Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Karl_ » Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:01 pm

Venom wrote:I'm sure most people would agree with banning real extremism that seeks to murder and kill, the sort that this Australian killer was caught up in, but who determines what is extremist? ResetEra is banning people for saying they don't think PewDiePie was the reason for this shooting! One can legitimately say that he's said racist words and made racist jokes but to then group attack anyone or ban anyone who doesn't hold one's own, non-universal, opinion that he is the cause of the terrorist attack is wrong and it's also shutting down a proper conversation about white extremism in society, instead you have a bunch of people there patting each other on the back whilst stopping any sort of mature discourse because they refuse to allow opinions different from there own: "yeah, strawberry float pewdiepie.... Get strawberry floated, Pewdiepie, you enabling piece of garbage... yeah strawberry floating right you piece of gooseberry fool... Do not even pretend to be surprised you shitstain."

I think the admins of an openly left-wing gaming forum are well within their rights to ban anyone who defends the neo-Nazi sympathiser Pewdiepie (and his piss-weak non-apology for partially inspiring a mass shooting). A private space has no obligation to host fascists, or fascist sympathisers, or even otherwise-normal people who through unfortunate ignorance have come to parrot a fascist talking point.

Cuttooth wrote:
Think that's literally on the border of Heathrow.

:( Sad and horrifying. At least the wound isn't life-threatening, thank goodness.

It probably won't be the last person to be "inspired" by this attack either.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Venom » Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:36 pm

Karl wrote:
Venom wrote:I'm sure most people would agree with banning real extremism that seeks to murder and kill, the sort that this Australian killer was caught up in, but who determines what is extremist? ResetEra is banning people for saying they don't think PewDiePie was the reason for this shooting! One can legitimately say that he's said racist words and made racist jokes but to then group attack anyone or ban anyone who doesn't hold one's own, non-universal, opinion that he is the cause of the terrorist attack is wrong and it's also shutting down a proper conversation about white extremism in society, instead you have a bunch of people there patting each other on the back whilst stopping any sort of mature discourse because they refuse to allow opinions different from there own: "yeah, strawberry float pewdiepie.... Get strawberry floated, Pewdiepie, you enabling piece of garbage... yeah strawberry floating right you piece of gooseberry fool... Do not even pretend to be surprised you shitstain."

I think the admins of an openly left-wing gaming forum are well within their rights to ban anyone who defends the neo-Nazi sympathiser Pewdiepie (and his piss-weak non-apology for partially inspiring a mass shooting). A private space has no obligation to host fascists, or fascist sympathisers, or even otherwise-normal people who through unfortunate ignorance have come to parrot a fascist talking point.


I don't think PewDiePie is responsible for the shooting and I don't think he is a Neo-Nazi. I'm not a fascist or a fascist sympathiser and it is a shame that you are party to this tactic. If you want to verbally attack me then do so and be upfront about it. But what you are doing in this thread is getting indignant and shouting down anybody who doesn't have the same opinion as you and then calling them sympathisers with the terrorist attack - and it might make you believe your morally superior, but it doesn't make you right.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by taychris » Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:43 pm

Karl wrote:
Venom wrote:I'm sure most people would agree with banning real extremism that seeks to murder and kill, the sort that this Australian killer was caught up in, but who determines what is extremist? ResetEra is banning people for saying they don't think PewDiePie was the reason for this shooting! One can legitimately say that he's said racist words and made racist jokes but to then group attack anyone or ban anyone who doesn't hold one's own, non-universal, opinion that he is the cause of the terrorist attack is wrong and it's also shutting down a proper conversation about white extremism in society, instead you have a bunch of people [url=66/]there[/url] patting each other on the back whilst stopping any sort of mature discourse because they refuse to allow opinions different from there own: "yeah, strawberry float pewdiepie.... Get strawberry floated, Pewdiepie, you enabling piece of garbage... yeah strawberry floating right you piece of gooseberry fool... Do not even pretend to be surprised you shitstain."


