sales after all

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