Extinction Rebellion - I'm extremely sorry for the inconvenience

Ironhide wrote:

Hime wrote:

Ironhide wrote:

Hime wrote:What do people think could be done that would actually be considered worthwhile? It's very different to a human rights protest that has a very clearly defined goal.

Stop building coal and gas power plants, invest heavily in renewable energy, heavily subsidise home solar panels and electric vehicles and actually recycle waste in the UK instead of shipping it to India and China to name just a few ideas.

World governments are prepared to spend trillions on military budgets yet seem unwilling to spend anything but the bare minimum on tackling climate change.

Not meaning to be a dick but the UK isn't building coal power stations and gas power stations are essential at the moment. Obviously there could always be more done but renewable energy is an area that is already being heavily invested in so I would highly doubt that would satisfy XR. The solar panels and electric vehicles are interesting as if you break down the construction and long term disposal of them there are massive environmental issues.

Again, not meaning to be a dick but I'm not sure those are things that would satisfy XR as they're so easy to dismiss and very long term solutions that would take a lot of time to progress.

I don't think there is a quick solution to climate change, I'm also aware that solar panels and electric vehicles aren't the 'silver bullet' they're made out to be but people need electricity and most people need some kind of vehicle and both would reduce CO2 emissions in the short term if they were more affordable.

The long term solution would probably require finding a means of generating energy via nuclear fusion and also banning all privately owned vehicles in favour of cheap carbon neutral public transport , people would also need to stop eating meat and fish as both industries cause environmental damage.

I can't see any of that happening by 2030.

BID0 wrote:

Knoyleo wrote:

BID0 wrote:

Knoyleo wrote:Thanks Bid0, that's something I'd not heard before, and sounds like a good set up. I'll watch that Owen Jones video later on as well. It's reassuring to hear there are more organisational and protection considerations in play than I'd been led to believe.

Meanwhile on twitter :

twitter.com/NLRebellion/status/1181205091237482496

Police aren't friends of protest action, what the strawberry float are they doing?

I'm so conflicted.

Police are joining the cause

The police exist to enforce private property rights, and private property rights lead directly to the exploitation and destruction of natural resources. The police will protect corporations who destroy and pollute the planet, over the people who try to stop them, every time. The men in that video are not repentant about their past careers, and I doubt they'd ever admit that their former job is a direct protector of the entities who cause the climate crisis. Will those three be working to provide counter intelligence and root out police moles? Would they actively sabotage police work that was working against XR?

It's no wonder other groups are wary of Extinction Rebellion when this is their attitude to the police, and it does make you question just how radical the reforms they're after are.

Yes I imagine they would help find any moles. For anyone else reading this thinking what are they talking about, very recently there was a case about Police officers having infiltrated protest groups (I can’t remember the cause) and some had even got in to relationships and had children with members of the movement and left the families after they stopped being investigated. You should be able to find it by searching “Lush police”. So this is t some weird conspiracy theory thing, it has happened and is probably happening now

Gemini73 wrote:Think I made a big mistake returning. strawberry float you guys and your pissy little forum clique. And lets face it, that's all you really are.

Adiós

Green Gecko wrote:Removed admin whining by myself, please continue.

Mommy needn't PM me just please don't be a dick in this thread, that goes for everyone. Aint got time for it.

Moggy wrote:

Gemini73 wrote:Think I made a big mistake returning. strawberry float you guys and your pissy little forum clique. And lets face it, that's all you really are.

Adiós

That’s quite the reaction to people that are not angry over old clothes.

Hime wrote:

Ironhide wrote:

Hime wrote:

Ironhide wrote:

Hime wrote:What do people think could be done that would actually be considered worthwhile? It's very different to a human rights protest that has a very clearly defined goal.

Stop building coal and gas power plants, invest heavily in renewable energy, heavily subsidise home solar panels and electric vehicles and actually recycle waste in the UK instead of shipping it to India and China to name just a few ideas.

World governments are prepared to spend trillions on military budgets yet seem unwilling to spend anything but the bare minimum on tackling climate change.

Not meaning to be a dick but the UK isn't building coal power stations and gas power stations are essential at the moment. Obviously there could always be more done but renewable energy is an area that is already being heavily invested in so I would highly doubt that would satisfy XR. The solar panels and electric vehicles are interesting as if you break down the construction and long term disposal of them there are massive environmental issues.

