Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Saint of Killers » Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:13 pm

Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice - I Don't Like Sekiro And That's Okay! (Jimpressions)

| (•_•)| S: This is the best date I've been on since my last date. PB: This is not a date.
S: Neither was the last one. It was a robbery. M: Really? S: Yeah. She stole my heart. And my crown. (❍ᴥ❍ʋ)
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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Godzilla » Sat Mar 30, 2019 8:24 pm

Love Jim and his videos are always entertaining. A very interesting video and I agree with a lot. I think my biggest issue with the game is my own play style and the fact I'd rather hack and slash than wait and parry.

I am getting better at holding back and waiting to attack.

It'll be interesting to see how the game is viewed in a few years time. I think it'll be viewed as a classic. But it's impact on the genre as a whole will be limited. Can't see many parry focused games being made in the coming years.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Captain Kinopio » Sat Mar 30, 2019 11:58 pm

I just connected some dots and unlocked about half the games story I think :lol:

Was very cool, but makes me think I skipped through so much in one go because I’ve spent so long going tin the wrong direction. The game just told me to go places I’ve been banging my head against a wall at for the past few days :fp:

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Godzilla » Sun Mar 31, 2019 2:14 pm

I beat him. Can't believe I actually did it.

Was the perfect run. So close at the end but so pleased it's done. Genuinely one of the worst gaming experiences ever. Stressful and not fun.

Stupid bow and arrow firing dick he was.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Godzilla » Sun Mar 31, 2019 2:51 pm

And straight onto the giant ape. strawberry floats sake!

Any tips?

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Captain Kinopio » Sun Mar 31, 2019 3:23 pm

First phase, just spam the Fire cracker. Jump over his sweep and grapple him if opportunity presents. It’s not too hard. Second phase, jump over sweeps for attack opening but don’t get underneath him because the terror scream is a one hit kill if you can’t get out. When you see him warming up to do it just run like hell.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Godzilla » Sun Mar 31, 2019 3:28 pm

Cheers. Can't be any worse than the last boss.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Captain Kinopio » Sun Mar 31, 2019 5:09 pm

Moving back towards Taf's position on this.

I think they perhaps left it too open because that Genchiro fight really is a bit of a gateway and while you can progress elsewhere, you probably shouldn't. You don't really get anything for doing so other than insane frustration and confusion. There's definitely a load of horse gooseberry fool fights no matter which way you progress and there are too many minibosses but it's been a while since I hated the game and story and character progression that was locked away before now is certainly helping.

If the balance of posture breaking worked a bit more in favour of the player I think this might be better than Bloodbourne. Though a big part of that is the story and setting of this is more to my tastes

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Tafdolphin » Sun Mar 31, 2019 5:16 pm

So I beat the two shinobis in the strawberry floating castle and now I'm on another boss who's Genichiro level frustrating. The battle is actually in the same spot and is, I think, a prelude to the final stages of the game.

I strawberry floating hate it. I love this game, don't get me wrong, but this fight is Genichiro all over again. Either I hold back and do no damage (where inevitably after 5 minutes of perfect parrying I make a mistake) or I charge in and the strawberry floater blocks me until my posture runs out. I have a feeling I know what to do but the timing required is so absolutely pinpoint perfect that I've had to step away. I was getting so angry my play was sloppy as strawberry float.

EDIT: I actually found the second stage of the ape far easier than the first. He telegraphs his swings a mile off and if you parry the big down-slice he goes prone long enough for 5 good hits. Rinse and repeat. Pretty sure I did it on the first go.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Godzilla » Sun Mar 31, 2019 8:40 pm

I did ok with the ape but can't beat him so I've gone exploring. Go past the poison lake and killed the mini boss by making him walk into the lake and get poisoned then just death blow and repeat.

Now onto a little village. So many great griding bits and a few new bosses/mini bosses. Lovely news area and a nice change of pace.

Such a weird game this I go from loving it to loving it but hating the fact I'm stuck at a boss and can't grind like I could in souls or Bloodborne.

