Politics Thread 6

[Tafdolphin]

Blue line profile pic indicates trustworthiness

He’s an ex police officer who attends these events to act as an observer. My point is that there are always different sides to the narratives. There’s no reason to trust him anymore or less than tweets from others. That’s my point. Even feeds from people like HUCK are clearly biased towards the protesters to the point that they completely ignore the criminal element. People either have a vested interest in attacking or defending rather than remaining independent.

But in this case, the alternate perspective you posted showed...the same thing? Police smashing into stationary protestors. You're just proving my previous posts right: you constantly give the benefit of the doubt to the oppressors as the objective truth is an impossible goal.

You say "none of us were there, so we can't really say what happened!" I wonder, really wonder, what your reaction would be if one of us had been there and had been charged (as in "stampeded" not "with a crime") by the police? Would you change your views?

Of course not, because as discussed this search for the complete objective truth is a smokescreen to hide your biases while you attempt to hold the middle ground. Dude...it's not working.

Out of interest can anyone defend what’s going on below? It seems relatively minor in the grand scheme of what was happening yesterday but I feel the ‘protesters’ are totally out of order. One even kicks the car.

twitter.com/normanbrennan/status/1378573583476264964

If that is acceptable to you then what about blocking the M32? Which also happened yesterday.

The protestors politely ask the guy to go around. The kick is unwarranted, but there's no violence here. Also:

1: Coincidentally I'm sure, the guy who tweeted this is ex-police. So where's your benefit of the doubt for the protestors here? What if they were stopping the traffic because someone up ahead was injured in the road?
2: Absolutely people should block the M32 if that will help their cause. Civil disobedience is a proven method of enacting societal change.

Do you agree with the latter part of 2, by the way? If, as I suspect, not then what methods would you deem acceptable for the public to show their discontent re: matters of state?

I assume people who have banners with "ACAB","Kill Cops" and "KilltheBill" absolve themselves from ever using their services?

They all seem like level-headed, rational people

Why would you say this? Are people immediately not allowed to use things they actively dislike? How does that work? By this metric, does everyone who uses Amazon automatically approve of their systemic worker abuse?

Oh and that "Kill Cops" banner?

twitter.com/gavinmit/status/1378672538700677122

Yeah (also if you didn't already see, the guy holding it up as "Kill Cops" was later spotted behind police lines, chatting with officers).

[Zilnad]

To be honest when was the last time you actually used the police? I honestly don't think I've ever called them, I think I've asked for directions from them a few times but I don't think I've ever used them for their intended purpose.

What's your point?

[The Watching Artist]

Those kids

makes me so happy

twitter.com/AyahAyah_/status/1377248768991580167

Unfortunately it’s a win but it’ll just inspir/galvanise the other side.

The is Davidson begging for Piers’ job.
(It’s worse than you think even from title be warned, and the replies...

twitter.com/JimDOfficial/status/1377575678867075073

Fine I'll do it Knoyleo

[coldspice]

*video of police charging down protesters*

*same video but with a pro-police caption*

hmmm, seems there are 2 sides to this story

[coldspice]

I assume people who have banners with "ACAB","Kill Cops" and "KilltheBill" absolve themselves from ever using their services?

They all seem like level-headed, rational people

evergreen

[Tafdolphin]

/\ Indeed.

Honestly, and this isn't going to help my argument here, a lot of the pro-police/anti-ACAB view in here are like...tabloid level stuff. Drive-by snarkiness or elementary level nitpicking to distract from the systems at play.

It is infuriating.

[Knoyleo]

Those kids

makes me so happy

twitter.com/AyahAyah_/status/1377248768991580167

Unfortunately it’s a win but it’ll just inspir/galvanise the other side.

The is Davidson begging for Piers’ job.
(It’s worse than you think even from title be warned, and the replies...

twitter.com/JimDOfficial/status/1377575678867075073

Fine I'll do it Knoyleo

Cheers m8

The Met's deputy lead for hate crime has chimed in on the arrest of legal observers:

twitter.com/louloufell/status/1378686231991750656

[Moggy]

Oh no! The protesters blocked the M32! At 10pm on a Saturday night when all pubs and clubs are closed?!!!

I take it all back, the police should smash some heads together for this absolute outrage! It must have been so distressing for the 3 people out in cars last night to have to use one of the 6billion other ways in/out of Bristol.

[Prototype]

I assume people who have banners with "ACAB","Kill Cops" and "KilltheBill" absolve themselves from ever using their services?

They all seem like level-headed, rational people

evergreen

How exactly is a mentality of "kill the bill" and "all cops are bastards" in any way, shape or form an effort to improve society?

[Moggy]

I assume people who have banners with "ACAB","Kill Cops" and "KilltheBill" absolve themselves from ever using their services?

They all seem like level-headed, rational people

evergreen

How exactly is a mentality of "kill the bill" and "all cops are bastards" in any way, shape or form an effort to improve society?

Kill the bill refers to stopping the new laws that will restrict our rights to protest.

ACAB is just a slogan. It doesn't hurt anybody and serves as a useful reminder that there are two types of police. The bad cops and the cops that defend the bad cops.

