Politics Thread 6

Fed up talking videogames? Why?

Who will you vote for at the next General Election?

Conservative
16
10%
Labour
64
41%
Liberal Democrat
28
18%
Green
22
14%
SNP
16
10%
Brexit Party
4
3%
UKIP
2
1%
Plaid Cymru
3
2%
DUP
1
1%
Sinn Fein
2
1%
The Independent Group for Change
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 158
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Rocsteady
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Rocsteady » Sat Jun 19, 2021 11:54 am

Probably wrong thread but does anyone have a book they'd recommend on the British empire/role in slavery? I'd like to learn more. Preferably not an incredibly dry tome if possible.

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Rex Kramer
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Rex Kramer » Sat Jun 19, 2021 12:21 pm

Rocsteady wrote:Probably wrong thread but does anyone have a book they'd recommend on the British empire/role in slavery? I'd like to learn more. Preferably not an incredibly dry tome if possible.

I haven't read any specifically but I'd say David Olusoga would be a good place to start.

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Return_of_the_STAR
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Return_of_the_STAR » Sat Jun 19, 2021 12:55 pm

twitter.com/dwaynamics/status/1405527234085986312



This is being ignored far too much. It needs discussing more openly.

twitter.com/crimeldn/status/1405606002121228290



Teenage murder rate in London is the highest since 2008. This is also reflected in many parts of the country. Particularly locally for me.

What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.

I saw an article the other day but can’t find it now about the worrying trend of the border force and local authorities dumping young single immigrant males into poor areas who are then being taken advantage of by criminal gangs and drawn into the drug gang culture. They are making up an ever increasing number of those arrested for stabbings and murders. This needs addressing urgently. They are being given no future.

Edit. I've removed the turning point thing. I'd never heard of them.

Last edited by Return_of_the_STAR on Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Knoyleo
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Knoyleo » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:10 pm

Turning Point UK :dread:

Sa Ra Garvey :dread:


pjbetman wrote:That's the stupidest thing ive ever read on here i think.
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Hexx
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Hexx » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:13 pm

Guys. It’s grotesque and repugnant but just don’t. Please?

If we all just ignore it we might actually have a pleasant thread for the next few pages.

Don’t engage.

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Tafdolphin
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Tafdolphin » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:19 pm

Hexx wrote:Guys. It’s grotesque and repugnant but just don’t. Please?

If we all just ignore it we might actually have a pleasant thread for the next few pages.

Don’t engage.


I am trying.

So hard.

You're right of course but.

strawberry float me.

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Cuttooth
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Cuttooth » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:22 pm

Rocsteady wrote:Probably wrong thread but does anyone have a book they'd recommend on the British empire/role in slavery? I'd like to learn more. Preferably not an incredibly dry tome if possible.

I bought it although haven't started it but Sathnam Sanghera's Empireland has received good reviews. He isn't a historian though so Rex Kramer's suggestion of David Olusoga's work is probably a better starting point, specifically on slavery.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Moggy » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:49 pm

Return_of_the_STAR wrote:What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.


You kind of answered your own question.

We'll never be free of crime. There will always be murderers out there and there'll always be thieves out there. There is no fix to end up with zero crime.

We could do a lot to reduce crime but it'll take a lot of money and a lot of time. Large investments in deprived areas over decades.

So it'll never happen. The Tories aren't going to pump money into deprived London areas. And even if Labour got in, they might give the cash but their thinking will be just as short termist as any other party.

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Return_of_the_STAR
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Return_of_the_STAR » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:05 pm

Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.


You kind of answered your own question.

We'll never be free of crime. There will always be murderers out there and there'll always be thieves out there. There is no fix to end up with zero crime.

We could do a lot to reduce crime but it'll take a lot of money and a lot of time. Large investments in deprived areas over decades.

So it'll never happen. The Tories aren't going to pump money into deprived London areas. And even if Labour got in, they might give the cash but their thinking will be just as short termist as any other party.


