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Fallout 76 | Creating camps in the wasteland
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Parksey
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- Joined in 2008
PostRe: Fallout 76 | Building. *Just* building.
by Parksey » Sun Mar 07, 2021 8:50 am
Upon release, a lot of people said that an MMO Fallout just wouldn't work, for various reasons.
I think the core of F76 shows that it can work, and that the building and camp mechanics lend themselves to the format quite well. A large, interesting map is also a boon for that type of game.
However the game's big problem isn't that the genre is ill-suited to Fallout, but that the game is basically the F4 template shoehorned into that. Fallout 4 was a slower, more methodical single player role playing game. The combat was never great, but VATs and the slowing down of them mitigated that. It was a throwback to when your stats behind the screen affected damage and your chance to hit, and sort of made it a cross between real time and more numbers-based strategy.
This doesn't really chime well with a fast paced, always online game
Built from the ground up, it would have been far more compelling. As it is, the concept works, but bolting it on to the F4 framework is jarring.
Of course, they did that because it was by far the cheapest and most efficient way. It is just effectively a multiplayer mod for F4, though the world map does mean that it is at least worth playing through a little.
I don't really care for the base building too, and s ultimately the core combat isn't compelling enough to get me to play or grind things, compared to, say, Destiny, which excels in that moment-to-moment loop.
I think the core of F76 shows that it can work, and that the building and camp mechanics lend themselves to the format quite well. A large, interesting map is also a boon for that type of game.
However the game's big problem isn't that the genre is ill-suited to Fallout, but that the game is basically the F4 template shoehorned into that. Fallout 4 was a slower, more methodical single player role playing game. The combat was never great, but VATs and the slowing down of them mitigated that. It was a throwback to when your stats behind the screen affected damage and your chance to hit, and sort of made it a cross between real time and more numbers-based strategy.
This doesn't really chime well with a fast paced, always online game
Built from the ground up, it would have been far more compelling. As it is, the concept works, but bolting it on to the F4 framework is jarring.
Of course, they did that because it was by far the cheapest and most efficient way. It is just effectively a multiplayer mod for F4, though the world map does mean that it is at least worth playing through a little.
I don't really care for the base building too, and s ultimately the core combat isn't compelling enough to get me to play or grind things, compared to, say, Destiny, which excels in that moment-to-moment loop.
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jawa2
- Member
- Joined in 2020
PostRe: Fallout 76 | Building. *Just* building.
by jawa2 » Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:27 am
Victor Mildew wrote:..the lag that's present on anything you interact with. Every single button press for collecting etc, lag lag lag lag. And oh my god the combat is appalling, fighting fast enemies with gooseberry fool shooting mechanics in the previous games was bad enough, but take that and add input lag, oh my god...
Dang, it's a real shame that you're experiencing that much lag, Ad. I get it a little - sometimes when collecting stuff it won't register for a split second - but it's not too often. Even so, I have heard other players say they get lag, too, so it must be an issue with some setups.
OrangeRKN wrote:There are certainly a lot of bullet sponges but I wouldn't say it was a hard game (playing before the scaling changes)...
It'd be interesting to hear your thoughts once you have returned to the game, Orange. The scaling - I feel - has had most impact on players up to level 50 and very little on players higher than that. The hardcore players are relatively unaffected as they just wander about with their 5.56mm machine guns (legendary three-star ranked) and can kill almost any enemy up to level 50 in a shot or two. As a level 46 player I may face four level 46 ghouls with my .308 rifle whilst a level 250 player will face four level 50 ghouls with the best weapons; it's almost impossible for me to win and a walk in the park for the higher player. The change was welcomed by higher level players as they used to be able to one-shot everything and now they sometimes have to (gasp!) take two shots. Meanwhile I'm taking around 30 shots to take out the same four enemies.
OrangeRKN wrote:...But then I never experienced bad input lag either, and VATS used to work fine.
Yeah, I get only a little lag now and again; it's definitely not my main concern. But VATS... OMG! Yesterday I did a test and deliberately provoked a few ghouls into attacking me a few times. VATS focuses on enemies okay and I have the perk to select which body-part to aim at... but the system is totally broken; the "percentage hit chance" rank can be high and I'll regularly miss and, when you do hit, the damage is nonsense - the health meter for that body part can go down to zero and then you have to select another body part and get that down to zero. Often I have to get three or four body-parts down to zero before the enemy goes down. Fair enough for a tough enemy but not a ghoul in the Forest area. It's like some weird dance with VATS going crazy and enemies just not going down.
You're bang on, though - VATS used to be fine. I actually felt like a sharp-shooter in the Forest! Nowdays, even at a far higher level and with improved perk cards, I feel like I'm just starting the game.
I'm gonna take some video clips later to show - what I perceive to be! - the issues with VATS.
Parksey wrote:Upon release, a lot of people said that an MMO Fallout just wouldn't work, for various reasons.
I think the core of F76 shows that it can work, and that the building and camp mechanics lend themselves to the format quite well. A large, interesting map is also a boon for that type of game...
Agreed, Parksey!
Parksey wrote:...However the game's big problem isn't that the genre is ill-suited to Fallout, but that the game is basically the F4 template shoehorned into that. Fallout 4 was a slower, more methodical single player role playing game. The combat was never great, but VATs and the slowing down of them mitigated that. It was a throwback to when your stats behind the screen affected damage and your chance to hit, and sort of made it a cross between real time and more numbers-based strategy.
This doesn't really chime well with a fast paced, always online game...
Agreed again, Parksey!
There are some excellent aspects (environments, scale, camp-building) but the fighting is - imho - janky and frustrating; and this has been significantly amplified by the enemy scaling last autumn. A sense of progression has been lost as you don't feel like you're improving - and the desire to explore has diminished as you know that everywhere will have enemies at your level. There are no "quieter" or "dangerous" areas - it's the same everywhere. Okay, it can vary a title as the enemy types and volume can vary, but the variation isn't as it was. Before, a lower player could think of the Forest area as relatively safe and the Ash Heap as a no-go zone (until you'd ranked up)... now it's all the same; well, maybe "tough" and "tougher".
twitter.com/jawafour/status/1368248169004478473
Anyway...
I've re-built my current fave camp design in my current fave spot. I plan on leaving the camp building aspect for a while now and get back into my kit and weapon setup and testing out the fighting/VATS. I'll give it a go and see if I can get to grips with it.
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(not until the winter, though)
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