Star Trek Discovery

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Hexx
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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:20 am

I think I must be watching a different show to the rest of you

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Karl_ » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:21 am

Hexx wrote:I think I must be watching a different show to the rest of you

You should probably stop watching it :lol:

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:26 am

Karl wrote:
Hexx wrote:I think I must be watching a different show to the rest of you

You should probably stop watching it :lol:


Yeah that would be the sensible thing to do.

So no. STFU KARL :x

(Pike/Anson Mount is awesome and Saru was great until he became a post-puberty edge lord. So there's 2 things I like)

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Tafdolphin » Mon Mar 18, 2019 10:09 am

Yeah, I'm really enjoying it. They've nailed the balance between TOS’ monster of the week format and more modern serial storytelling.

The main story is intriguing, even if they've telegraphed the twist from miles away,and I continue to enjoy the characters.

What's not to like?

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:04 am

Tafdolphin wrote:What's not to like?


Oh you sweet naive child. Buckle up Kiddo for some long rambling thoughts

Let's start broad strokes. STOP THE strawberry floating CAMERA SPINNING

Everything is does is small minded. It shrinks the universe massively. Everything's connected. It's the exact same problem as the Star Wars Prequels (and it's getting worse). Everything is to do with 3-4 bland boring characters. It's shrunk a universe of possibilities and potential to...like 2 ships.

It has nothing new or exciting to say. (The last original thing it did was the spore drive....yeah) - ironically there's no sense of discovery or wonder [it came close with the sphere episode though but even that had flaws). It's utterly reliant on nostalgia to try and add pathos to poor writing - it strawberry floats it up. Mirror Universe. Spock. Section 31. Talos IV etc. All "wrong". If you're going to choose to use a crutch, use it properly.

It knows enough to recognize the Tropes, but lacks any skill or understanding in how to use them to create a compelling narrative

Everything is up to 11 on this. Everything is IMPORTANT ALL THE TIME. There's swirling camera angles and powerwalking to give the limp plot a sense of dynamism. (A friend said he thought Discovery was too action focused But there's actually very little - there's no space combat this year for instance, and up to this week I don't think this season had a phase fight...there was that amazing Klingon fight scene though :lol: Everything is just HIGH OCTANE so you confuse it for action)

But it's not. It's just become bland. (Previous trek for instances had alien of the week, holodeck malfunction, medical mystery, the doctor and seven learn to sing. It had a mix of tones and flavors, so when the important stuff happened - it stood out and we cared. In this EVERYTHING IS SO VERY IMPORTANT...and it's just boring as a result. [Early season 2 side stepped this problem a fair bit but it's rushed straight back to it]


Tilly. Just die bitch. (And I didn't mind her in season 1). That bridge scene this week where she accosted the Captain and Admiral? Cringe - the last in a long line. Kirk, Picard, Sisko, Archer, Janeway etc would all have shut that gooseberry fool down. Where's the "Shut Up Wesley" ? Letting her be constantly just so gosh dark Kooky all time just diminishes any character who puts up with it.

Anything to do with Ash Tyler. His Psych 101 of Pike was jaw dropping stupid. (Pike being the most competent and put together person on the show, had shown no previous signs of needing a "get over it" pep talk). That mess hall fight a few weeks ago wasn't interesting at all. Because who cares about these paper think characters? Again compare to the Orville if you don't want to look at Trek. What drives Pike? What drives Taylor? What drives Staments? (We know he's great, brilliant, the best...but why?) It's busy telling HIGH OCTANE IMPORTANT STORY that so little character moments happen. We get snappers...and they're often great...(the crew meeting, Amanda/Burnham stuff, Airiam this week etc)

In other Treks (or decent similar TV shows - see Orville) you wanted to be part of it. Part of the explorers. Part of the adventure. Part of a quasi family/community on a great ship. Does anyone want to part of Discovery?

Breaking down this week

This episode did great stuff with Airiam. Well acted and well crafted back story. Brilliant! She might as well have been a piece bridge scenery before. Love it. More of this please.

Oh! The problem is Control. The previously unmentioned and guessable AI that's been secretly running/advising Starfleet. Discovery throws out so many misdirection (e.g. what was up with Number 1?) that it forgets to leave any actual hints to it's mystery. An unsolvable mystery is not engaging. Unexpected twists can be great storytelling devices. You can wrongfoot the audience and surprise them (and excite them) or you can help them feel involved by working out the solution ahead of time. Discovery flubs it constantly, and it's a basic story telling failure.

Then we get the worlds slowest 'action' scene. Where people shout out a game of battleships and the ship very slowly turns left or right a bit. But it's exciting. And tense. And dramatic. And they aren't just mines btw...they're BLADE mines. Because isn't that more exciting. (Also what's up with the chief of security skulking in the bridge door looking shifty. Oh right she suspects Airiam. So she skulks obviously. And why? It doesn't do anything. She doesn't contribute to the resolution. Saru does that. Somehow.It's just redunt.

