The Football Thread 2020/21: Mods plz lock thnx bbz x

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Celtic open talks with Keane
by Finiarél » Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:09 am

twitter.com/David_Ornstein/status/1376429333938573312


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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Celtic open talks with Keane
by Drumstick » Mon Mar 29, 2021 11:20 am

What was the official England formation for the Albania game? Loads of sites had Mount playing up front in a three with Kane and Sterling... :?

Good that he's gone back to a 4-3-3 though. Would've been better if Rashford had played in the front three and Mount had played where Kalvin Phillips was.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Celtic open talks with Keane
by Jenuall » Mon Mar 29, 2021 11:23 am

Albania game was pretty dire for long stretches, and it just drove home the reality that England desperately need a more creative setup.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Celtic open talks with Keane
by Cuttooth » Mon Mar 29, 2021 4:57 pm

Rocsteady wrote:
Photek wrote:
Rocsteady wrote:"These are small.... the qualification is FAR away...."

:lol:
:cry:

I do like Ireland so hope yous still qualify but strawberry float me, what a mess.

Just found out what match this is in relation to. What the almighty strawberry float?! :lol: :fp:

To be fair they've also beaten Germany, France, and the Netherlands twice.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by BTB » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:08 am

Lovely win for Wales last night :toot:

Of all of the aerial threats on the pitch yesterday, Dan James was the one to score a header :lol:

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Celtic open talks with Keane
by Photek » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:12 am

Cuttooth wrote:
Rocsteady wrote:
Photek wrote:
Rocsteady wrote:"These are small.... the qualification is FAR away...."

:lol:
:cry:

I do like Ireland so hope yous still qualify but strawberry float me, what a mess.

Just found out what match this is in relation to. What the almighty strawberry float?! :lol: :fp:

To be fair they've also beaten Germany, France, and the Netherlands twice.

It's not just the result, it's the football, as in, the manager wants us to play a possession based game but the players just aren't good enough for it, they pass the ball out of play and to the opposition constantly. It is a young team but there is no real talent coming through for this or next generation, it's the worst we've been for quite some time.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Tomous » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:13 am

BTB wrote:Lovely win for Wales last night :toot:

Of all of the aerial threats on the pitch yesterday, Dan James was the one to score a header :lol:



Gotta give Bale credit for that cross.


If Dan James is scoring off his head you know the cross is inch perfect :lol:

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Jenuall » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:13 am

Was nice to see Wales win, ultimately it's still a tough ask for them to make it through qualification but it would be amazing to see them at the WC

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Lotus » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:20 am

Declan Rice believes England are an "entertaining team to watch", after critics suggested Gareth Southgate's side are too cautious.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56586894

:slol:

Not sure what planet he's on. England are many things, but entertaining definitely isn't one of them. During the last World Cup perhaps, but certainly not since.

Really disappointed that Lewandowski's out of tonight's match - it would've been a test for our defence and added some quality to the game.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Jenuall » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:23 am

Yeah the WC run was quite entertaining through a combination of low expectations, surprise and good fortune, since then it has been a struggle to watch England at all.

They desperately need more creativity in the team and to stop squandering chances.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Tomous » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:32 am

Momentum goes a long way in a tournament and England had a really nice path to the semi-final.


To be honest, I don't think Southgate is that great a manager and they could do a lot better. The pool of talent in attack is ridiculous, a better manager could get so much out of those options.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Photek » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:34 am

I don't think England were at all entertaining in the WC, most of the goals were from set pieces right? I have to say, watching Scotland v Israel the other night, even though it was a draw, Scotland looked like prime Barcelona in comparison to us, Wales last night were extremely poor but again, better than us. I foresee a lot of years of nothing from RoI going forward.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Preezy » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:35 am

I thought this was an interesting article about why England should look to boycott the Qatar World Cup:
https://www.football365.com/news/case-england-boycott-qatar-2022-john-nicholson

With at least 6,500 migrant workers dead in the desert heat in the last 10 years, what on earth are we doing letting Qatar host a World Cup? It was awarded to them by a thoroughly discredited organisation, headed by a thoroughly discredited person, in a thoroughly discredited process, which involved thoroughly discredited ‘methods’. And yet still it is planned to go ahead, not next summer as initially planned, but next winter, because it was always a bloody ludicrous idea to hold it in the summer heat.

Last week Norway and Germany’s national team made a protest against the abuse of human rights before their games, something outlawed by FIFA, though they graciously agreed to take no action against them for this. I should hope not. Last week Amnesty International appealed to FIFA to act on labour abuses as World Cup qualifiers kicked off.

The Independent published a David Harding piece last week highlighting how there are growing calls for a boycott of the World Cup.

