Legend of Zelda - General series chat

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Preezy
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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Preezy » Fri Mar 10, 2017 2:44 pm

Started playing A Link to the Past on my SNES emulator last night, it's a bit good isn't it? It looks really good too, I imagine I'd have been blown away if I'd experienced the jump from the original Zelda to this back in the day.

Might just turn out to be my first proper adventure in Hyrule :toot:

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Karl » Fri Mar 10, 2017 3:40 pm

A Link to the Past is a properly great game. Have fun!

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Squinty » Sat Mar 11, 2017 11:11 am

One of the best games ever, and the best Zelda game (well, I haven't played Breath of the Wild yet, that might be better).

Played through A Link Between Worlds again. Another amazing game :wub:

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by HaruKazuhira » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:14 pm

Thought I'd try and revive this thread with the talk of Skyward Sword on Switch being shared around the last couple days. I know this game is something of a mixed bag amongst most fans. Always got pretty heated whenever it was brought up back in SOMN lol. But personally I'm pretty biased towards it tho. It had that handheld Zelda touch but experienced on a console.

A revisited port on Switch could help iron out some problems but I don't think it would change the overall game much. Something that excited me is the potential of enhanced visuals. Since I felt it never really translates as well as it should have on Wii.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by OrangeRKN » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:28 pm

Skyward Sword is a top half Zelda game, it's fantastic, everyone knows that!

That said, if they do a remake I wouldn't mind the item descriptions not reappearing every play session. Make Fi completely optional too.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Ad7 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:34 pm

I really enjoyed skyward sword, but that strawberry floating big boss thing you had to fight over and over again has to go.

It had some great dungeons.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Cheeky Devlin » Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:29 pm

HaruKazuhira wrote:Thought I'd try and revive this thread with the talk of Skyward Sword on Switch being shared around the last couple days. I know this game is something of a mixed bag amongst most fans. Always got pretty heated whenever it was brought up back in SOMN lol. But personally I'm pretty biased towards it tho. It had that handheld Zelda touch but experienced on a console.

A revisited port on Switch could help iron out some problems but I don't think it would change the overall game much. Something that excited me is the potential of enhanced visuals. Since I felt it never really translates as well as it should have on Wii.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Robbo-92 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:50 pm

Ad7 wrote:I really enjoyed skyward sword, but that strawberry floating big boss thing you had to fight over and over again has to go.

It had some great dungeons.


Yep, for the most part I loved Skyward Sword but the Imprisoned can properly do one.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Octoroc » Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:36 am

I loved Skyward Sword. Here's hoping the rumours are true.

I'd like Windwaker/Twilight Princess HD on Switch too.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Wedgie » Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:23 am

Well the motion controls is a nightmare on Skyward Sword.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by deathofcows » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:35 am

HaruKazuhira wrote:Thought I'd try and revive this thread with the talk of Skyward Sword on Switch being shared around the last couple days. I know this game is something of a mixed bag amongst most fans. Always got pretty heated whenever it was brought up back in SOMN lol. But personally I'm pretty biased towards it tho. It had that handheld Zelda touch but experienced on a console.

A revisited port on Switch could help iron out some problems but I don't think it would change the overall game much. Something that excited me is the potential of enhanced visuals. Since I felt it never really translates as well as it should have on Wii.


I know I've probably said as much before, but I love the hell out of Skyward Sword.

I think it's the best controlling 3rd-person game I've ever played. And not even in a net-gain, rounding-up way: I'm not sure what small knack I luckily stumbled on to that others missed but I found the motion controls consistent and near-flawless. More than that I found the feel of them gave the game an analogue, sometimes near-expressive playfulness that hasn't been bettered. Breath of the Wild might have had more systemic and exploratory freedom, but in the second-by-second, degree-by-degree embodiment of Link (or the Beetle, or a bomb etc) I think Skyward Sword feels better.

And I know I already wrote an (apparently quite unpopular) article about it (https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017 ... f-the-wild) but though I love BotW I do feel its environments and spaces felt (if not looked) a little homogeneous by the end due to the consistent possibilities throughout (climb anything! fly anywhere! everything looks like hills! etc) - whereas Skyward Sword's hyper-focused and specific requirements actually gives it more meaningful difference in feel (the sand-sprinting of the desert compared with the water-pirouettes of the submerged forest compared with the stripped-back binaries and hide-and-seek panic of the silent realms etc) and a feeling of singular enclaves in a wider, unknown world.

In a similar way its environments each had a distinctive Zelda theme running throughout, baking them into the feel of the environment and making them feel more discreet, separate and thus giving it more of a variable tempo compared with BotW omni-present silence and environmental sounds (its way some of my favorite places in it are Korok Forest, Ganon's Castle and so on, where you get that familiar Zelda feel of a cordoned-off space with its own specific ever-mood).

And the music in Skyward Sword was the gooseberry fool. BotW has a great, soaring theme that is only used in the final battle and thus doesn't feel as much like a familiar swell of a motif that you've grown used to. Whereas variations of (e.g.) Skyward Sword's Fi's theme are used throughout and so feels like a gut punch when they recur at the end.