Then you get the climax. Where everyone is very sad that Airiam has to die. (They can't transport her back...because...?)
Everyone is very very very sad. Everyone comes to the bridge to be very very very sad. Burnham is very very very very sad because a character she's had 2 scenes with in 3 years might die (so very very very very very sad that she forgets to go look for the security officer that might be badly wounded). Staments is sad because...

As with pretty much any time that Discovery tried to have "a moment" you are disconnected entirely from the story and the big moment as you can see the writers hand forcing bits that don't work to try and manipulate and unearned payoff.


It's crap as a Trek show and still crap as a TV show even if you don't consider it's legacy and ignore all "Trek" criticisms - it just fails so much basic storytelling.

Which is a shame - because at the start of this season I really thought they'd course corrected pretty well

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Tafdolphin » Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:09 pm

Was fully expecting a

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response but instead I got

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And yeah there is a lot of stuff not to like when you put it like that. I don't really have a response except to say that none of that bothered me. It still tells a good story well, it still has likeable characters and it still looks great. I have no reverence for the Trek universe so the Red Angel could end up being a lycra-ed up Bill Shatner and I wouldn't mind, as long as it continued to deal as well as it is doing with its character work and worldbuilding.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:13 pm

Tafdolphin wrote:Was fully expecting a

Image

response but instead I got

Image

And yeah there is a lot of stuff not to like when you put it like that. I don't really have a response except to say that none of that bothered me. It still tells a good story well, it still has likeable characters and it still looks great. I have no reverence for the Trek universe so the Red Angel could end up being a lycraed up Bill Shatner and I wouldn't mind, as long as it continued to deal as well as it is doing with its character work and worldbuilding.


Fair enough - not going to try and convince you should hate it.

Also - haven't you been paying attention? The Red Angel is obviously going to be Tilly :roll:

I don't think it's just it's Trek connection that makes me dislike (although it's a key reason) - look at Pike. I don't like him cus he was in the one episode that one time (That Cage is DIRE). I like him because it's a decent character, with consistent motivations played by an ok actor. If they called him "Bike" or "Tike" etc I'd still like the character.

As it's own entity it fails badly I think.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Tue Mar 19, 2019 12:19 pm

https://www.cbr.com/star-trek-discovery ... ca-romijn/

Romijn was a cast member? hasn't she had one scene?

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Tafdolphin » Tue Mar 19, 2019 12:23 pm

Hexx wrote:https://www.cbr.com/star-trek-discovery-losing-anson-mount-rebecca-romijn/

Romijn was a cast member? hasn't she had one scene?


Yeah, she was there for about 4 minutes. I suspect she'll return but meh, no great loss.

Shame about Pike though.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Tue Mar 19, 2019 12:25 pm

I hadn't realised there was only 2 episodes left. I've no idea where it's going - which I suppose is a good thing

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Karl_ » Tue Mar 19, 2019 12:27 pm

Pike is a very strong character within the show and one of the things I really like about this season. I'm not surprised but it's still disappointing.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Corazon de Leon » Tue Mar 19, 2019 12:52 pm

There's allegations that Anson Mount had an altercation with a production crew member. Don't know if this is indicative of why he's out.

The missus thinks there's gonna be an Enterprise themed spin-off.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Tue Mar 19, 2019 12:59 pm

Corazon de Leon wrote:There's allegations that Anson Mount had an altercation with a production crew member. Don't know if this is indicative of why he's out.


Literally covered in the link I posted. :roll:

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by TV Dinner » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:52 pm

At one point this show was supposed to have a new crew every season, it looks like they've switched that to new captains instead. I would like a Pike Enterprise spin-off but he's blatantly going to suffer his pre-Menagerie injury in the finale.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Corazon de Leon » Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:51 pm

Hexx wrote:
Corazon de Leon wrote:There's allegations that Anson Mount had an altercation with a production crew member. Don't know if this is indicative of why he's out.


Literally covered in the link I posted. :roll:


As if I read your posts :slol:

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Garth » Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:53 pm

For some reason I was already under the impression that Pike would be a one series captain.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:04 pm

Corazon de Leon wrote:
Hexx wrote:
Corazon de Leon wrote:There's allegations that Anson Mount had an altercation with a production crew member. Don't know if this is indicative of why he's out.


Literally covered in the link I posted. :roll:


As if I read your posts :slol:


But you must do to know to respond here. 8-)

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Corazon de Leon » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:06 pm

Hexx wrote:
Corazon de Leon wrote:
Hexx wrote:
Corazon de Leon wrote:There's allegations that Anson Mount had an altercation with a production crew member. Don't know if this is indicative of why he's out.


Literally covered in the link I posted. :roll:


As if I read your posts :slol:


But you must do to know to respond here. 8-)


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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Fri Mar 22, 2019 1:51 pm

Well that was chuffin stupid, but the Red Angel was a genuine surpise

[No episode spoilers!]

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Tafdolphin » Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:18 pm

That was a bad episode. Started poorly, continued with a bizarrely nonsensical plot, ended ok.

Tilly was indeed nothing but annoying too. And what was with the doctor going to a strawberry floating Star Fleet admiral with his boyfriend problems? What?

Liked the discussion on pan-sexuality though.

Gemini73 wrote:You really are just an obnoxious little toad.

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