Again, not meaning to be a dick but I'm not sure those are things that would satisfy XR as they're so easy to dismiss and very long term solutions that would take a lot of time to progress.

I don't think there is a quick solution to climate change, I'm also aware that solar panels and electric vehicles aren't the 'silver bullet' they're made out to be but people need electricity and most people need some kind of vehicle and both would reduce CO2 emissions in the short term if they were more affordable.

The long term solution would probably require finding a means of generating energy via nuclear fusion and also banning all privately owned vehicles in favour of cheap carbon neutral public transport , people would also need to stop eating meat and fish as both industries cause environmental damage.

I can't see any of that happening by 2030.

Banning private vehicles would be impossible, there are so many scenarios which public transport isn't feasible. Nuclear Fusion is part of the solution but it only helps base power, you would still need the power stations that can be turned on and off quickly, the industry is changing massively though so I would say that this is demonstrably already moving in the right direction. The food argument definitely needs more clarification as the figures have been very selective, I find it hard to believe that eating meat that comes from a couple of miles down the road is killing the planet but it's ok to eat blueberries, nuts, avocados, etc that have been flown in from around the world.

Again, not meaning to just gooseberry fool on everything you're saying, just pointing out that rather than just saying "We want change!" XR should approach the situation more professionally.

Gemini73 wrote:I'm glad you all find upsetting school children so amusing.

Balladeer wrote:I’m new(ish), can I be part of the pissy little clique? What hazing rituals do I have to go through?

BID0 wrote:

Hime wrote:

Ironhide wrote:

Hime wrote:

Ironhide wrote:

Hime wrote:What do people think could be done that would actually be considered worthwhile? It's very different to a human rights protest that has a very clearly defined goal.

Stop building coal and gas power plants, invest heavily in renewable energy, heavily subsidise home solar panels and electric vehicles and actually recycle waste in the UK instead of shipping it to India and China to name just a few ideas.

World governments are prepared to spend trillions on military budgets yet seem unwilling to spend anything but the bare minimum on tackling climate change.

Not meaning to be a dick but the UK isn't building coal power stations and gas power stations are essential at the moment. Obviously there could always be more done but renewable energy is an area that is already being heavily invested in so I would highly doubt that would satisfy XR. The solar panels and electric vehicles are interesting as if you break down the construction and long term disposal of them there are massive environmental issues.

Again, not meaning to be a dick but I'm not sure those are things that would satisfy XR as they're so easy to dismiss and very long term solutions that would take a lot of time to progress.

I don't think there is a quick solution to climate change, I'm also aware that solar panels and electric vehicles aren't the 'silver bullet' they're made out to be but people need electricity and most people need some kind of vehicle and both would reduce CO2 emissions in the short term if they were more affordable.

The long term solution would probably require finding a means of generating energy via nuclear fusion and also banning all privately owned vehicles in favour of cheap carbon neutral public transport , people would also need to stop eating meat and fish as both industries cause environmental damage.

I can't see any of that happening by 2030.

Banning private vehicles would be impossible, there are so many scenarios which public transport isn't feasible. Nuclear Fusion is part of the solution but it only helps base power, you would still need the power stations that can be turned on and off quickly, the industry is changing massively though so I would say that this is demonstrably already moving in the right direction. The food argument definitely needs more clarification as the figures have been very selective, I find it hard to believe that eating meat that comes from a couple of miles down the road is killing the planet but it's ok to eat blueberries, nuts, avocados, etc that have been flown in from around the world.

Again, not meaning to just gooseberry fool on everything you're saying, just pointing out that rather than just saying "We want change!" XR should approach the situation more professionally.

Other countries are banning combustible engines in the next few years.

There's quite a lot of research in it now. The WWF put out a report of a few popular UK dishes and show the huge environmental cost of eating meat and diary. I posted it in one of the recent vegan topics, I think in reply to one of your posts at the time actually. I can't find the pdf right now but here is an article using it as a source https://www.livekindly.co/new-wwf-repor ... footprint/

The third most damaging industry after fossil fuels and meat/diary is the fashion industry. Particularly the fast fashion industry. There are ways to make clothing carbon neutral and there are many small business doing this today, I run one myself part time to promote the real cost of the fashion industry. The problem is the big labels. Check out documentaries like Stacey Dooley's "Fashions Dirty Secrets" which should be on iplayer or "The True Cost" which should still be on Netflix.