Do you not think this is a big, ever growing issue though? It can't be ignored for much longer. Children's lives are being destroyed. It needs to become a big talking point and major focus. I would like to specifically see local MPs making more of this issue instead of being worried about upsetting those that vote for them.

Communities, parents and extended families need to do more as well. But some of them can't do a lot without support from local and national authorities.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Moggy » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:06 pm

Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.


You kind of answered your own question.

We'll never be free of crime. There will always be murderers out there and there'll always be thieves out there. There is no fix to end up with zero crime.

We could do a lot to reduce crime but it'll take a lot of money and a lot of time. Large investments in deprived areas over decades.

So it'll never happen. The Tories aren't going to pump money into deprived London areas. And even if Labour got in, they might give the cash but their thinking will be just as short termist as any other party.


Do you not think this is a big, ever growing issue though? It can't be ignored for much longer. Children's lives are being destroyed. It needs to become a big talking point and major focus. I would like to specifically see local MPs making more of this issue instead of being worried about upsetting those that vote for them.

Communities, parents and extended families need to do more as well. But some of them can't do a lot without support from local and national authorities.


Again you're answering your own questions. Yes MPs and local councils need to do more.

But they won't. So it won't get any better.

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Return_of_the_STAR
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Return_of_the_STAR » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:09 pm

Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.


You kind of answered your own question.

We'll never be free of crime. There will always be murderers out there and there'll always be thieves out there. There is no fix to end up with zero crime.

We could do a lot to reduce crime but it'll take a lot of money and a lot of time. Large investments in deprived areas over decades.

So it'll never happen. The Tories aren't going to pump money into deprived London areas. And even if Labour got in, they might give the cash but their thinking will be just as short termist as any other party.


Do you not think this is a big, ever growing issue though? It can't be ignored for much longer. Children's lives are being destroyed. It needs to become a big talking point and major focus. I would like to specifically see local MPs making more of this issue instead of being worried about upsetting those that vote for them.

Communities, parents and extended families need to do more as well. But some of them can't do a lot without support from local and national authorities.


Again you're answering your own questions. Yes MPs and local councils need to do more.

But they won't. So it won't get any better.


Do we just give up and accept it then?

I particularly think the grotesque way young adult males are dumped into these situations is criminally negligent by the authorities.

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Return_of_the_STAR
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Return_of_the_STAR » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:12 pm

Knoyleo wrote:Turning Point UK :dread:

Sa Ra Garvey :dread:



I've deleted the turning point thing. I'd never heard of them. But the rest of the post still stands.

Nationally we need to work on these issues.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Moggy » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:16 pm

Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.


You kind of answered your own question.

We'll never be free of crime. There will always be murderers out there and there'll always be thieves out there. There is no fix to end up with zero crime.

We could do a lot to reduce crime but it'll take a lot of money and a lot of time. Large investments in deprived areas over decades.

So it'll never happen. The Tories aren't going to pump money into deprived London areas. And even if Labour got in, they might give the cash but their thinking will be just as short termist as any other party.


Do you not think this is a big, ever growing issue though? It can't be ignored for much longer. Children's lives are being destroyed. It needs to become a big talking point and major focus. I would like to specifically see local MPs making more of this issue instead of being worried about upsetting those that vote for them.

Communities, parents and extended families need to do more as well. But some of them can't do a lot without support from local and national authorities.


Again you're answering your own questions. Yes MPs and local councils need to do more.

But they won't. So it won't get any better.


Do we just give up and accept it then?



While we keep voting for banana splitish politicians, there's not much we can do. The Tories are not dropping in popularity, we have years (if not decades) of underfunding to come.

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Return_of_the_STAR
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Return_of_the_STAR » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:20 pm

Tafdolphin wrote:
Hexx wrote:Guys. It’s grotesque and repugnant but just don’t. Please?

If we all just ignore it we might actually have a pleasant thread for the next few pages.

Don’t engage.


I am trying.

