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Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:13 pm
by KB
[iup=3569144]Bigerich[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569113]TheWay[/iup] wrote:TimeGhost wrote:Narrowly rejected, surely?
I'd have added extremely to the start of that sentence, TG.
There are 20% more NO voters than YES voters. That is not narrow.
It's like 390,000 votes, not a huge margin in a national vote.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:23 pm
by Qikz
[iup=3569143]Corazon de Leon[/iup] wrote:In the pictures I've seen he looks broken. His entire mandate when he came into power was to make Scotland independent and he's failed - what is the point in him sticking around now that the core reason for being there is gone, Staydead?
His reasoning for being there should be to serve and protect the Scottish people. Working with goals and agendas what the Scottish people want. The Scottish people yesterday did not want independence, but that doesn't mean his job as a politician is done, the Scottish people still deserve someone to stand for what they believe in. There is also the way of thinking that Scottish independance was something he wanted for himself primarily rather than for the population of Scotland as out of every person in Scotland he was the one who would've benefitted the most out from it. I'd rather not view it that way, but I'd imagine going forward it could become a big problem.
He was a man who had goals, goals that he wanted to in the end make Scotland better.Just because you're still in the union doesn't mean that can't happen.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:25 pm
by Winckle
[iup=3569153]Qikz[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569143]Corazon de Leon[/iup] wrote:In the pictures I've seen he looks broken. His entire mandate when he came into power was to make Scotland independent and he's failed - what is the point in him sticking around now that the core reason for being there is gone, Staydead?
His reasoning for being there should be to serve and protect the Scottish people. Working with goals and agendas what the Scottish people want. The Scottish people yesterday did not want independence, but that doesn't mean his job as a politician is done, the Scottish people still deserve someone to stand for what they believe in. That is of course presuming Scottish independance was something he wanted forhimself primarily as he had something to gain for it, which of course may not have been his agenda, but out of every person in Scotland he was the one who would've benefitted the most out of everyone as he would've become one of the most famous, if not the most famous politician in Scottish history.
Please stop trying to smear him as a man who was only thinking of himself.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:26 pm
by Qikz
[iup=3569159]Winckle[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569153]Qikz[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569143]Corazon de Leon[/iup] wrote:In the pictures I've seen he looks broken. His entire mandate when he came into power was to make Scotland independent and he's failed - what is the point in him sticking around now that the core reason for being there is gone, Staydead?
His reasoning for being there should be to serve and protect the Scottish people. Working with goals and agendas what the Scottish people want. The Scottish people yesterday did not want independence, but that doesn't mean his job as a politician is done, the Scottish people still deserve someone to stand for what they believe in. That is of course presuming Scottish independance was something he wanted forhimself primarily as he had something to gain for it, which of course may not have been his agenda, but out of every person in Scotland he was the one who would've benefitted the most out of everyone as he would've become one of the most famous, if not the most famous politician in Scottish history.
Please stop trying to smear him as a man who was only thinking of himself.
I reworded my post but didn't manage to hit submit before you responded. That's not what I'm trying to do, but if you think it is then I apologise. I'm merely stating that some people might see it that way if he just gives up now.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:27 pm
by Captain Kinopio
[iup=3569148]KB[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569144]Bigerich[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569113]TheWay[/iup] wrote:TimeGhost wrote:Narrowly rejected, surely?
I'd have added extremely to the start of that sentence, TG.
There are 20% more NO voters than YES voters. That is not narrow.
It's like 390,000 votes, not a huge margin in a national vote.
In a nation of half a million it's a huge margin, in a nation of 500 million it's miniscule. In Scotland where the population is 5million (?) It's not huge but it's pretty comfortable.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:28 pm
by False
No.. they'll probably see it as the man who ran on a platform of fighting for independance not meeting that goal and thus stepping down.
He has said he will continue to serve the Scottish until leadership polls in November when he'll step down. The party will probably have to rejig its manifesto now toward fighting for devo, and its reasonable that someone else will lead that.
(and he is still staying in his constituency)
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:29 pm
by Memento Mori
I can completely understand Salmond's resignation. He'd just seen his life's work fall at the last hurdle, that must be deeply soul-crushing.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:32 pm
by Rocsteady
[iup=3569161]Herbi[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569148]KB[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569144]Bigerich[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569113]TheWay[/iup] wrote:TimeGhost wrote:Narrowly rejected, surely?
I'd have added extremely to the start of that sentence, TG.
There are 20% more NO voters than YES voters. That is not narrow.
It's like 390,000 votes, not a huge margin in a national vote.
In a nation of half a million it's a huge margin, in a nation of 500 million it's miniscule. In Scotland where the population is 5million (?) It's not huge but it's pretty comfortable.
Yeah percentage is far more relevant in this case.
Fair play to Salmond; he was a very good politician, easily the most skilled manipulator up here. I actually think he seems a decent guy as well, won't be particularly sad to see him go but I think he leaves an impressive record.
