Nintendo Switch Chat Thread Thrii

[Squinty]

Bought Hollow Knight because it would be rude not to. I had a quid saved up in coins, so that wasn't too bad.

[Jenuall]

Hollow Knight is such a good game as well.

[Robbo-92]

Started Gris last night, only played about 20 minutes or so but other than the art style is really nice I can’t really say much at the moment, hopefully I’ll get chance to play through this over the weekend, then I have to try Hollow Knight again.

[Banjo]

Hollow Knight is such a good game as well.

I bounced off it real hard. Really gutted about that, as it opened strongly but by the end I was so ready for it all to be over and have not felt any temptation to go back to it, even though there's likely a raft of content I missed out on.

[Jenuall]

Hollow Knight is such a good game as well.

I bounced off it real hard. Really gutted about that, as it opened strongly but by the end I was so ready for it all to be over and have not felt any temptation to go back to it, even though there's likely a raft of content I missed out on.

Shame, but you can't please all the people all the time!

Are you not a fan of the genre generally or was it something specific about HK that put you off?

[Choclet-Milk]

Another one for Hollow Knight here. I'm not massive on Metroidvania games and tend to lose steam after a few hours, but I've heard nothing but good things about this. It only cost £3.56 with the points I had saved up, so I really had no excuse not to try it.

[shy guy 64]

shyguy64 do you want ds zelda games port to switch.

no i think were fine for zelda games just now

[Banjo]

Hollow Knight is such a good game as well.

I bounced off it real hard. Really gutted about that, as it opened strongly but by the end I was so ready for it all to be over and have not felt any temptation to go back to it, even though there's likely a raft of content I missed out on.

Shame, but you can't please all the people all the time!

Are you not a fan of the genre generally or was it something specific about HK that put you off?

I rather enjoy a Metroidvania. In recent years I've had good times with Guacamelee, Steamworld Dig 2 and Yoku's Island Express, though it's not a genre I return to super regularly.

With Hollow Knight, there were a number of small instances that gradually pooled together to dampen my enthusiasm: Firstly I don't think the Soulsesque method of vague storytelling works in its favour, as it draws some comparisons to that series that it can't match. Namely I plain didn't enjoy the combat. There is far too much of it and while you get a fairly broad pool of moves to utilise, it is the only pool of moves you get. On reflection I realised that I plain didn't care for that method of storytelling in the Souls games as well, but having a robust sense of customisation over my character aided in my investment and roleplaying. In Hollow Knight, I had zero attachment to the world and narrative being presented to me to spur me on to the end, and I straight up didn't enjoy the combat it provided.

Secondly, I think it's actually quite a poor Metroidvania for two reasons. The first is that it's too damn big. Absurdly so in fact. My final playtime ended up at over 30 hours, and at least 15+ of those were slogging my way through locations as my interest was dwindling. There's a bit of a thrill when you think you've fully explored a map then it turns out oh gooseberry fool there's more, but once that starts to repeat I found myself getting frustrated. Those previous 3 games I've mentioned I completed in a third of the time (at full completion too) and not once did I feel fatigued by the experience, and I have since gone back to replay them. Little things alongside it, like how the fast travel system made dying to a boss a complete pain in the arse as even the closest fast travel points could be a decent trek away, and then said bosses were fairly boring as I had that one and only set of tools to work with, no alternate weapons or approaches. It's unfortunate that I didn't click with the combat from the very beginning, as it is reliant on engagement with it to get the most out of the game.

The other reason why I feel it's a poor Metroidvania is because I believe it is unnecessarily restrictive with the abilities it gives you. At the beginning you can jump and attack, nothing else. I understand wanting to trickle abilities to the player to make exploration of the world gradual and keep them returning to previous areas, but the abilities you find in Hollow Knight are by and large deeply uninspired. An air dash (effectively a running jump), wall jumping, a double jump. Super Mario 64 gave us all of these (or approximations of) for free back in 1996, and the concept of a longer jump has been a popular staple since the first Super Mario Bros. So when I had my first 'Super Metroid Moment' of walking off a ledge and noticing that it was too high to jump back up, I audibly groaned. That was a nice way of indicating to the player that they needed to progress decades ago, it's a design trait that belongs in the past. Keeping the focus on abilities, Yoku's and Dig 2 did an excellent job with these; the former by having such a different spin on the genre that it's abilties were unpredictable in nature, and the latter by them being genuine upgrades for your character that supplanted earlier ones. The grappling hook was a great addition, and then the jetpack pushed it further! They felt like genuine upgrades that you wouldn't expect, and kept the pace of the game brisk, especially in the latter stretch.

Not since Yakuza 0 have I been so disappointed by a game that showed such promise. I view Hollow Knight as an archaic game: It's made with a lot of love and care to detail, with excellent production values and a raft of content, but the underlying design of the game is doing little to push and challenge what the genre is capable of. It's a (team) cherry picking of all different bits and pieces of what makes good metroidvanias, but unfortunately that just isn't something that appeals to me anymore. I like these experiences focused and willing to attempt new ideas, with a playtime that I could comfortably rattle through in an evening should I please*, I've got no time for a really pretty game that tows the line. Big post.