So hard.

You're right of course but.

strawberry float me.


You both appear to completely have the wrong end of the stick here.

Knife crime, murder, disproportionately in deprived areas of the country is a massive issue. The deliberate targeting of young, poor children from deprived backgrounds needs to end.

As I've said above the trend for dumping single male young immigrant adults and teens into these areas and being left to fend for themselves is also part of the issue.

It needs talking about and not continuing to be ignored.

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Return_of_the_STAR
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Return_of_the_STAR » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:23 pm

Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.


You kind of answered your own question.

We'll never be free of crime. There will always be murderers out there and there'll always be thieves out there. There is no fix to end up with zero crime.

We could do a lot to reduce crime but it'll take a lot of money and a lot of time. Large investments in deprived areas over decades.

So it'll never happen. The Tories aren't going to pump money into deprived London areas. And even if Labour got in, they might give the cash but their thinking will be just as short termist as any other party.


Do you not think this is a big, ever growing issue though? It can't be ignored for much longer. Children's lives are being destroyed. It needs to become a big talking point and major focus. I would like to specifically see local MPs making more of this issue instead of being worried about upsetting those that vote for them.

Communities, parents and extended families need to do more as well. But some of them can't do a lot without support from local and national authorities.


Again you're answering your own questions. Yes MPs and local councils need to do more.

But they won't. So it won't get any better.


Do we just give up and accept it then?



While we keep voting for banana splitish politicians, there's not much we can do. The Tories are not dropping in popularity, we have years (if not decades) of underfunding to come.


Well I can't disagree with you there. I just can't see why the media don't push the issue anymore. They seem to have accepted that these murders and violence are normal.

Remember how much of an issue was made of Kiyan Prince 15 years ago. It was national news and shock. Now this is happening multiple times a week in London alone and only a few incidents get a mention in the national press.

Also have a word with Taf and Hexx they seem to have got the wrong end of the stick.

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Moggy
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Moggy » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:34 pm

Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.


You kind of answered your own question.

We'll never be free of crime. There will always be murderers out there and there'll always be thieves out there. There is no fix to end up with zero crime.

We could do a lot to reduce crime but it'll take a lot of money and a lot of time. Large investments in deprived areas over decades.

So it'll never happen. The Tories aren't going to pump money into deprived London areas. And even if Labour got in, they might give the cash but their thinking will be just as short termist as any other party.


Do you not think this is a big, ever growing issue though? It can't be ignored for much longer. Children's lives are being destroyed. It needs to become a big talking point and major focus. I would like to specifically see local MPs making more of this issue instead of being worried about upsetting those that vote for them.

Communities, parents and extended families need to do more as well. But some of them can't do a lot without support from local and national authorities.


Again you're answering your own questions. Yes MPs and local councils need to do more.

But they won't. So it won't get any better.


Do we just give up and accept it then?



While we keep voting for banana splitish politicians, there's not much we can do. The Tories are not dropping in popularity, we have years (if not decades) of underfunding to come.


Well I can't disagree with you there. I just can't see why the media don't push the issue anymore. They seem to have accepted that these murders and violence are normal.

Remember how much of an issue was made of Kiyan Prince 15 years ago. It was national news and shock. Now this is happening multiple times a week in London alone and only a few incidents get a mention in the national press.

Also have a word with Taf and Hexx they seem to have got the wrong end of the stick.


Cases like Kiyan Prince or Damilola Taylor made headlines, but there were plenty of cases back then that didn't. Knife crime and murder has always been an issue and have always happened multiple times per week.

Cases are increasing but that's not a shock after a decade of underfunding. It started to improve in the early 2010s after funding was increased in the 2000s. But the austerity years are now biting and the good work is being undone. And it's a generational issue, pumping money in now will not have instant results. Which is why I don't think there is anything that can be done, the Tories won't pump money into poor areas and virtually no political party will plan more than a few months ahead.