I think the admins of an openly left-wing gaming forum are well within their rights to ban anyone who defends the neo-Nazi sympathiser Pewdiepie (and his piss-weak non-apology for partially inspiring a mass shooting). A private space has no obligation to host fascists, or fascist sympathisers, or even otherwise-normal people who through unfortunate ignorance have come to parrot a fascist talking point.

Cuttooth wrote:[twt]
Think that's literally on the border of Heathrow.


:( Sad and horrifying. At least the wound isn't life-threatening, thank goodness.

It probably won't be the last person to be "inspired" by this attack either.


that's a really messed up thing to say [bold].

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Moggy » Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:45 pm

Venom wrote:
Karl wrote:
Venom wrote:I'm sure most people would agree with banning real extremism that seeks to murder and kill, the sort that this Australian killer was caught up in, but who determines what is extremist? ResetEra is banning people for saying they don't think PewDiePie was the reason for this shooting! One can legitimately say that he's said racist words and made racist jokes but to then group attack anyone or ban anyone who doesn't hold one's own, non-universal, opinion that he is the cause of the terrorist attack is wrong and it's also shutting down a proper conversation about white extremism in society, instead you have a bunch of people there patting each other on the back whilst stopping any sort of mature discourse because they refuse to allow opinions different from there own: "yeah, strawberry float pewdiepie.... Get strawberry floated, Pewdiepie, you enabling piece of garbage... yeah strawberry floating right you piece of gooseberry fool... Do not even pretend to be surprised you shitstain."

I think the admins of an openly left-wing gaming forum are well within their rights to ban anyone who defends the neo-Nazi sympathiser Pewdiepie (and his piss-weak non-apology for partially inspiring a mass shooting). A private space has no obligation to host fascists, or fascist sympathisers, or even otherwise-normal people who through unfortunate ignorance have come to parrot a fascist talking point.


I don't think PewDiePie is responsible for the shooting and I don't think he is a Neo-Nazi. I'm not a fascist or a fascist sympathiser and it is a shame that you are party to this tactic. If you want to verbally attack me then do so and be upfront about it. But what you are doing in this thread is getting indignant and shouting down anybody who doesn't have the same opinion as you and then calling them sympathisers with the terrorist attack - and it might make you believe your morally superior, but it doesn't make you right.


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Those look like the sort of thing a non neo-Nazi would do.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Corazon de Leon » Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:49 pm

I think he's a provocateur and a moron, who needs to grow the strawberry float up and take responsibility for the damage his actions and his stupidity could - and clearly have - caused. One of the images you've posted there would be bad enough - all three are unforgivable.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Tafdolphin » Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:08 pm

It's genuinely saddening to me that people are on here actually defending PewDiePie. I mean...just take a look at the content on this page, let alone all the other pages.

If the guy isn't actively a racist, then he's created a community rife with them and consistently fails to do anything about it. To see that as anything other than enabling neo-nazis is a huge leap in logic.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Knoyleo » Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:17 pm

Do we need to post this again?

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Tafdolphin » Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:19 pm

And this:

https://kotaku.com/the-pewdiepie-fiasco ... 1793308126

The WSJ article itself is now behind a paywall, but the above is a good summary of those events.

The Journal article had three bylines, but since it ran, the person who has suffered the brunt of harassment on social media has been business entertainment reporter Ben Fritz. Fritz had the third byline, usually an indicator of having been least involved with a piece. For weeks now, Fritz’s Twitter mentions have been a mess of people demanding that he get fired, blaming him for damage done to Pewdiepie. Rolfe Winkler and Jack Nicas, the first two bylines, have gotten slight pushback on social media, but not nearly as much. On YouTube, Fritz has become the face of the newspaper thanks to a video where those freelancers from Kjellberg’s earlier video decided to hold up a new sign that read ‘Hypofritz.’ The portmanteau, which has now become a hashtag, spun out of old Fritz Tweets dug up by Kjellberg supporters. In the 2009 Tweet, Fritz is talking about a Chanukah party and remarks that he “had no idea Jews were so adept at frying.” That, combined with Fritz’s South Park avatar on Twitter, were enough to brand Fritz a hypocrite in the eyes of Pewdiepie’s fans—the thinking being, how could someone who seemingly appreciates crass humor “go after” a comedian like Pewdiepie?