Anyway back to the grind. Found a new area to explore and plan to max all skills.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Sandy » Mon Apr 01, 2019 10:04 am

Their games frustrate me as much as always.

The setting is beautiful. The story is engaging. The exploration is great. The lore is interesting. The combat is a bit naff.

People can say get good all they want but the feedback from the gameplay is poor. As an example: It implies you deflect with L1 by perfectly timing the L1 press with their attack. In reality you can just hammer L1 over and over while they're attacking and it works 95% of the time. Why bother? Just let me hold L1 instead and save me the unskilled hassle.

The fighting mechanic as a whole could be a lot more refined. I'd say the reason the game is so hard is more because of poor combat design than anything else.

As with all of their games the best way to describe it is frustrating.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Godzilla » Mon Apr 01, 2019 10:35 am

I played a bit this morning but quickly got annoyed and went back to DMC 5 for another play through. A game which gives me rewards constantly.

It'll be interesting to see how quickly Sekiro drops in price and how many people get past the first couple of hours.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Tafdolphin » Mon Apr 01, 2019 10:55 am

Sandy wrote:Their games frustrate me as much as always.

The setting is beautiful. The story is engaging. The exploration is great. The lore is interesting. The combat is a bit naff.

People can say get good all they want but the feedback from the gameplay is poor. As an example: It implies you deflect with L1 by perfectly timing the L1 press with their attack. In reality you can just hammer L1 over and over while they're attacking and it works 95% of the time. Why bother? Just let me hold L1 instead and save me the unskilled hassle.

The fighting mechanic as a whole could be a lot more refined. I'd say the reason the game is so hard is more because of poor combat design than anything else.

As with all of their games the best way to describe it is frustrating.


So first off, I agree with you that it's punishing. I recognise that it's not a game for everyone, and that people are going to get angry at it. I just want to talk about the points I've bolded.

I disagree that the design of the combat is poor. Comprehensively disagree, as I think the combat system is as close to perfect as they were ever going to get, given the type of system they were going for.

In the Souls games the combat was based entirely around the defend and attack posture... you'd watch an enemy's attack pattern, hold down block to nullify their attack and then press forward with your offence. In Bloodborne this was switched out to a more aggressive model where blocking simply wasn't an option... the onus was on the player to keep up the attack and to dodge any incoming animations.

Sekiro is a combination of the two, with the aggressiveness of Bloodborne paired with the need to block from Souls. But where Sekiro differs is the necessity of parrying, a mechanic in both previous versions of the combat system but as an optional addition rather than a cornerstone. In Sekiro you are taught, through tutorials and boss encounters alike, that the best defence is a good offence but also that a good offence can be a good defence. The key mechanic of the system, posture, is intrinsically linked to parrying and many enemies can be defeated quickest in this way.

The reason blockdancing (constantly tapping L1) is a temporary measure is that it's inefficient. If you want to do that then sure, you'll accidentally get some parries but you'll likely miss more than you hit and every attack you merely block is constantly wearing down your own posture. If that reaches the limit...in most cases you're done for. Later enemies specifically stop you doing this through stun attacks, or patterns that disrupt you from standing there pressing L1 over and over. In the early game blockdancing is a way to progress but by the mid-game and beyond it's not a feasible option anymore.

What the system tries to do, it does perfectly. You mention the signposting is poor and I'd say in return...look harder. Not facetiously...take the time to examine your enemy's attack patterns and learn from them. The signposting is there but missable and that's the point: every enemy is a mini-mystery waiting to be uncovered. Each has their tells and their rhythms. The more you play the better you get whilst they remain the same. Like I say, this is a game about learning.

EDIT: there's also a tooltip that states the parry window actually gets smaller the more you press L1.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Lazy Fair » Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:52 pm

Tafdolphin wrote:
Lazy Fair wrote:What do the dragon blood droplets do if you consume them yourself? Something about restorative power, but not sure what that actually means.


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They remove Dragonrot from the NPCs you've met. It resets the chance of Unseen Aid, basically.

