Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?

Anything to do with games at all.

Is gaming in a better place now?

Yes
15
52%
No
14
48%
 
Total votes: 29
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Winckle
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Winckle » Fri May 10, 2019 8:30 am

Cal wrote:
In online games Pay To Win must be some kind of willfully self-harming commercial decision - if it actually goes on in the way people seem to think it does. I mean, does it, though? Can anyone give an example of an online game where the developer/publisher has willfully implemented a deliberate and clear Pay To Win system designed directly to disproportionately advantage certain players against those who don't buy into the microtransactions/DLC? Have any such games doing this maintained their player base? Are they still around?

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Gemini73

PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Gemini73 » Fri May 10, 2019 8:41 am

Balladeer wrote:This is going to become one of those threads isn’t it.


I read the leaves this morning. It's a bit hazy, but not looking good. Something about a lock.

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Tafdolphin
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Tafdolphin » Fri May 10, 2019 8:41 am

Moggy wrote:
Balladeer wrote:This is going to become one of those threads isn’t it.


It's all Nick's fault. :x ;)


I mean, technically it is Nick's fault (I did ask!)

lol jk luv u Nick

Last edited by Tafdolphin on Fri May 10, 2019 8:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
Gemini73 wrote:You really are just an obnoxious little toad.

Yikes
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Cal
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Cal » Fri May 10, 2019 8:44 am

Moggy wrote:I am going to ignore the first part of the post as "pearl clutching progressives" is one of the most ridiculous phrases in existence. And buying a game you don't want to play just to own the libs is peak Cal.


:lol: It is! It absolutely is!

Moggy wrote:
Cal wrote:And I'm totally fine with Pay To Win in offline or SP games ($5 for an infinite ammo gun in RE2 Remake seems like a good commercial offer if, like me, you'd rather not faff about in the zombie apocalypse).


You are old enough to remember when infinite ammo, infinite lives etc was all done by a few button presses and cost you no extra. If you are happy paying $5 for that then that's fine, but let's not pretend it is a good commercial offer.


Yes, but things change - that's what this is all about, right? Are we happy with the changes? Not all of us, no. I don't mind most of it and unlike some I don't begrudge publishers and developers looking for ways to maximize their (often very considerable) investments in their products (that's their job, isn't it?). We can chafe against it, describe some practices as 'grubby', but it's all optional on the part of the consumer. Nobody is forced to buy into all the microtransaction/DLC nonsense. I spent an obscenely daft amount on the Persona Endless Night Collection (clearly over-priced and an unapologetic, blatant cash-grab on the part of the publisher), but it was my daft decision to hand over my cash. Atlus USA, the publisher, are not responsible for my poor decision-making.

The 'old days' are gone. This is the new reality. Margins are slim and the competition is now more cut-throat than ever. The advent of sites selling game keys at knock-down prices (I use them regularly) is just another reason why publishers often convince or demand their developers build-in all sorts of microtransactions and DLC to help mitigate against such clear threats to the bottom line. Unlike Jim Sterling, I don't see 'the industry giants' (e.g. EA, Activision, Ubisoft, etc) as the hateful caricature capitalist swine some like to paint them as. They are £multi-billion global brands with huge on-going financial exposure, employing hundreds (if not thousands) of people around the world, directly and indirectly, in a volatile and immensely risky business. They are entitled to set a price for their goods. And every one of us is equally entitled to say 'no thanks'.

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Karl_
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Karl_ » Fri May 10, 2019 9:00 am

Trelliz wrote:this thread will crash with no survivors.

THEY EXPECT ONE OF US IN THE WRECKAGE BROTHER

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BID0
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by BID0 » Fri May 10, 2019 9:18 am

Winckle wrote:
Balladeer wrote:
Trelliz wrote:Categorically worse, but i'm leaving identity and right/left politics out of this and stick to the business model or else this thread will crash with no survivors.

Jim, is that you!? ;)

To everyone saying how sick they are of TRIPLE AAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEE gubbins, which is more than fair enough and which I agree with, I would agree with the top comments on this page: indies. Also, first and second-party exclusives. Nintendonysoft are invested in creating games that make you want you to buy their machines, not pump money into their games but into the machines that play them; so while you may see some microtransactions, they're on the most part a damn sight better than your EAs Activisions et al.

I used to be categorically against platform exclusives, but Jim Sterling makes the point as you do, that because they want to have good quality games to sell their hardware, they don't need lootboxes/live services/microtransactions etc.

Microsoft didn't get that memo :lol:

They're giving their games away for free now, so that's subsidised by the live service model in their first party games.

