Star Trek Discovery

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Somebody Else's Problem
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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Somebody Else's Problem » Fri Apr 19, 2019 7:15 pm

Lagamorph wrote:And a bit of a wish list for Season 3,
  • Stop making Michael the center of the Universe. For 2 seasons literally everything has revolved around her, it's time to move on.



Stop making the main character the main character?

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Lagamorph » Fri Apr 19, 2019 7:18 pm

Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Lagamorph wrote:And a bit of a wish list for Season 3,
  • Stop making Michael the center of the Universe. For 2 seasons literally everything has revolved around her, it's time to move on.



Stop making the main character the main character?

The repeated "Michael is the saviour of the entire strawberry floating universe" goes a bit beyond just main character. You might as well just call her Goku with how things are going.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Peter Crisp » Fri Apr 19, 2019 7:53 pm

Lagamorph wrote:I've actually held off on watching season 2 of The Orville, I've got it ready to binge on my Sky Q box though. I wanted to wait for it to be finished so I didn't have to keep waiting week to week.

But yeah, Season 1 of The Orville was better than both seasons of Discovery have been so far.


You're in for a treat as season 2 is great :D .
As I said it's like really good Next Gen and tackles some tricky moral issues.

jiggles wrote:Nobody with a VR headset is going to be using it regularly this time next year, let alone in 4 years time.


Posted 16th March 2016. Let's see.
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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Lagamorph » Fri Apr 19, 2019 8:05 pm

So many of the problems Discovery has could have been solved by having it not be a prequel.
You could have done the Time Suit and Control stuff way better in a post-Nemesis show, and given there are comments from the show runners regarding season 3 being in the future means they don't have to worry about canon (Not that they've particularly worried about it until this point) just further reinforces that Discovery being a prequel show was a huge mis-step and they're finally realising it.

The Time Suit technology is completely out of place in a pre-TOS setting, but in a post-Nemesis setting you could have maybe gotten away with it.
And for Control, a far more interesting way would have been that, after Sloan was caught in DS9, the remainder of Section 31 devise a plan to create an AI that can carry on their work even in the event that their agents are discovered/captured/killed and even carry on in the event of Section 31 being seemingly wiped out. From there you follow a similar plot of the AI gaining increasing power as it spreads secretly through Starfleet until it either devises its own plans. You could even explain the whole nano-bot semi-assimilation thing as being based on Borg technology that Section 31 obtained.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Peter Crisp » Fri Apr 19, 2019 8:20 pm

Lagamorph wrote:So many of the problems Discovery has could have been solved by having it not be a prequel.
You could have done the Time Suit and Control stuff way better in a post-Nemesis show, and given there are comments from the show runners regarding season 3 being in the future means they don't have to worry about canon (Not that they've particularly worried about it until this point) just further reinforces that Discovery being a prequel show was a huge mis-step and they're finally realising it.

The Time Suit technology is completely out of place in a pre-TOS setting, but in a post-Nemesis setting you could have maybe gotten away with it.
And for Control, a far more interesting way would have been that, after Sloan was caught in DS9, the remainder of Section 31 devise a plan to create an AI that can carry on their work even in the event that their agents are discovered/captured/killed and even carry on in the event of Section 31 being seemingly wiped out. From there you follow a similar plot of the AI gaining increasing power as it spreads secretly through Starfleet until it either devises its own plans. You could even explain the whole nano-bot semi-assimilation thing as being based on Borg technology that Section 31 obtained.


I can handle all that my main gripe is with the shows dark theme.
I know it's edgy and all the cool kids do dark themes these days but Trek is supposed to have an overarching theme of hope in the future. Yes, things in Trek do go badly wrong and gooseberry fool like the Dominion War happens but the Federation are supposed to be the good guys (they don't always live up to this but they try) and Discovery just feels out of character for a Trek show for me.

I'm enjoying it but I think I'd prefer if it was a standalone Sci-fi series not set in the Trek universe.

jiggles wrote:Nobody with a VR headset is going to be using it regularly this time next year, let alone in 4 years time.


Posted 16th March 2016. Let's see.
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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Hexx » Fri Apr 19, 2019 9:07 pm

There’s one more Orville btw

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Peter Crisp » Fri Apr 19, 2019 11:08 pm

Hexx wrote:There’s one more Orville btw


Great news :toot: :toot: :toot: :toot: .

jiggles wrote:Nobody with a VR headset is going to be using it regularly this time next year, let alone in 4 years time.


Posted 16th March 2016. Let's see.
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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Somebody Else's Problem » Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:38 pm

So, they've built a time suit and gone into the future. This is going to be how 29th century Starfleet gets time travel tech, isn't it?

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Lagamorph » Sat Apr 20, 2019 11:02 pm

Somebody Else's Problem wrote:So, they've built a time suit and gone into the future. This is going to be how 29th century Starfleet gets time travel tech, isn't it?

Given that they've gone to the 32nd Century I'm going to say no.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Somebody Else's Problem » Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:28 am

Lagamorph wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:So, they've built a time suit and gone into the future. This is going to be how 29th century Starfleet gets time travel tech, isn't it?

Given that they've gone to the 32nd Century I'm going to say no.


