Our admissions team will be absolutely thrilled to hear this Absolute madness.
It's actually good, evidence-led policy based on research from the Sutton Trust and others that found students from disadvantaged backgrounds have their grades under-predicted. Post-qualification admission is the global norm and has been recommended by the UCU.
You think it's bad because of human-instinctual change-aversion and because the prevalent media narrative biases people (even left-leaning) to dismiss Labour policy as unworkable.
Our admissions team will be absolutely thrilled to hear this Absolute madness.
It's actually good, evidence-led policy based on research from the Sutton Trust and others that found students from disadvantaged backgrounds have their grades under-predicted. Post-qualification admission is the global norm and has been recommended by the UCU.
You think it's bad because of human-instinctual change-aversion and because the prevalent media narrative biases people (even left-leaning) to dismiss Labour policy as unworkable.
That may be the case, but seeing the workload on our admissions team at this time of year - this would be ever-so-slightly unpopular. I'm a member of the UCU but doesn't mean I agree with everything they come out with! This would cause derision in a lot of higher education institutions.
It's a good policy, driven by evidence. It will obviously need working on to get right and will be a clusterfuck the first year or two, but my understanding bis that other countries can manage.
Donate to the Ukrainian Military's fight against fascism.
Presumably they'll still have all the students personal statements so they can short list using that. Some places like Oxford and Cambridge make students sit additional tests and get interviewed by the lectures anyway so they'll still be able to cut down the applicants to a manageable amount anyway.
Yeah it's a great suggestion and one that should have been implemented long ago. It will require changes to the admissions process and how the Universities operate but those things should not be a barrier to what is fundamentally the right thing to do.
I'm glad that they would finally scrap such a ridiculous system.
I faced being a victim of it as I applied to Cambridge from a state school with no history of sending people there, and had to get my application in early, but the English Lit teacher was adamant he was only going to predict me a B. This was despite my first year grade being an A (nothing outstanding marks-wise, think it was a low-ish A at that point). His logic was that I didn't have the marks buffer to counter the fact that "the second year is harder" and that most people do worse.
My parents were quite pushy about him downgrading me, especially considering that was the subject I was applying to read at Cambridge. But he was adamant he was lowering it.
Unfortunately that buggered up my admission quite a bit, which was weird as my Head of Year was the one pushing me towards Oxbridge (as state school pupil, in the area in which I live and at that college, it wasn't really something I considered). If I remember correctly, the first AS year was more reliant on coursework too, whereas I was much more suited to more traditional exams.
As it turns out, by the time I got my A-level results, I had managed to get full marks on 3 exams, which constituted 50% of the total grade. I got an A fairly easily and was absolutely miles off dropping down to a B.
But the damage was done with that predicted grade. I'd already applied to six other universities. I actually went to one of them, but Oxbridge always nagged at me. So I ended up dropping out and going for it a year later.
Obviously my perception of the predicted grades system is certainly coloured by this, but there has to be more exact system less subject to the personal whims of an individual teacher. If I was getting fudged over at the top end of the academic scale, then it's probably going to be even more pronounced for those on other grade boundaries (I'm think the C/D grade boundary must be quite contentious).
Being offered places based on a predicted grade is flawed, but leaving applications so late also sounds stressful as well. Can results be returned earlier to give more time for applications? It was a such a relief getting my results and knowing straight away my place was secured, so I could get my accommodation and everything like that sorted. Applying after results would also mean applying after leaving sixth form/college, so I can see it being harder to get help with the application process like reviewing personal statements.
I don't see why predicted grades couldn't be removed from the process without moving applications until after results. From your personal statement alone universities could choose who to give conditional offers.
OrangeRKN wrote:Being offered places based on a predicted grade is flawed, but leaving applications so late also sounds stressful as well. Can results be returned earlier to give more time for applications? It was a such a relief getting my results and knowing straight away my place was secured, so I could get my accommodation and everything like that sorted. Applying after results would also mean applying after leaving sixth form/college, so I can see it being harder to get help with the application process like reviewing personal statements.
I don't see why predicted grades couldn't be removed from the process without moving applications until after results. From your personal statement alone universities could choose who to give conditional offers.
Giving offers based on actual qualifications doesn't mean you need to delay application until that point as well - most countries that do Post Qualification Admissions accept applications beforehand.
Jenuall wrote:Giving offers based on actual qualifications doesn't mean you need to delay application until that point as well - most countries that do Post Qualification Admissions accept applications beforehand.
"Labour will end university places being offered on the basis of predicted grades - instead students will apply once they've got their results."
Jenuall wrote:Giving offers based on actual qualifications doesn't mean you need to delay application until that point as well - most countries that do Post Qualification Admissions accept applications beforehand.
"Labour will end university places being offered on the basis of predicted grades - instead students will apply once they've got their results."
Doesn't sound like Labour's plan
Actually considering that A-Levels were only released today, it would only give students and Universities a month to sort everything out.
Jenuall wrote:Giving offers based on actual qualifications doesn't mean you need to delay application until that point as well - most countries that do Post Qualification Admissions accept applications beforehand.
"Labour will end university places being offered on the basis of predicted grades - instead students will apply once they've got their results."
Doesn't sound like Labour's plan
Quite possibly, the Labour plan and the research are two separate things. I'm just pointing out that moving to post qualification admissions does not mean you have to move to post qualification applications as well.
Either way there would still be plenty of support that could be offered by sixth form colleges to assist in putting together an application even if the final application is not submitted until later.
If you heard her on Radio 4 the other day any time some question was raised about transitioning the entire higher education system the answer was ‘we’d consult on that’
The state should not dictate how parents can raise and educate their children, only intervene where the well-being of the child is at threat. Abolishing private schooling is equivalent to mandating state education, which gives further power to the state, and potential for abuse.
But Eton et al. are "public" schools, not private!
Education is the absolute key to everything to be fair, both for kids but also for adults as well. Educate people well and so many benefits will come from it. But no, we're too short sighted and the world is run by too many selfish people to realise that spending marginally more money, time and effort on education with help everyone
Last edited by Jenuall on Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
