[DISCUSSION] Scottish Independence - It's a No!

[iup=3566677]OnlyShallow[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3566074]CuriousOyster[/iup] wrote:I think big Josephs had too many whiskeys, another one presuming we will walk into the EU instantly.

Why would the Record include his opinion in an article with nothing to do with him?

Stiglitz is the 4th most influential economist in the world today based on academic citations,[10] and in 2011 he was named by Time magazine as one of the 100 most influential people in the world.[11] Stiglitz's work focuses on income distribution, asset risk management, corporate governance, and international trade, and is the author of ten books, with his latest, The Price of Inequality (2012), hitting The New York Times best seller list.[12]

I think he knows what he's talking about more than you do and probably the 13 college lecturers the daily record managed to cobble together to promote their agenda.

Stiglitz is vastly outnumbered in his predictory outcome, though. By equally distinguished fellows in economics as well, like Paul Krugman.


Under 83% turnout is evens at PaddyPower; I'm not sure that's an offer I can pass up.

[iup=3566278]Mockmaster[/iup] wrote:I think it's going to be 50.7% to 49.3% in favour of Yes.

I can't believe you've done this.

[iup=3566685]elite knight danbo[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3566674]ianf[/iup] wrote:There's no way the voter turnout will be anything like 50%. If it's substantially under 80 I'll be very surprised. Although having said that people are lazy strawberry floaters so you never know.

My FB feed seems mainly yes voters too but I think they just tend to be more vocal in their support.

An interesting point is that the really high registration might make it a bit of a hassle to vote if you're just turning up quickly after work or something. So those voting either way from positions of apathy might just go "oh sod it".

That's my worry, the wait at the polls will be nothing like people expect, especially if they all go straight after work. A lot of people won't even bother waiting, I can foresee it already.

with regards to betfair, if this quote from the comment section in the article below is correct, it makes perfect sense

'As Betfair have taken less than £100k in bets on a No outcome, at 1/4 they've just spent £25k on blanket coverage from an idiotic, unquestioning, failing mainstream media. Good advertising, highlights press incompetence'

source - https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/betfa ... 43911.html

They are claiming they paid out a six figure sum, even if that is true it's still less than what they would have paid for an advertising campaign I'd imagine. Smart decision all round!

I really hope it doesn't come down to a fraction of a percentage. That will be major grief on either side.

[iup=3566726]captain red dog[/iup] wrote:I really hope it doesn't come down to a fraction of a percentage. That will be major grief on either side.

49.9999% no, 50.0001% yes.

[iup=3566727]Moggy[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3566726]captain red dog[/iup] wrote:I really hope it doesn't come down to a fraction of a percentage. That will be major grief on either side.

49.9999% no, 50.0001% yes.

The police aren't allowed any leave for up to a week after it, so they're obviously worried about something.

The more I think about it the more I think it needs to be a 'no'.


Also, IMO, the voting should be tied to people's passports and personal records.

In the event of a 'yes' vote, anybody who voted yes should be prevented from moving south of the border in the event that it all goes horribly strawberry floating wrong. Any no voters will continue to be welcomed with open arms.

I think that'd make people really think about what they are doing, and would weed out the 'clueless about politics, two fingers to the English' brigade.

The problem with not getting a good nights sleep is that I'm not 100% sure you're joking.

The 'no' bit was real. The rest was a joke.

[iup=3566677]OnlyShallow[/iup] wrote:

[iup=3566074]CuriousOyster[/iup] wrote:I think big Josephs had too many whiskeys, another one presuming we will walk into the EU instantly.

Why would the Record include his opinion in an article with nothing to do with him?

Stiglitz is the 4th most influential economist in the world today based on academic citations,[10] and in 2011 he was named by Time magazine as one of the 100 most influential people in the world.[11] Stiglitz's work focuses on income distribution, asset risk management, corporate governance, and international trade, and is the author of ten books, with his latest, The Price of Inequality (2012), hitting The New York Times best seller list.[12]

I think he knows what he's talking about more than you do and probably the 13 college lecturers the daily record managed to cobble together to promote their agenda.

I don't recall seeing 'college' lecturer's on that list. Also At the fact you are dismissing them for being university lecturers never mind professors. He may know more than me, and he must also be psychic in that he knows all 28 EU members will say yes when most reckon Spain at least will say no.

The yes campaign is hilarious when faced with experts in various fields of retail, economics etc they just dismiss it as an agenda or scaremongering. Its bizarre.

Genuine question:

Large parts of the Scottish population are famously divided over another well-known 'either/or' issue.

Are there hints that people's Old Firm preference is following through to Yes/No votes? The debates I've seen have wisely and correctly steered clear, but I wondered if there was an undercurrent of that. Sorry if this has been covered here; I've not been following the thread.

I know a lot of Celtic fans voting no, I know they are plenty of Rangers fans voting yes.

Thankfully football and/or religion has been put aside for the most part as far as I'm concerned but if you're asking if there is any link between Catholics/Celtic fans voting yes and Rangers fans/Protestants voting no, then I'd be inclined to say there is.

I would have thought there would be, but my Old Firm supporting mates are in the main proving that wrong so strawberry float knows.

The answer to your question is definitely yes. But it's a complicated subject to look at. For the record, I'm a Rangers fan, and I would be a yes voter if I could vote. So there you go. But the majority of Rangers fans are No voters. I believe there is a large minority of yes voting Rangers fans, but most of them just keep hush hush about it. The same must surely be applicable to the other half of the old firm.

The thing you have to remember is that the No voting Rangers fans and the Yes voting Celtic fans, probably genuinely do believe in their values. It's too easy to say "ach, he's a Celtic supporter! That's why he's voting yes". But isn't that kind of a moot point? A lot of Celtic fans are genuinely brought up with those values which would lead them to lean to a yes vote. They're not voting yes because they support Celtic. They're voting yes because that's the political opinion which they hold. Again, the same is applicable to the other half of the old firm.

I'd say there's only a very small percentage of people in Scotland voting out of pure sectarian hatred, which I'm guessing is what you're getting at.

Cheers: probably what I expected. Ie plenty of examples to suggest that is the case, but also an awful lot of exceptions to that pattern.

Cheers for answering straightforwardly, I wasn't trying to stir, and was genuinely curious.

There was a Glaswegian taxi driver on BBC Radio 2's Jeremy Vine show who said that an eleven year old girl had told him "Proddies will vote 'no' and Catholics will vote 'yes'", he asked her why she thought that and she said "my ma told me".

Of course there will be voting on sectarian lines, but that's hardly surprising.

The demographers reckon that most poor people will be voting "Yes" and the middle classes will mostly vote "No".

Best referendum ever!

[iup=3566857]Octoroc[/iup] wrote:There was a Glaswegian taxi driver on BBC Radio 2's Jeremy Vine show who said that an eleven year old girl had told him "Proddies will vote 'no' and Catholics will vote 'yes'", he asked her why she thought that and she said "my ma told me".

Of course there will be voting on sectarian lines, but that's hardly surprising.

The demographers reckon that most poor people will be voting "Yes" and the middle classes will mostly vote "No".

Best referendum ever!

Anecdotally I don't think that will be the case (if you're being serious). I live in a middle class area and I've barely met any no voters. It seems to be on generational lines - Millennials and Gen X-ers seem to be the biggest Yes voters, older people and the very young are going No.

I'm just recounting what I've heard on the radio. The Jeremy Vine show has been live from Glasgow all week. Tommy Sheridan was a particular highlight.