EDIT: Yeah, got to another bullshit fight. The two shinobis in the castle. It's annoying (there's the boss and a mook and even killing the mook is tough) and it's badly done (the camera is all over the place and the space is tiny). When you compare this to something like Genichiro, it's amazing they let it through.

How's this for an attempt? :slol:



This was about my tenth go.

There was a super long period of exploration combined with amazing boss fights and now this... a single area filled with elite mooks and a cheap, mechanically dodgy boss.

Oh well!


That’s if you give them to an NPC, you can consume them yourself though and it does something (although I don’t know what). Any idea?


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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Godzilla » Mon Apr 01, 2019 3:50 pm

The dragon rot thing is if you use the droplets they cure everyone.

If you take one yourself it takes gives you back about a quarter of your second life globes. Never take them they are best used to fix dragon rot.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Tafdolphin » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:03 pm

strawberry float me I genuinely do not know how to beat this boss. I started at him again tonight and in my first 3 tries got him down to second stage and almost killed him completely on the third. After that...nothing. Literally. I couldn't get him below 1/3 health on his first deathblow.

For some reason the angrier I get the far harder I find the battle, meaning I have about 3 goes to kill him or I have to quit for the night.

Gemini73 wrote:You really are just an obnoxious little toad.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Godzilla » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:35 pm

I've managed to kill 2 more major bosses (left the ape til later as he is annoying). Got some new abilities that open things up. Plus 2 more attack boosts.

Know of two more mini bosses I need to take down for the next posture boost so that'll be my next plan.

One thing I really don't think is well thought out is the consumables that you need for certain bosses. If you try 5 times and lose them 5 times then... Off griding you go. It's poorly thought out.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Captain Kinopio » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:54 pm

Tafdolphin wrote:What the system tries to do, it does perfectly. You mention the signposting is poor and I'd say in return...look harder. Not facetiously...take the time to examine your enemy's attack patterns and learn from them. The signposting is there but missable and that's the point: every enemy is a mini-mystery waiting to be uncovered. Each has their tells and their rhythms. The more you play the better you get whilst they remain the same. Like I say, this is a game about learning.

EDIT: there's also a tooltip that states the parry window actually gets smaller the more you press L1.


I would disagree with this. Not only do I think the posture breaking system is weighted way too heavily in favour of the enemy but also that a lot of the time, the surroundings in which you fight a boss actively prevent you from learning their moveset and then countering it in the way the game teaches you.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Diceman » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:55 pm

I’m enjoying the early game of this, but when I occasionally pop in here and read about how tough the game gets, it makes me wonder if I should pump my limited game time elsewhere. Farming items to have another pop at a boss and then get pummelled only to have to farm again sounds like a gooseberry fool experience I’d rather not go through.

Just killed some fat drunk fella, so I’ll see how tough things are next and maybe make a trade-in decision by the weekend.

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PostRe: Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice (PS4, XBO, PC) - FromSoftware/Activision
by Tafdolphin » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:58 pm

Captain Kinopio wrote:
Tafdolphin wrote:What the system tries to do, it does perfectly. You mention the signposting is poor and I'd say in return...look harder. Not facetiously...take the time to examine your enemy's attack patterns and learn from them. The signposting is there but missable and that's the point: every enemy is a mini-mystery waiting to be uncovered. Each has their tells and their rhythms. The more you play the better you get whilst they remain the same. Like I say, this is a game about learning.

EDIT: there's also a tooltip that states the parry window actually gets smaller the more you press L1.


I would disagree with this. Not only do I think the posture breaking system is weighted way too heavily in favour of the enemy but also that a lot of the time, the surroundings in which you fight a boss actively prevent you from learning their moveset and then countering it in the way the game teaches you.


Well I disagree again with that. Like I say, I think it's working as intended and the weighting against the player is part of that. You're a Shinobi not a samurai, you're supposed to be a glass cannon and the system makes you feel that every step of the way.

I do agree about the surroundings though. That's the only bit of the whole experience that feels, to me, like an artificial difficulty barrier. Fights aren't fun if you can't see them.

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