[Prototype]

Kill the bill refers to stopping the new laws that will restrict our rights to protest.

I thought it was a play on words, which also indicates The Bill... like PC Reg Hollis. I picked that up wrong, for sure.

ACAB is just a slogan. It doesn't hurt anybody and serves as a useful reminder that there are two types of police. The bad cops and the cops that defend the bad cops.

You say it's just a slogan, but we are living in an age where more and more speech is being compelled. If people aren't allowed to be offended at "ACAB" why are people so up tight when a division three football team doesn't "take the knee"?

[Moggy]

Kill the bill refers to stopping the new laws that will restrict our rights to protest.

I thought it was a play on words, which also indicates The Bill... like PC Reg Hollis. I picked that up wrong, for sure.

ACAB is just a slogan. It doesn't hurt anybody and serves as a useful reminder that there are two types of police. The bad cops and the cops that defend the bad cops.

You say it's just a slogan, but we are living in an age where more and more speech is being compelled. If people aren't allowed to be offended at "ACAB" why are people so up tight when a division three football team doesn't "take the knee"?

"Kill the Bill" is certainly being used as a play on words now. I don't think it started that way though.

Are we really comparing ACAB to taking the knee? The two things are vastly different.

But can you name the division three football team that people are uptight about? There are plenty of teams that are not taking the knee and nobody cares, the point is that players should have the option to do it, not that they should be forced to do it.

[Prototype]

There are plenty of teams that are not taking the knee and nobody cares, the point is that players should have the option to do it, not that they should be forced to do it.

I agree they should be given the choice, similar to the poppy nonsense. Compelling someone to demonstrate dilutes the purpose of the demonstration itself IMO. i.e I think Colin Kaepernick is one of the most courageous people in America and I am totally behind what he did, as it really lit a fire under the much-needed discussion around race, but I honestly don't think losing our gooseberry fool over a random player from a random team not taking the knee should be anywhere near the top of the agenda.

I thought this from Will Zaha articulated his feelings on this better than I could, but I broadly agree with his assessment.

https://www.sportbible.com/football/foo ... e-20210218

[Moggy]

but I honestly don't think losing our gooseberry fool over a random player from a random team not taking the knee should be anywhere near the top of the agenda.

I asked before for an example but you've just repeated your claim.

Which team/player that hasn't kneeled has been pushed to the top of the agenda? Who has gotten up tight about him/them not doing it?

[Hexx]

[Prototype]

but I honestly don't think losing our gooseberry fool over a random player from a random team not taking the knee should be anywhere near the top of the agenda.

I asked before for an example but you've just repeated your claim.

Which team/player that hasn't kneeled has been pushed to the top of the agenda? Who has gotten up tight about him/them not doing it?

I'm sure i saw outrage online about a lower-league club not taking the knee. I've had a look but can't find anything other than the Millwall stuff published. Millwall though.

The Scotland national team got stick for not doing it though:

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19071 ... land-game/

[Squinty]

They should drop the use of 'Kill the Bill'. It never was tasteful.

[Moggy]

but I honestly don't think losing our gooseberry fool over a random player from a random team not taking the knee should be anywhere near the top of the agenda.

I asked before for an example but you've just repeated your claim.

Which team/player that hasn't kneeled has been pushed to the top of the agenda? Who has gotten up tight about him/them not doing it?

I'm sure i saw outrage online about a lower-league club not taking the knee. I've had a look but can't find anything other than the Millwall stuff published. Millwall though.

The Scotland national team got stick for not doing it though:

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19071 ... land-game/

Millwall got stick for booing players that were taking the knee.

That's the Scottish rugby team, not football teams/players. It's not clear from that article how widespread the criticism was, vague "people on social media" and "this one bloke said" does not mean anything. I could find you opposite views on almost any subject, that doesn't mean something is widespread.

[Corazon de Leon]

but I honestly don't think losing our gooseberry fool over a random player from a random team not taking the knee should be anywhere near the top of the agenda.

I asked before for an example but you've just repeated your claim.

Which team/player that hasn't kneeled has been pushed to the top of the agenda? Who has gotten up tight about him/them not doing it?

I'm sure i saw outrage online about a lower-league club not taking the knee. I've had a look but can't find anything other than the Millwall stuff published. Millwall though.

The Scotland national team got stick for not doing it though:

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19071 ... land-game/

Is The National the only source for that criticism?

[Prototype]

but I honestly don't think losing our gooseberry fool over a random player from a random team not taking the knee should be anywhere near the top of the agenda.

I asked before for an example but you've just repeated your claim.

Which team/player that hasn't kneeled has been pushed to the top of the agenda? Who has gotten up tight about him/them not doing it?

I'm sure i saw outrage online about a lower-league club not taking the knee. I've had a look but can't find anything other than the Millwall stuff published. Millwall though.

The Scotland national team got stick for not doing it though:

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19071 ... land-game/

Is The National the only source for that criticism?

Of the Scotland team? Nah, there were a few sites who carried the story of them being criticised. Times, Telegraph, Daily Record etc.