And so on, and so on. Don't get me wrong (and also, don't get me started on its lovely pastel-painterly art style) I don't think Skyward Sword has it all, nor is it perfect (I certainly get why it's Mario-style of toy-box levels as opposed to open, explore-able world felt like a step backwards). But I always feel a little sad that somehow people didn't gel with its Motion Controls (maybe my new, Zelda-packaged-in Motion Plus controller helped I don't know) or whatever and didn't get to enjoy it as much as I did.

The possibility of it coming to Switch - perhaps tweaked and streamlined and more accessible for a new audience - makes me really :D

Edit: I'd actually love to re-play this regardless to see if my opinion changes at all post-BotW and so on...

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by OrangeRKN » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:54 am

deathofcows wrote:And I know I already wrote an (apparently quite unpopular) article about it (https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017 ... f-the-wild)


I think I might have read this before and commented on it even, but this:

But it also subtly changes the binary of older 3D games; of the traversable, and then the unknowable, unreachable rest.

Before, limitations of technology resulted in smaller play spaces, built on the game language of infinite drops and insurmountable, sheer (unclimbable) cliffs. Places like Kokiri Forest were fringed with textures, like theatre set backdrops standing in for 'the rest of the forest'. These were non-literal, abstract renditions of places: built in blocks and borders.

But they were also possibility spaces - like childhood dens - where simplified shorthand can suggest much more. Now, I've written before about how the angular environments of older 3D reflected and enhanced my childhood (read: to this day) explorations of urban environments, all brick-walls and curbed edges. But I also think there was a different effect evoked by these older environments, not beholden to recognisable natural contours, where the interstitial detail between them didn't have to be designed or explained.


Is absolutely perfect.

The small areas with their impassable borders make a world feel more realistic to me than an entire open world because those constraints are more realistic, and match my experience of the world. I've lived in cities all my life, where you're always confined to moving down roads and paths, through gates and past walls that can't be climbed or jumped over (and I'm from Coventry, so that goes double when everything is brutalist post-war concrete). Even in the countryside everywhere is cut up into fields with hedges and fences, and you mostly stick to the paths laid out.

Then also as you say there is the other side of it, where the unknown other lets the imagination fill in the blanks, which lets the world be as big as it needs to. Geographically Kokiri forest in OoT is not far from Hyrule Castle at all, but when you start there you definitely feel like you are in a remote and vast forest. If the game was fully open world, that forest would be smaller, more knowable and less immersive. To try and achieve the same in BOTW Kokiri forest had to be deliberately cut off from the game world, and even then it doesn't feel as remote and the forest, despite best efforts, still feels smaller.

It is, completely, theatre, and just like theatre it takes a willing suspension of disbelief, but when that's given it's way more powerful than any attempt to create a truly large and open world.

As you say I think Skyward Sword understands this. The forest feels like a completely different place, far and remote from death mountain or the desert, whereas if they were connected through an open world they would appear closer and the world smaller.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Cheeky Devlin » Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:02 am

Alternative take. Skyward Sword is the worst 3D Zelda by a decent margin.

Everything that was wrong with Zelda and Nintendo at the time, all rolled up into one package. (I do still think it's a decent game, but it's poor by Zelda standards).

Edit: I'm at work so can't write a detailed post just now. If you want to see my feelings on it then just search my posts for Skyward Sword.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Frank » Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:17 am

The one thing I've missed playing through Breath of the Wild is the underwater stuff. Like you say, it's an enormous world to play around in, but it's all quite same-y.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by OrangeRKN » Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:18 am

Cheeky Devlin wrote:Skyward Sword is the worst 3D Zelda by a decent margin.


That would be Twilight Princess, the only 3D Zelda lacking its own distinct identity. There is a lot to love about Twilight Princess, but it's still just a better hardware and safe sequel to Ocarina of Time.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Cheeky Devlin » Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:31 am

OrangeRKN wrote:
Cheeky Devlin wrote:Skyward Sword is the worst 3D Zelda by a decent margin.


That would be Twilight Princess, the only 3D Zelda lacking its own distinct identity. There is a lot to love about Twilight Princess, but it's still just a better hardware and safe sequel to Ocarina of Time.

And yet I've found it far more fun than Skyward Sword which frustrated and bored me to the point where I have absolutely no interest in replaying it. To date it's the only 3D Zelda I've not completed on my first playthrough as I just wasn't enjoying it.

Twilight Princess has it's issues alright, but I'd much rather play it than SS any day of the week.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by captain red dog » Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:36 am

Motion control ruined Skyward Sword for me. The final battle was a pain in the ass because of it and I found most of fights unenjoyable because the controls were so inaccurate. I can't remember what the temple was called either, but the one in the desert was a ball ache and felt like it should have been in another game.

Twilight Princess I despised at the time, but when I played it again in HD on the Wii-U I bloody loved it.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Tomous » Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:14 pm

Skyward Sword probably has the most flaws of any 3D Zelda, but when it's good, it's very, very good. Certainly a mixed bag, but I'll always have a soft spot for it.

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by Hyperion » Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:26 pm

Skyward Sword is best Zelda

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PostRe: Legend of Zelda - General series chat
by imbusydoctorwho » Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:21 pm

Skyward Sword was alright but it was one of the weakest 3D Zelda games.
Mainly because the uninspired and boring Imprison boss battles that appear too many times throughout the game.
Also the motion controls were cool at first but they were a pain nearing the end, it was a product of it's time when motion controls were a thing.

I really hope that a port/remake is happening, as this game could benefit a lot more from the remake treatment that other Zeldas.

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