I thought they'd only gone forward 500 years. If they've gone to the 32nd century, getting back will be trivially easy.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Lagamorph » Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:06 am

Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Lagamorph wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:So, they've built a time suit and gone into the future. This is going to be how 29th century Starfleet gets time travel tech, isn't it?

Given that they've gone to the 32nd Century I'm going to say no.


I thought they'd only gone forward 500 years. If they've gone to the 32nd century, getting back will be trivially easy.

950 years.

I suspect the writers will either ignore everything that's been established about 29th/31st Century Starfleet, or go with some bullshit "Let's do an Andromeda style collapse of civilisation" type plot.

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Zellery wrote:Good post Lagamorph.
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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Somebody Else's Problem » Sun Apr 21, 2019 5:37 pm

Lagamorph wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Lagamorph wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:So, they've built a time suit and gone into the future. This is going to be how 29th century Starfleet gets time travel tech, isn't it?

Given that they've gone to the 32nd Century I'm going to say no.


I thought they'd only gone forward 500 years. If they've gone to the 32nd century, getting back will be trivially easy.

950 years.

I suspect the writers will either ignore everything that's been established about 29th/31st Century Starfleet, or go with some bullshit "Let's do an Andromeda style collapse of civilisation" type plot.


In fairness, why would 32nd Century Starfleet look anything like 29th Century Starfleet?

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Lagamorph » Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:08 pm

Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Lagamorph wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Lagamorph wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:So, they've built a time suit and gone into the future. This is going to be how 29th century Starfleet gets time travel tech, isn't it?

Given that they've gone to the 32nd Century I'm going to say no.


I thought they'd only gone forward 500 years. If they've gone to the 32nd century, getting back will be trivially easy.

950 years.

I suspect the writers will either ignore everything that's been established about 29th/31st Century Starfleet, or go with some bullshit "Let's do an Andromeda style collapse of civilisation" type plot.


In fairness, why would 32nd Century Starfleet look anything like 29th Century Starfleet?

I just mean in terms of the available tech. Even 29th Century Starfleet could just open up a portal and send Discovery back home within about 5 minutes of them arriving, 31st Century Starfleet would have an even easier time of it. I'm just saying that the writers of Discovery aren't going to be as "free from canon" as they seem to expect. And there's a lot of rumours going around that Season 3 is basically going to be "The Federation has collapsed/gone to gooseberry fool in the 32nd Century" even though we know it was just fine only a hundred years earlier, and it would take way longer than that for something the size of the Federation to collapse.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Peter Crisp » Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:22 pm

How far forward has been shown in any real detail on the shows?
Yes, Captain Braxton is from the 29th century but other than that he's got a time ship what do we actually know about the federation he's from? For all we know the Federation could be down to a handful of core worlds.

jiggles wrote:Nobody with a VR headset is going to be using it regularly this time next year, let alone in 4 years time.


Posted 16th March 2016. Let's see.
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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Lagamorph » Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:27 pm

Peter Crisp wrote:How far forward has been shown in any real detail on the shows?
Yes, Captain Braxton is from the 29th century but other than that he's got a time ship what do we actually know about the federation he's from? For all we know the Federation could be down to a handful of core worlds.

We've seen Daniel's from the 31st Century in Enterprise as well, everything he said seemed to imply the Federation was alive and well in his time.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Zartan » Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:30 pm

Really a bit down on the last few episodes of Discovery, I enjoyed it for the most part. Just the whole control story line being utter chuff.

That said for season 3 I would much rather we stayed on the Enterprise with Pike, No 1, and Spock

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Garth » Mon Apr 22, 2019 11:27 pm

I really enjoyed the finale :shifty:

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Return_of_the_STAR » Tue Apr 23, 2019 1:32 am

So does the very ending of the show suggest that season three will be more about the enterprise? Or are they setting up for an enterprise spin off? They made a pretty big point of suddenly showing certain members of the enterprise crew on the bridge right at the end?

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by Lagamorph » Tue Apr 23, 2019 7:16 am

Return_of_the_STAR wrote:So does the very ending of the show suggest that season three will be more about the enterprise? Or are they setting up for an enterprise spin off? They made a pretty big point of suddenly showing certain members of the enterprise crew on the bridge right at the end?

Season 3 is going to be about Discovery in the future from the looks of things.

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PostRe: Star Trek Discovery
by NBK » Tue Apr 23, 2019 8:02 am

Return_of_the_STAR wrote:So does the very ending of the show suggest that season three will be more about the enterprise? Or are they setting up for an enterprise spin off? They made a pretty big point of suddenly showing certain members of the enterprise crew on the bridge right at the end?


I'm trying to get my head around the concept of a spin off from a spin off where the spin off was the original that spawned the spin off, but it's too early in the morning.

Garth wrote:I really enjoyed the finale :shifty:


Same! Much like Doctor Who, I don't know enough about (or more likely can never remember the details of) previous series or extended cannon, so I'm quite happy enjoying this on its own merit. That being said, the bants between Georgiou and Security Officer With the Face Things when they were going for Leyland was pretty cringey ("Yum yum" etc.).

I've been watching and enjoying The Orville as well, just got the last couple of episodes to go. As others have said, it's practically TNG with a different cast. It'd be interesting to see if it eventually goes down the extended Universe route, or sticks with its smaller scale.

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