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OrangeRKN
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by OrangeRKN » Fri May 10, 2019 9:29 am

"Show me one example of micro-transactions adversely affecting a game!"

[multiple examples]

"Yes but you don't have to buy them!"

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Balladeer
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Balladeer » Fri May 10, 2019 9:38 am

BID0 wrote:
Winckle wrote:I used to be categorically against platform exclusives, but Jim Sterling makes the point as you do, that because they want to have good quality games to sell their hardware, they don't need lootboxes/live services/microtransactions etc.

Microsoft didn't get that memo :lol:

They're giving their games away for free now, so that's subsidised by the live service model in their first party games.

Jim doesn’t actually mention Microsoft when he’s talking about this. I know nothing about them and their practices, so I included them for the sake of a quiet life.

Fat lot of good that did. (surveys thread, which is on fire)

GNamer admin.: visit your friendly neighbourhood affiliate!

Every console has one slow year in its first two. The Switch is now in year 3. Deep breath...
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Tafdolphin
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Tafdolphin » Fri May 10, 2019 9:43 am

I don't think the thread is on fire, really. Cal had a bad take (quelle surprise), and has been called out. Repeatedly. Him changing the goalposts is standard practice (and one of the reasons he was banned from Off Topic).

Gemini73 wrote:You really are just an obnoxious little toad.

Yikes
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Preezy
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Preezy » Fri May 10, 2019 9:48 am

Balladeer wrote:This is going to become one of those threads isn’t it.

Too late.

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Balladeer
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Balladeer » Fri May 10, 2019 10:07 am

Tafdolphin wrote:I don't think the thread is on fire, really. Cal had a bad take (quelle surprise), and has been called out. Repeatedly. Him changing the goalposts is standard practice (and one of the reasons he was banned from Off Topic).

Only takes one person with a match and some paraffin...

OR’s .gif made me :lol: no end.

GNamer admin.: visit your friendly neighbourhood affiliate!

Every console has one slow year in its first two. The Switch is now in year 3. Deep breath...
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Winckle
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Winckle » Fri May 10, 2019 10:08 am

Karl_ wrote:
Trelliz wrote:this thread will crash with no survivors.

THEY EXPECT ONE OF US IN THE WRECKAGE BROTHER

KARL: THE SERVER LOGS LIST ME, THE ADMINS, WINCKLE, BUT ONLY ONE POSTER. FIRST ONE TO POST EXAMPLES OF POOR MICROTRANSACTIONS, GETS TO STAY ON MY FORUM
*Karl posts fake ban log*
KARL: HE DIDN'T POST SO GOOD, WHO WANTS TO TRY NEXT?
TELL ME ABOUT CAL. WHY DOES HE DEFEND CORPORATIONS SO MUCH?
*the thread remains empty*
KARL: A LOT OF LOYALTY FOR A SHITPOSTER
CAL: OR PERHAPS HE'S WONDERING WHY YOU WOULD THREAD BAN SOMEONE, AND THEN BLOCK THEIR IP

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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Karl_ » Fri May 10, 2019 10:13 am

Winckle wrote:
Karl_ wrote:
Trelliz wrote:this thread will crash with no survivors.

THEY EXPECT ONE OF US IN THE WRECKAGE BROTHER

KARL: THE SERVER LOGS LIST ME, THE ADMINS, WINCKLE, BUT ONLY ONE POSTER. FIRST ONE TO POST EXAMPLES OF POOR MICROTRANSACTIONS, GETS TO STAY ON MY FORUM
*Karl posts fake ban log*
KARL: HE DIDN'T POST SO GOOD, WHO WANTS TO TRY NEXT?
TELL ME ABOUT CAL. WHY DOES HE DEFEND CORPORATIONS SO MUCH?
*the thread remains empty*
KARL: A LOT OF LOYALTY FOR A SHITPOSTER
CAL: OR PERHAPS HE'S WONDERING WHY YOU WOULD THREAD BAN SOMEONE, AND THEN BLOCK THEIR IP

KARL, SWEATING, GLANCING DOWN: You're a big guy...
CAL, ONE EYEBROW RAISED: For you.

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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Karl_ » Fri May 10, 2019 10:28 am

Serious post for nerds
Things I don't like about the way videogames are going:
  • Workers in the industry get shat on while CEOs make huge profits
  • Microtransactions and loot boxes are actually designed by psychologists deliberately to be addictive and I think that shouldn't be allowed
  • Influencer culture on social media seems manipulative to me, it's particularly exploitative when big companies get involved behind the scenes
  • Capital-G Gamers (on Reddit or whatever) are so reactionary it's depressing
Things I don't mind:
  • Indie games are great for people who like them, I'm happy they're out there, though I don't think I will ever understand the appeal personally
Things I like about the current gen:
  • Nintendo are putting some out some total classics on the Switch :toot: :wub:
  • We're making some progress with having more games with diversity, there are games out there for all sorts of different people now, I think that's cool
  • Jawa is for real playing through Dark Souls, and I can watch it in real time! What a time to be alive!