Yet still there is no serious threat to Qatar holding this World Cup. Not yet. We must change that. It seems as though football’s exceptionalist spirit is alive and well. All manner of excuses have been given, not least that football is helping shine a light on the situation with migrant/slave labour.

FIFA says: ‘To be frank, we actually think that engagement and dialogue is the best way to promote understanding of universal human rights values.’

Which is just a shut-up-and-go-away whitewash, typical of all their press releases. Meanwhile people die.

Much of the building that the workers are constructing is only being constructed because of the World Cup, therefore awarding them the tournament has increased abuse of labour, not shone a light upon it.

Obviously, the way to ‘promote understanding of universal human rights values’ is by offering a multi-million pound sporting competition to the abusive country in return for stopping being abusive. The way it is now, they work the living sh*t out of the people who construct the stadiums, the ones still left alive are shipped out once the job is done, the tournament is played and afterwards everything goes on as before. That’s what’ll happen.

The fact that FIFA have already told Amnesty that ‘day-to-day due diligence’ of construction workers’ rights is carried out by the Supreme Committee, the government body overseeing the Qatar World Cup, is just not acceptable. Do you think it will give Qatar a clean bill of health? Of course it bloody will and FIFA know this, even as death in the desert happens. You can’t hand over inspection of the jail to the jailors. This is just lesson 101 in the human rights abuse play book. You’d have to be some numpty to not realise why they want to inspect their own working practices and standards.

There are calls for Qatar to put in place proper health and safety measures, protect workers rights and standards, but it’s too late for all that now. They’ve been at this since 2014. Just asking them to be a little less evil isn’t going to work. They never should have been awarded the tournament and that fact remains as true now as when they ‘won’ the bid.

FIFA has pledged to leave ‘a legacy of world class standards and practices for workers in Qatar and internationally’ but given they’ve handed over the delivery of this to the supreme committee, how is that possible? It’s surely just more PR bullshit. Once it’s been played, football’s attention will be turned elsewhere.

Sadly, our FA has also been desperately trying to say nothing while saying something. ‘We believe that there is evidence of some progress being made by Qatar, however we recognise there is still much more to be done.’ Which is FA-speak for ‘we’re doing sod all and just want to get through all of this without making a stand, or will only take a stand when everyone else has’. Get a backbone, for God’s sake.

We should be making a stand and not only that, we should be proud to make a stand.

Football is not worth one single death, never mind 6,500 and I can’t believe I feel I have to say this. Surely that is obvious.

The quotes from some of the workers are heartbreaking.

“My life here is like a prison. The manager said: ’If you want to stay in Qatar be quiet and keep working.'”

“God knows there are days when I cannot continue, everything becomes too much…The only thing that keeps me alive is the thought of my children.”

“I remember my first day in Qatar. Almost the very first thing (an agent) working for my company did was take my passport. I haven’t seen it since.”

“The manager said ‘these men are causing trouble, they are lazy. Watch them closely. If they do not show up to work or try to escape, report them to the police.'”

Enough. All countries should withdraw. People are dying. Dying, for God’s sake.

It could easily be rearranged in any European country, or in North America for next summer. Hell, even if it couldn’t, that’s no reason to play it in Qatar. Just call the thing off. We can do without it, if doing with it means more bloody torture, exploitation and death.

I’d urge everyone to read the recently published Amnesty International statement on Qatar.

These people are not making this stuff up. FIFA released a World Cup Qatar 2022 Sustainability Strategy in 2019 but the worry is that this is all window dressing, designed to make everything appear to be fine, when it is far from fine, as the dead bodies are hauled off dangerous building sites and buried who knows where.

If England pulled out, it would be a serious statement of intent.

Don’t put the players in the invidious position of having to choose to play or not (though half a dozen of the world’s biggest names taking a boycott stance would be a game changer); the FA should just do the right thing.

There will be plenty of other World Cups, these poor people only get one life. What on earth do we think we’re doing, sanctioning this? How low can football get?

Read this and then come back and tell me this is all OK and we should be part of it This should, in any reasonable world, disqualify them from holding a World Cup. That should not even be in question.

It could just as easily be you or I melting in the sun. You think those workers wouldn’t want some solidarity from us? They need someone to fight for them, to be on their side, not to turn their backs and say “sorry pal, I fancy us to do well this year, so…”

Just because it is happening over there and not here, does not make it any less worse or appalling. Just because it is poor people from the Indian subcontinent and elsewhere who have been conned or forced through economic poverty to seek work there, does not mitigate the circumstances. We are all one people. No-one sweats less in the desert heat.

Doing nothing isn’t an option. We need to shame our own FA into withdrawing England from this festering boil of evil, and hope that others in other countries will do the same; clearly Germany and Norway will.

We don’t need much altruism here. We don’t need to be a saint. We can’t solve all the world’s problems, we can’t always make an unfair world fair, but we can bloody well solve this.