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Karl_ » Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:36 pm

Venom wrote:
Karl wrote:I think the admins of an openly left-wing gaming forum are well within their rights to ban anyone who defends the neo-Nazi sympathiser Pewdiepie (and his piss-weak non-apology for partially inspiring a mass shooting). A private space has no obligation to host fascists, or fascist sympathisers, or even otherwise-normal people who through unfortunate ignorance have come to parrot a fascist talking point.

I don't think PewDiePie is responsible for the shooting and I don't think he is a Neo-Nazi. I'm not a fascist or a fascist sympathiser and it is a shame that you are party to this tactic. If you want to verbally attack me then do so and be upfront about it. But what you are doing in this thread is getting indignant and shouting down anybody who doesn't have the same opinion as you and then calling them sympathisers with the terrorist attack - and it might make you believe your morally superior, but it doesn't make you right.

If I wanted to "verbally attack" you I would. I have no idea what your personal political views are.

Pewdiepie didn't put a gun in anyone's hands. But he is one relatively soft entry point into a frightening YouTube-based alt-right radicalisation network. A huge amount of his content echoes alt-right talking points ("haha SJWs!"), he is demonstrably racist and antisemitic, and he has promoted fully-open neo-Nazis on his channel as well as collaborated with core alt-right personalities. If you don't think he's dangerous you need to pinch yourself hard, because neo-Nazism is on the rise here today and you don't want to sleepwalk through that.

I'm not sure what part of that you think is moral aggrandisement or otherwise "isn't right". It's nailed-on. And I'm not "indignant", I'm angry, because I strawberry floating hate fascist shitlords. I hope you hate them too!

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by taychris » Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:51 pm

Karl wrote:
Venom wrote:
Karl wrote:I think the admins of an openly left-wing gaming forum are well within their rights to ban anyone who defends the neo-Nazi sympathiser Pewdiepie (and his piss-weak non-apology for partially inspiring a mass shooting). A private space has no obligation to host fascists, or fascist sympathisers, or even otherwise-normal people who through unfortunate ignorance have come to parrot a fascist talking point.

I don't think PewDiePie is responsible for the shooting and I don't think he is a Neo-Nazi. I'm not a fascist or a fascist sympathiser and it is a shame that you are party to this tactic. If you want to verbally attack me then do so and be upfront about it. But what you are doing in this thread is getting indignant and shouting down anybody who doesn't have the same opinion as you and then calling them sympathisers with the terrorist attack - and it might make you believe your morally superior, but it doesn't make you right.

If I wanted to "verbally attack" you I would. I have no idea what your personal political views are.

Pewdiepie is one relatively soft entry point into a YouTube-based alt-right radicalisation network. A huge amount of his content echoes alt-right talking points ("haha SJWs!"), he is demonstrably racist and antisemitic, and he has promoted fully-open neo-Nazis on his channel as well as collaborated with core alt-right personalities. If you don't think he's dangerous you need to pinch yourself hard, because neo-Nazism is on the rise here today and you don't want to sleepwalk through that.

I'm not sure what part of that you think is moral aggrandisement or otherwise "isn't right". It's nailed-on. And I'm not "indignant", I'm angry, because I strawberry floating hate fascist shitlords. I hope you hate them too!


i don't think you're looking at things accurately at all you have very fringe beliefs imo. he is not neo-nazi or alt-right [need a stricter definition] and he enjoys massive support [people looking to bring back actual nazism today don't have that]. laughing at sjw's is not an alt-right property either. i watch sjw cringe videos,,, and also don't like hitler.

imo anyway he's a goof youtuber into some shock comedy and people take him too seriously, like people who think playing gta will make you a mobster, and real racists and villans probably love he gets talked about more than them.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Pedz » Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:54 pm

So a guy who uses the n word and laughs his arse off saying it is not racist?