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Balladeer
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Balladeer » Fri May 10, 2019 10:33 am

Hello, nerd here:

Karl_ wrote:Things I don't mind:
  • Indie games are great for people who like them, I'm happy they're out there, though I don't think I will ever understand the appeal personally

This is interesting to me, because indie games encompass such a wide variety of genres and materials. Granted, a lot of them are 2D platformers and Metroidvanias, but there are also strategy games, puzzlers, rhythm games, shmups, dungeon crawlers, and I’m currently playing an indie JRPG.

What doesn’t ‘do it’ for you about indie games, Karl?

GNamer admin.: visit your friendly neighbourhood affiliate!

Every console has one slow year in its first two. The Switch is now in year 3. Deep breath...
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Preezy
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Preezy » Fri May 10, 2019 10:36 am

Balladeer wrote:What doesn’t ‘do it’ for you about indie games, Karl?

Karl only plays games produced by Fortune 500 companies.

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Manwell Pablo
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Manwell Pablo » Fri May 10, 2019 10:38 am

Cal wrote:
Moggy wrote:Is gaming in a better place? Sure, we have flashier graphics now. :datass:

Is gaming culture in a better place? I have no idea, other than this place I don't really get involved with it. As has been mentioned it is hard to pin down exactly what gaming culture is but it seems to encompass the views of people like Taf and the views of people like Cal. So as much as one side might not like the word, it is pretty diverse. ;)


My views about gaming amount to 'do what you want, how you want and don't apologise for any of it to people who don't have your best interests at heart'. This is exactly why a game like Subverse gets my dollar. I don't care about the content (I doubt I'll ever play the game I paid for) and I doubt I'd agree with everything about the game or its developers, but I do care about the principle (in this case, consciously pushing back against pearl-clutching progressives who seem to want to stamp out all the fun and sexiness from gaming).

Moggy wrote:Are microtransactions fantastic? For purely cosmetic items I don't really care. "Pay to win" is the work of the devil though. But that was the same a decade ago, the infamous horse armour was released in 2006. Yes, we are old.


In online games Pay To Win must be some kind of willfully self-harming commercial decision - if it actually goes on in the way people seem to think it does. I mean, does it, though? Can anyone give an example of an online game where the developer/publisher has willfully implemented a deliberate and clear Pay To Win system designed directly to disproportionately advantage certain players against those who don't buy into the microtransactions/DLC? Have any such games doing this maintained their player base? Are they still around? If they are, might it not be reasonable to assume that although people grumble, the majority must - evidentially - be okay with it, or surely the player base would simply vanish in disgust?

And I'm totally fine with Pay To Win in offline or SP games ($5 for an infinite ammo gun in RE2 Remake seems like a good commercial offer if, like me, you'd rather not faff about in the zombie apocalypse).


Yep FIFA

Sympathy is probably the wrong word but I can understand EA's confusion as why everyone starts screaming and shouting when they try similar pay to win models in other games while FIFA's clear pay to win is not only pushed more and more every year with no back lash but continues to increase popularity.

Last edited by Manwell Pablo on Fri May 10, 2019 10:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Moggy
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Moggy » Fri May 10, 2019 10:39 am

Karl_ wrote:[*] Jawa is for real playing through Dark Souls, and I can watch it in real time! What a time to be alive![/list]


But think of the 2,538 games that he has abandoned just so you can watch him play Dark Souls.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Moggy » Fri May 10, 2019 10:41 am

Preezy wrote:
Balladeer wrote:What doesn’t ‘do it’ for you about indie games, Karl?

Karl only plays games produced by Fortune 500 companies.


He only buys them from Amazon and gets them delivered to his Amazon Locker at Tesco. And he gets an Uber there and back. :x

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PostRe: Is gaming in a better place than it was a decade ago?
by Moggy » Fri May 10, 2019 10:51 am

Thinking about this thread, are things even that much different to 10 years ago? We had DLC and microtransactions back then. We had HD-DVD and Blu-Ray for the last generation consoles. Apps for streaming video were available on the last generation consoles. Xbox Live and PS+ were both a thing. There were indie developers releasing stuff for PC and console (remember Xbox Live Arcade) last generation.

Other than games looking better and taking up far more space, I don’t think it is all that different.

A better question would have been to look at gaming 20 years ago, things were much different in the late 90s compared to today.


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