*I know you can skip plenty of the game and rush to the end, but I always want to explore a world and do full runs if possible.

EDIT: Absolutely loathed how the map worked as well. I initially thought it cool, but when it had to be done for every area, despite the fact that it filled about 10% of that area, and you couldn't fill it yourself even with access to a pen and paper because you had to find that stupid merchant first (Cornifer?), I just completely lost my patience with it.

[OrangeRKN]

There is far too much of it and while you get a fairly broad pool of moves to utilise, it is the only pool of moves you get.

I had that one and only set of tools to work with, no alternate weapons or approaches.

I'm not sure to what extent you're applying this, but I don't agree. Charms and their combination allow for a variety of builds tailored to different approaches to combat.

As an example, my approach to bosses would change between three general strategies

1) Magic build, pouring everything into soul and using the various spells and almost entirely ignoring melee
2) Aggressive melee, built around high damage output and dodging
3) Tank build, built around either giving myself lots of (unhealable) health, or around being able to heal often while dealing low, passive damage

I've also played Yoku's Island Express and Steamworld Dig 2, and while I agree completely on the former, I felt the upgrades in the latter with the grappling hook and jetpack mostly just trivialised exploration and movement to the point where the game just became hoovering things up until the end. In contrast I really like the feeling of vulnerability that you start with in Hollow Knight.

[Banjo]

The charms added little to me, as they never felt like enough of a change to feel worthwhile. Though I concede that at this point, my opinion was stooped low enough that it would an absolute miracle to salvage the game for me. I was unimpressed by the initial state of the combat and disheartened by what I consider uninspired upgrades, the narrative and the way it was told was a fat load of nothing to me, so by this stage any variety the charms may have been able to offer was too little, too late. What good are those approaches you took if they're centred around systems I didn't like?

Returning to Dig 2, I instead got a feeling of urgency from those upgrades. To me it kept the pace of the game brisk, much like how the gradual upgrades to your Pickaxe and Steamarm meant you never had to spend endless time chipping through blocks. By the end of the game I was willing to blast through to the final boss and the game had provided me with tools to accelerate doing so, the jetpack in particular being incredibly late on in the game. Hollow Knight does offer Nail upgrades, but there's never a succinct way to travel back to the NPC that offers them, and I later read that bosses actually have more health with each upgrade you acquire, rendering the point of them a little moot. And as that map got ever expansive, I got increasingly fed up of navigating it. It's rare that I'll leave content in a game to the sidelines, but I simply have no interest in any more of the optional stuff Hollow Knight offers. It bored me.

I am genuinely gutted by this, as I was entranced by the moody opener and really wanted to love it. The shine wore off pretty quickly though and my abiding memories are of trudging through it on a sense of obligation.

[OrangeRKN]

What good are those approaches you took if they're centred around systems I didn't like?

I guess I'm arguing that, for example, if you didn't like the melee, you could play as a mage, and if you didn't like the pattern of finding breaks during a boss to heal, you could change how your health works to be greater but not replenishable. So I think there are differing approaches possible towards combat in the game, at least with more variety than you give it credit. I would add however that it can take a while for some of that variety to open up, and it is somewhat dependent on you seeking out various optional charms. Hollow Knight as a game will punish a player for simply trying to get through the "main" content while ignoring what is optional.

[The Watching Artist]

Bought Hollow Knight because it would be rude not to. I had a quid saved up in coins, so that wasn't too bad.

It's really bloody good so I'm sure you'll like it.

[Banjo]

For those looking to pre-order physical titles, TheGameCollection currently have a promo where spending under £75 nets you 5% off final price, and over £75 gets you 10% off. I had some reward points on there accumulated so pre-ordered Fire Emblem and Astral Chain for £62. Pretty pleased with that.

[coldspice]

Do you need to pay up-front to get the discount?

[Jenuall]

Hollow Knight is such a good game as well.

I bounced off it real hard. Really gutted about that, as it opened strongly but by the end I was so ready for it all to be over and have not felt any temptation to go back to it, even though there's likely a raft of content I missed out on.

Shame, but you can't please all the people all the time!

Are you not a fan of the genre generally or was it something specific about HK that put you off?

I rather enjoy a Metroidvania. In recent years I've had good times with Guacamelee, Steamworld Dig 2 and Yoku's Island Express, though it's not a genre I return to super regularly.