...Okay.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Mafro » Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:05 pm

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Karl_ » Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:16 pm

EDIT: Oh, I didn't realise Mafro just locked this. Probably unfair of me to get the last word. On the other hand, s l a s h t h e f a s h.

taychris wrote:i don't think you're looking at things accurately at all you have very fringe beliefs imo. he is not neo-nazi or alt-right [need a stricter definition] and he enjoys massive support [people looking to bring back actual nazism today don't have that]. laughing at sjw's is not an alt-right property either. i watch sjw cringe videos,,, and also don't like hitler.

imo anyway he's a goof youtuber into some shock comedy and people take him too seriously, like people who think playing gta will make you a mobster, and real racists and villans probably love he gets talked about more than them.

I've not accused you (or Venom, or Rightey) of being a racist for liking Pewdiepie. What I'm saying is that his fans need to seriously reflect on the big red flags surrounding that community, because it's become one part - not the whole story, but a cog within the machine - of how a contemporary fascist movement operates online today.

I understand you think this is silly. I don't really think I will convince you, but maybe I can put some questions to you, and in a year or two you'll think back on this and go, "oh shite, they were right", okay? Hear me out.

What do you think of the videos and screenshots posted by other users on this page? Do you think it reflects badly on Pewdiepie to drop racial slurs while playing videogames, or to display racist caricatures in the background of his videos, or to use the phrase "death to all Jews" in his jokes? If this is just edgy humour, where's the balance? There are plenty of amusing public freakouts from old conservative men, so where are his "far-right cringe compilations"?

In this thread we've talked about all sorts of racists and villains - Tommy Robinson, Candace Owens, Jordan Peterson and Ben Shapiro have all been mentioned - but Pewdiepie is one more, who is particularly relevant after being specifically namedropped by the attacker. Since then, "Subscribe to Pewdiepie" has appeared on racist graffiti at a school in Oxford and a holocaust memorial in Brooklyn. Do you think that is any reflection at all on him or his community?

Do you think Ben Shapiro or other core alt-right talking heads are "bad" or are they also misunderstood? You can map out a network between all of these people, how they collaborate and signal-boost each other. Paul Joseph Watson & Alex Jones on InfoWars are a virtual hop away from Pewdiepie and Ben Shapiro, and Jordan Peterson and Candace Owens. A hop further takes you to the hate speech of real-life neo-Nazi Tommy Robinson, or perhaps political imageboards, the kind of alt-right meme factories where really dangerous neo-Nazi ideas like "the great replacement" are invented. You don't have to take my word for it, there are real studies out there from the kind of person who has made it their life's work to track far-right movements. You can go and research this and I hope you will.

I'm not saying you are a racist because you like Pewdiepie. I'm sure plenty of normal, ordinary people like Pewdiepie. What I'm saying is that Pewdiepie's rhetoric is inflammatory and dangerous, and that his content teeters just on the edge of a dark hole that, if fallen into, can lead (usually) disaffected young white men towards the alt-right and eventually onto the anonymous channels where these attacks are openly lauded and sometimes even planned.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Green Gecko » Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:25 pm

btw taf I wasn't referring to you!

That post was a weird, half-awake attempt at moderation. Like, "fascists, I will try my best to love and unwind you, even though I can't. Also please don't swear at people lol."

Read it again with a pained expression on my face and it might get halfway there, maybe.

I don't like how centrist that came across either. I am not centrist. I am compassionate.

Also it's a bit weird to use a discussion largely combatting the acts of a fascist mass murderer and any potential influencers as a meet and greet.

It seems clear, at least to me, that an alt-right media centrifuge exists (of course one does), and some fascists go so far as to murder innocent civilians (because they did).

There is more than enough information out there regarding the individuals discussed for one to come to a decision about just how bad they are. I don't think a great deal more can be said or done within the course of this topic to change minds or make the world better.

I am sorry if you missed the opportunity participate, this time.

That is all.

PS I didn't lock this thread as I do basically no moderation, because it does my nut in. If it makes more people sad than it achieves in some vague utilitarian, enlightening sense then it is OK for mods to lock it.

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Skarjo » Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:31 pm

Why are you commenting in a locked thread when there's an open thread carrying on the same discussion?

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PostRe: Politics discussion: on the alt-right and their relationship to the recent shooting in NZ
by Green Gecko » Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:16 pm

Because I had no idea there was one! I was lead here by reports.

Reporting for duty. Or not.

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