I can't do anything about Hexx or Taf, I probably argue with them more than you ever do. :lol:

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Return_of_the_STAR
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Return_of_the_STAR » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:41 pm

Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:
Moggy wrote:
Return_of_the_STAR wrote:What can be done about it? Millions needs pumping into community projects, youth, education, and schools. Drugs and poverty are the route cause of a lot of these issues, but there is no overnight fix.


You kind of answered your own question.

We'll never be free of crime. There will always be murderers out there and there'll always be thieves out there. There is no fix to end up with zero crime.

We could do a lot to reduce crime but it'll take a lot of money and a lot of time. Large investments in deprived areas over decades.

So it'll never happen. The Tories aren't going to pump money into deprived London areas. And even if Labour got in, they might give the cash but their thinking will be just as short termist as any other party.


Do you not think this is a big, ever growing issue though? It can't be ignored for much longer. Children's lives are being destroyed. It needs to become a big talking point and major focus. I would like to specifically see local MPs making more of this issue instead of being worried about upsetting those that vote for them.

Communities, parents and extended families need to do more as well. But some of them can't do a lot without support from local and national authorities.


Again you're answering your own questions. Yes MPs and local councils need to do more.

But they won't. So it won't get any better.


Do we just give up and accept it then?



While we keep voting for banana splitish politicians, there's not much we can do. The Tories are not dropping in popularity, we have years (if not decades) of underfunding to come.


Well I can't disagree with you there. I just can't see why the media don't push the issue anymore. They seem to have accepted that these murders and violence are normal.

Remember how much of an issue was made of Kiyan Prince 15 years ago. It was national news and shock. Now this is happening multiple times a week in London alone and only a few incidents get a mention in the national press.

Also have a word with Taf and Hexx they seem to have got the wrong end of the stick.


Cases like Kiyan Prince or Damilola Taylor made headlines, but there were plenty of cases back then that didn't. Knife crime and murder has always been an issue and have always happened multiple times per week.

Cases are increasing but that's not a shock after a decade of underfunding. It started to improve in the early 2010s after funding was increased in the 2000s. But the austerity years are now biting and the good work is being undone. And it's a generational issue, pumping money in now will not have instant results. Which is why I don't think there is anything that can be done, the Tories won't pump money into poor areas and virtually no political party will plan more than a few months ahead.

I can't do anything about Hexx or Taf, I probably argue with them more than you ever do. :lol:


It doesn't feel like it :lol:

Yeah I don't disagree with you. There is definitely more under funding to come and in key areas. It's just bloody frustrating to see the issue continuing to be ignored by the masses.

What concerns me is how it's spreading from the big cities to the smaller urban areas.

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VlaSoul
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by VlaSoul » Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:16 pm

Moggy wrote:
VlaSoul wrote:the lib dems winning/entering coalition with the tories would be great because while the worker would still suffer greatly under the heel of global liberalism, I would have access to legalised marijuana


Absolutely no chance the Lib Dems would have the clout to put that through while they are junior members of a coalition.

There's surely enough tories in support of it by this point that a coalition government would be able to push it through

It's such easy money in terms of popular support and like actual money

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Rocsteady
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Rocsteady » Sat Jun 19, 2021 7:49 pm

Cuttooth wrote:
Rocsteady wrote:Probably wrong thread but does anyone have a book they'd recommend on the British empire/role in slavery? I'd like to learn more. Preferably not an incredibly dry tome if possible.

I bought it although haven't started it but Sathnam Sanghera's Empireland has received good reviews. He isn't a historian though so Rex Kramer's suggestion of David Olusoga's work is probably a better starting point, specifically on slavery.

Thanks, and thanks to Rex also - I'm gonna read Olusoga's shortened kiddy version ( :shifty: ) and pick up Empireland too as that looks exactly what I was searching for.

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Monkey Man
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PostRe: Politics Thread 6
by Monkey Man » Sat Jun 19, 2021 7:54 pm

twitter.com/ObserverUK/status/1406315232583061510


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