Hime wrote:Anyway, the point was that XR should present a list of achievable goals to give themselves a bit more credibility.

Tafdolphin wrote:

Hime wrote:Anyway, the point was that XR should present a list of achievable goals to give themselves a bit more credibility.

See I don't agree with this.

They're a protest group whose aim is to highlight the impending climate emergency/catastrophe. They are not a policy making think-tank. The governments of the world already have access to countless reports and bodies and research groups who are coming up with ways to combat climate change but they are not being heeded. XR's goal is to make governments act on the information they already have.

Hime wrote:

Tafdolphin wrote:

Hime wrote:Anyway, the point was that XR should present a list of achievable goals to give themselves a bit more credibility.

See I don't agree with this.

They're a protest group whose aim is to highlight the impending climate emergency/catastrophe. They are not a policy making think-tank. The governments of the world already have access to countless reports and bodies and research groups who are coming up with ways to combat climate change but they are not being heeded. XR's goal is to make governments act on the information they already have.

So again then, what is the desired outcome of the protests? The PM could just say something along the lines of "We're doubling or efforts to greatly reduce the UK's carbon emissions by 2030". Is that enough?

I know it's not the job of protestors to do the governments job for them but it's such an impossible situation. What can the government realistically do that will have a meaningful impact and not be seen as eroding people's civil liberties?

Hime wrote:

Tafdolphin wrote:

Hime wrote:Anyway, the point was that XR should present a list of achievable goals to give themselves a bit more credibility.

See I don't agree with this.

They're a protest group whose aim is to highlight the impending climate emergency/catastrophe. They are not a policy making think-tank. The governments of the world already have access to countless reports and bodies and research groups who are coming up with ways to combat climate change but they are not being heeded. XR's goal is to make governments act on the information they already have.

So again then, what is the desired outcome of the protests? The PM could just say something along the lines of "We're doubling or efforts to greatly reduce the UK's carbon emissions by 2030". Is that enough?

I know it's not the job of protestors to do the governments job for them but it's such an impossible situation. What can the government realistically do that will have a meaningful impact and not be seen as eroding people's civil liberties?

BID0 wrote:

Hime wrote:

Tafdolphin wrote:

Hime wrote:Anyway, the point was that XR should present a list of achievable goals to give themselves a bit more credibility.

See I don't agree with this.

They're a protest group whose aim is to highlight the impending climate emergency/catastrophe. They are not a policy making think-tank. The governments of the world already have access to countless reports and bodies and research groups who are coming up with ways to combat climate change but they are not being heeded. XR's goal is to make governments act on the information they already have.

So again then, what is the desired outcome of the protests? The PM could just say something along the lines of "We're doubling or efforts to greatly reduce the UK's carbon emissions by 2030". Is that enough?

I know it's not the job of protestors to do the governments job for them but it's such an impossible situation. What can the government realistically do that will have a meaningful impact and not be seen as eroding people's civil liberties?

https://rebellion.earth/the-truth/demands/

Hime wrote:

BID0 wrote:

Hime wrote:

Tafdolphin wrote:

Hime wrote:Anyway, the point was that XR should present a list of achievable goals to give themselves a bit more credibility.

See I don't agree with this.

They're a protest group whose aim is to highlight the impending climate emergency/catastrophe. They are not a policy making think-tank. The governments of the world already have access to countless reports and bodies and research groups who are coming up with ways to combat climate change but they are not being heeded. XR's goal is to make governments act on the information they already have.

So again then, what is the desired outcome of the protests? The PM could just say something along the lines of "We're doubling or efforts to greatly reduce the UK's carbon emissions by 2030". Is that enough?

I know it's not the job of protestors to do the governments job for them but it's such an impossible situation. What can the government realistically do that will have a meaningful impact and not be seen as eroding people's civil liberties?

https://rebellion.earth/the-truth/demands/

Cool. Again, I'm not disagreeing with anyone and fully support any and all action against climate change. It's just that we hear over and over of the main causes and very few realistic, achievable solutions. That doesn't mean I'm saying we should do nothing but maybe a group as passionate as XR full of educated people could get i some ideas out there?