With Hollow Knight, there were a number of small instances that gradually pooled together to dampen my enthusiasm: Firstly I don't think the Soulsesque method of vague storytelling works in its favour, as it draws some comparisons to that series that it can't match. Namely I plain didn't enjoy the combat. There is far too much of it and while you get a fairly broad pool of moves to utilise, it is the only pool of moves you get. On reflection I realised that I plain didn't care for that method of storytelling in the Souls games as well, but having a robust sense of customisation over my character aided in my investment and roleplaying. In Hollow Knight, I had zero attachment to the world and narrative being presented to me to spur me on to the end, and I straight up didn't enjoy the combat it provided.

Secondly, I think it's actually quite a poor Metroidvania for two reasons. The first is that it's too damn big. Absurdly so in fact. My final playtime ended up at over 30 hours, and at least 15+ of those were slogging my way through locations as my interest was dwindling. There's a bit of a thrill when you think you've fully explored a map then it turns out oh gooseberry fool there's more, but once that starts to repeat I found myself getting frustrated. Those previous 3 games I've mentioned I completed in a third of the time (at full completion too) and not once did I feel fatigued by the experience, and I have since gone back to replay them. Little things alongside it, like how the fast travel system made dying to a boss a complete pain in the arse as even the closest fast travel points could be a decent trek away, and then said bosses were fairly boring as I had that one and only set of tools to work with, no alternate weapons or approaches. It's unfortunate that I didn't click with the combat from the very beginning, as it is reliant on engagement with it to get the most out of the game.

The other reason why I feel it's a poor Metroidvania is because I believe it is unnecessarily restrictive with the abilities it gives you. At the beginning you can jump and attack, nothing else. I understand wanting to trickle abilities to the player to make exploration of the world gradual and keep them returning to previous areas, but the abilities you find in Hollow Knight are by and large deeply uninspired. An air dash (effectively a running jump), wall jumping, a double jump. Super Mario 64 gave us all of these (or approximations of) for free back in 1996, and the concept of a longer jump has been a popular staple since the first Super Mario Bros. So when I had my first 'Super Metroid Moment' of walking off a ledge and noticing that it was too high to jump back up, I audibly groaned. That was a nice way of indicating to the player that they needed to progress decades ago, it's a design trait that belongs in the past. Keeping the focus on abilities, Yoku's and Dig 2 did an excellent job with these; the former by having such a different spin on the genre that it's abilties were unpredictable in nature, and the latter by them being genuine upgrades for your character that supplanted earlier ones. The grappling hook was a great addition, and then the jetpack pushed it further! They felt like genuine upgrades that you wouldn't expect, and kept the pace of the game brisk, especially in the latter stretch.

Not since Yakuza 0 have I been so disappointed by a game that showed such promise. I view Hollow Knight as an archaic game: It's made with a lot of love and care to detail, with excellent production values and a raft of content, but the underlying design of the game is doing little to push and challenge what the genre is capable of. It's a (team) cherry picking of all different bits and pieces of what makes good metroidvanias, but unfortunately that just isn't something that appeals to me anymore. I like these experiences focused and willing to attempt new ideas, with a playtime that I could comfortably rattle through in an evening should I please*, I've got no time for a really pretty game that tows the line. Big post.

*I know you can skip plenty of the game and rush to the end, but I always want to explore a world and do full runs if possible.

EDIT: Absolutely loathed how the map worked as well. I initially thought it cool, but when it had to be done for every area, despite the fact that it filled about 10% of that area, and you couldn't fill it yourself even with access to a pen and paper because you had to find that stupid merchant first (Cornifer?), I just completely lost my patience with it.

Whilst I loved the game myself I do think you make some valid points, but I also think OR's counterpoints cover much of what I would have said in response!

There are things that I would dearly like to see them improve upon in the upcoming sequel (? or is it DLC?) and the map and certain aspects of world traversal and exploration are some of the key ones!

[Cheeky Devlin]

+1 for bouncing off of Hollow Knight. It just didn't really grab me at all.

[Balladeer]

Something something mushroom trampolines.

[Banjo]

Do you need to pay up-front to get the discount?

To my knowledge, no. But let me wait and see if I get charged in the next day or so once the order is processed. Deal is active until the end of the 16th, and includes older titles too, so if there's only one upcoming game catching the eye you can reach the £75 mark by getting an already released game.

There are things that I would dearly like to see them improve upon in the upcoming sequel (? or is it DLC?) and the map and certain aspects of world traversal and exploration are some of the key ones!

I've seen Silksong referred to as a sequel. Unfortunately I have no real interest in it, I' just accepting that Hollow Knight is not for me.

[ITSMILNER]

For those looking to pre-order physical titles, TheGameCollection currently have a promo where spending under £75 nets you 5% off final price, and over £75 gets you 10% off. I had some reward points on there accumulated so pre-ordered Fire Emblem and Astral Chain for £62. Pretty pleased with that.

Nice one! I pre-ordered

Super Mario Maker 2
Marvel Ultimate Alliance 3
Astral Chain
Pokemon Sword
Luigi’s Mansion 3

Works out less than £36 each

[Fisher]

i may download some eshop games next week.