KFC's new offensive, misleading and distressing TV commercial...

Denster wrote:I had a patient once who strawberry floated his dog. If that helps.

I'm assuming the dog didn't give consent.

Karl wrote:

Pancake wrote:

Karl wrote:Veganism is a life philosophy, not a religion. But its adherents sometimes preach with religious zeal.

Some people preach about their love of bacon with similar zeal!

OK. I am sure they are very annoying as well.

I was just trying to point out, probably clumsily, that people have double standards.

People refer to veganism as a life choice whose adherents sometimes preach with religious zeal but rarely consider that eating meat is also a life choice whose adherents sometimes preach with religious zeal.

People say that vegans have a 'holier than thou' attitude whilst sitting on their own moral high horse by saying 'I am above criticising what others choose to eat, I respect their choice so they should respect mine'.

People say that vegans are easily offended whilst getting easily offended themselves.

All of the above can of course be flipped, vegans are equally guilty of this.

I find it interesting!

Pancake wrote:I was just trying to point out, probably clumsily, that people have double standards.

Some people might. I don't though, I regard all preachiness equally.

It's not the same thing and will never be the same thing. Repeatedly saying it is doesn't make it so.
It's a ludicrous stance to take and actually undermines a reasonable point you make about unnecessary cruelty.

Karl wrote:

Pancake wrote:I was just trying to point out, probably clumsily, that people have double standards.

Some people might. I don't though, I regard all preachiness equally.

Preach it!

Lucien wrote:animals are created and raised in gooseberry fool conditions when they don't have to be

A problem which could be solved via legislation, which is ultimately very little to do with any individual consumer.

Lucien wrote:To be fair, you thought animals weren't sentient earlier so now you know they are I'm sure you'll change your diet immediately tomorrow.

Most people without a formal education in science think 'sentience' means 'sapience'. If I or Moggy thought for a second chickens were sapient then we would change our diet tomorrow.

Lucien wrote:chickens suffer more than tomatoes and it's pointless suffering so get cracking

It's not pointless. The point is to get delicious chicken meat.

Lucien wrote:You can replace "murdering" with killing and "kidnapping" with calf relocation. Now it applies to you.

Only if you accept killing an animal to eat it is 'murder' and killing a calf to eat it is 'kidnapping, then murder'. I think you'll find this is commonly disputed.

Karl wrote:

Lucien wrote:chickens suffer more than tomatoes and it's pointless suffering so get cracking

It's not pointless. The point is to get delicious chicken meat.

How about unnecessary, rather than pointless? Is the fact (and by gawd it is a fact) that fried chicken is delicious a good enough reason? Especially when you know that the animal industry has a huge carbon footprint and that a meat heavy diet is unhealthy. Fried chicken really is delicious but is that enough? I wrestle with that every day!

Yep.

Sure. It's enough for me; the meat industry is fairly far down my list of things I'd like to change about the world. But I have no quarrel with those who feel the weight of animal suffering (or associated carbon emissions!) more heavily than I do. (As long as they aren't pricks about it. )

Lucien wrote:

Moggy wrote:The point (and it's unbelievable that you can't see it) is that you 100% believe that meat is murder, rape, kidnapping, oppression and exploitation and can't see why it's different between animals and humans.

And yet you eat meat. Which, if you do 100% believe all that, makes you a terrifying psychopath.

If I for one millisecond thought that meat was murder, rape or any of the other things, then I would stop eating it. I wouldn't need to "cut down" (it's not a strawberry floating drug ) I'd stop, there and then.

The fact you need to slowly cut down on something that you believe is the equivalent of the rape, murder and kidnapping of humans is terrifying.

A terrifying psychopath.

You know full well, whatever language you use I don't care, that animals are created and raised in gooseberry fool conditions when they don't have to be. You use softer terms, whatever - the actual reality for the animals is the same regardless of which words we use. I'm changing my behaviour; you haven't/aren't going to change yours.

Your changing your behaviour damn slowly though. You believe it is rape and murder and you are still carrying on, you're just going to slow down a little bit. As you seem to think that murder and rape are the same thing for animals as well as humans and you carry on doing it, that's pretty scary.

To be fair, you thought animals weren't sentient earlier so now you know they are I'm sure you'll change your diet immediately tomorrow. Yes, to you animals are relocated away from their parents and such, but you know chickens suffer more than tomatoes and it's pointless suffering so get cracking.

I mixed up sentient and sapient. I deeply apologise oh wise one.

I'd agree chickens suffer more than tomatoes. That doesn't make it rape, murder and child abduction though.

Karl wrote:Sure. It's enough for me; the meat industry is fairly far down my list of things I'd like to change about the world. But I have no quarrel with those who feel the weight of animal suffering (or associated carbon emissions!) more heavily than I do. (As long as they aren't pricks about it. )

Cool. I think as long as someone has actually thought about it with an open mind and concluded, on balance, that they're happy to continue eating meat then that's fair enough, so be it. Unfortunately a lot of people simply won't think about it with an open mind, despite claiming to, preferring instead to be pricks about it.

Accepting vegetarianism is the only logical way the human race can move forward as a species.

Srs.

Eurgh I ate too much chicken last night.

I can feel it in my veins this morning

Dual wrote:Accepting vegetarianism is the only logical way the human race can move forward as a species.

Srs.

At the moment the human race can’t even come to an agreement that Nazis are bad.

Although Hitler was a vegetarian so maybe that's what you meant.

Moggy wrote:I'd agree chickens suffer more than tomatoes.

Tomatoes turn red when ripe as they are mortally embarrassed at being a naked teenager

Preezy wrote:

Moggy wrote:I'd agree chickens suffer more than tomatoes.

Tomatoes turn red when ripe as they are mortally embarrassed at being a naked teenager

Ketchup is blood.

You are putting blood on your chips.

And the chips are murdered potatoes.

You strawberry floating evil monster.

Lucien wrote:Controlled and forcefully impregnated, killed, their calves are taken away causing them great distress. And every animal involved dies much earlier than it should. The words can change (I didn't use murder) but the things going on are still a travesty.

Sentience is enough. When people accidentally hurt their dog they would never say "It's not sapient, don't worry".

And yet, despite believing that, you still eat animals and use animal products.

Lucien wrote:

Moggy wrote:

Lucien wrote:Controlled and forcefully impregnated, killed, their calves are taken away causing them great distress. And every animal involved dies much earlier than it should. The words can change (I didn't use murder) but the things going on are still a travesty.

Sentience is enough. When people accidentally hurt their dog they would never say "It's not sapient, don't worry".

And yet, despite believing that, you still eat animals and use animal products.

Yes. So do you. I know why I've done it in the past, and why I'm not at my perfect diet yet, so you aren't telling me anything I don't already know. As I said before, soon I'll not be doing it -- you will keep doing it, so what you've said there should be of far more concern to you.

You make no sense.

You believe that animals are raped and oppressed and that it is a travesty. And yet you still eat them. If you believe that then there are no excuses at all for still eating them. You are not addicted to a drug, you simply just eat something else. There are even meat substitutes out there that taste (sort of) like the real thing, you have no excuse at all.

I don't believe that. So why would it concern me? As I don't believe it, there is nothing to stop me continuing to eat meat.

If I ever thought the same way as you, then I would stop. And actually stop, not cut down from 7 to 4 meals and pat myself on the back for being so wonderful or some preachy bollocks about "I am trying to change so even though I am still eating them I am better than you".

Aren't you?