Surely sturgeon will be next FM, she'll hopefully bring her slightly more left wing policies to fruition as well.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:33 pm
by Johnny Ryall
[iup=3569094]Corazon de Leon[/iup] wrote:As a person and a speaker I can't stand Alex Salmond, but I can't argue that he's been a good first minister and spokesman for Scotland. For anyone feeling a bit of schadenfreude watching his press conference (I haven't seen it yet), remember that last night was the culmination of his career and his life's work, and he ultimately failed. Whatever you think of his goals, spare a bit of sympathy.
Agree with you 100%
Some of the hate Salmond gets is unnecessary (some is necessary, but he is no dictator).
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:36 pm
by Captain Kinopio
[iup=3569167]Johnny Ryall[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569094]Corazon de Leon[/iup] wrote:As a person and a speaker I can't stand Alex Salmond, but I can't argue that he's been a good first minister and spokesman for Scotland. For anyone feeling a bit of schadenfreude watching his press conference (I haven't seen it yet), remember that last night was the culmination of his career and his life's work, and he ultimately failed. Whatever you think of his goals, spare a bit of sympathy.
Agree with you 100%
Some of the hate Salmond gets is unnecessary (some is necessary, but he is no dictator).
I know dictators have power!
WAYHOOOO!
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:37 pm
by elite knight danbo
Alright I'm done with the self-pity. Taking a break from politics for a month or two then I'll join the greens or something.
Nothing but love for Salmond. Didn't agree on some things, but there is only love. Looking forward to seeing what Sturgeon can do.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:39 pm
by Memento Mori
Donald Trump claiming the no vote is because of wind turbines.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:52 pm
by That
[iup=3569169]elite knight danbo[/iup] wrote:Taking a break from politics for a month or two then I'll join the greens or something.
A very worthy cause, by the way. I've been considering joining the Greens myself.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:52 pm
by Tineash
The SNP will be fine. Nicola Sturgeon is a star, and probably as popular (but less tainted) than Salmond.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:59 pm
by elite knight danbo
[iup=3569180]Karl[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569169]elite knight danbo[/iup] wrote:Taking a break from politics for a month or two then I'll join the greens or something.
A very worthy cause, by the way. I've been considering joining the Greens myself.
Hm. Might not do it now.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 6:02 pm
by captain red dog
The worry is without Salmond, the SNP will fall back. He is a once in lifetime politician. I'm actually surprised he went, don't like the bloke but he really should stay in place until Westminster deliver on their promises. One thing you can't doubt is that he passionately loves his country and genuinely wants the best for them.
Rumblings tonight that the Westminster leaders are starting to pull back on their promises, Salmond really could have taken them to task and started an anti Westminster movement across the entire UK. At the moment we only have UKIP and Farage taking that role.
For the record, I think Westminster need to deliver on their promises as a priority. Park the English issue until after the election. If they don't deliver what they promised then that is a strawberry floating disgrace and Scotland should be entitled to secede from the Union.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 6:03 pm
by That
[iup=3569189]elite knight danbo[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569180]Karl[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569169]elite knight danbo[/iup] wrote:Taking a break from politics for a month or two then I'll join the greens or something.
A very worthy cause, by the way. I've been considering joining the Greens myself.
Hm. Might not do it now.
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 6:09 pm
by Lagamorph
[iup=3569193]Karl[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569189]elite knight danbo[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569180]Karl[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569169]elite knight danbo[/iup] wrote:Taking a break from politics for a month or two then I'll join the greens or something.
A very worthy cause, by the way. I've been considering joining the Greens myself.
Hm. Might not do it now.
We all know you're a Lib Dem supporter Karl. Why else would your name be yellow?
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 6:12 pm
by That
I'm happy to vote for anything bar the Tories, in all practicality, but I do feel I should pick a side at some point...
Re: [DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!
Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 6:15 pm
by Return_of_the_STAR
[iup=3569166]ianf[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569161]Herbi[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569148]KB[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569144]Bigerich[/iup] wrote:[iup=3569113]TheWay[/iup] wrote:TimeGhost wrote:Narrowly rejected, surely?
I'd have added extremely to the start of that sentence, TG.
There are 20% more NO voters than YES voters. That is not narrow.
It's like 390,000 votes, not a huge margin in a national vote.
In a nation of half a million it's a huge margin, in a nation of 500 million it's miniscule. In Scotland where the population is 5million (?) It's not huge but it's pretty comfortable.
Yeah percentage is far more relevant in this case.
Fair play to Salmond; he was a very good politician, easily the most skilled manipulator up here. I actually think he seems a decent guy as well, won't be particularly sad to see him go but I think he leaves an impressive record.
Surely sturgeon will be next FM, she'll hopefully bring her slightly more left wing policies to fruition as well.
Indeed 390k is a clear majority in a country the size of Scotland.
How is the first minister decided in the Scottish party? Is it just the leader of the majority party ie the SNP or is an election required?