Pull out. Boycott Qatar 2022. Play it somewhere better.

I would fully support a boycott. But I think when it comes down to it, the majority of people just don't care (enough) about migrant workers in a country they've never been to or could point to on a map, even if it's for something they can relate to like the building of football stadiums for the World Cup. I spent nearly 10 years of my childhood in Qatar and whilst I would love to watch the games and see the camera panning across places I recognise and grew up experiencing, it would be too tinged with sadness and anger that so many poor workers died in hellish conditions just to make the spectacle (and let's be clear, football is just a spectacle) happen, I don't think I could bring myself to watch and enjoy it.

What do you all think?

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Moggy » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:44 am

Everyone should boycott.

But nobody will.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Jenuall » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:44 am

I'd be more than happy for them to boycott it.

But I also think it wouldn't really achieve much in terms of helping address the problems

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Oblomov Boblomov » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:46 am

Preezy wrote:I thought this was an interesting article about why England should look to boycott the Qatar World Cup:
https://www.football365.com/news/case-england-boycott-qatar-2022-john-nicholson

With at least 6,500 migrant workers dead in the desert heat in the last 10 years, what on earth are we doing letting Qatar host a World Cup? It was awarded to them by a thoroughly discredited organisation, headed by a thoroughly discredited person, in a thoroughly discredited process, which involved thoroughly discredited ‘methods’. And yet still it is planned to go ahead, not next summer as initially planned, but next winter, because it was always a bloody ludicrous idea to hold it in the summer heat.

Last week Norway and Germany’s national team made a protest against the abuse of human rights before their games, something outlawed by FIFA, though they graciously agreed to take no action against them for this. I should hope not. Last week Amnesty International appealed to FIFA to act on labour abuses as World Cup qualifiers kicked off.

The Independent published a David Harding piece last week highlighting how there are growing calls for a boycott of the World Cup.

Yet still there is no serious threat to Qatar holding this World Cup. Not yet. We must change that. It seems as though football’s exceptionalist spirit is alive and well. All manner of excuses have been given, not least that football is helping shine a light on the situation with migrant/slave labour.

FIFA says: ‘To be frank, we actually think that engagement and dialogue is the best way to promote understanding of universal human rights values.’

Which is just a shut-up-and-go-away whitewash, typical of all their press releases. Meanwhile people die.

Much of the building that the workers are constructing is only being constructed because of the World Cup, therefore awarding them the tournament has increased abuse of labour, not shone a light upon it.

Obviously, the way to ‘promote understanding of universal human rights values’ is by offering a multi-million pound sporting competition to the abusive country in return for stopping being abusive. The way it is now, they work the living sh*t out of the people who construct the stadiums, the ones still left alive are shipped out once the job is done, the tournament is played and afterwards everything goes on as before. That’s what’ll happen.

The fact that FIFA have already told Amnesty that ‘day-to-day due diligence’ of construction workers’ rights is carried out by the Supreme Committee, the government body overseeing the Qatar World Cup, is just not acceptable. Do you think it will give Qatar a clean bill of health? Of course it bloody will and FIFA know this, even as death in the desert happens. You can’t hand over inspection of the jail to the jailors. This is just lesson 101 in the human rights abuse play book. You’d have to be some numpty to not realise why they want to inspect their own working practices and standards.

There are calls for Qatar to put in place proper health and safety measures, protect workers rights and standards, but it’s too late for all that now. They’ve been at this since 2014. Just asking them to be a little less evil isn’t going to work. They never should have been awarded the tournament and that fact remains as true now as when they ‘won’ the bid.

FIFA has pledged to leave ‘a legacy of world class standards and practices for workers in Qatar and internationally’ but given they’ve handed over the delivery of this to the supreme committee, how is that possible? It’s surely just more PR bullshit. Once it’s been played, football’s attention will be turned elsewhere.

Sadly, our FA has also been desperately trying to say nothing while saying something. ‘We believe that there is evidence of some progress being made by Qatar, however we recognise there is still much more to be done.’ Which is FA-speak for ‘we’re doing sod all and just want to get through all of this without making a stand, or will only take a stand when everyone else has’. Get a backbone, for God’s sake.

We should be making a stand and not only that, we should be proud to make a stand.

Football is not worth one single death, never mind 6,500 and I can’t believe I feel I have to say this. Surely that is obvious.

The quotes from some of the workers are heartbreaking.

“My life here is like a prison. The manager said: ’If you want to stay in Qatar be quiet and keep working.'”

“God knows there are days when I cannot continue, everything becomes too much…The only thing that keeps me alive is the thought of my children.”

“I remember my first day in Qatar. Almost the very first thing (an agent) working for my company did was take my passport. I haven’t seen it since.”

“The manager said ‘these men are causing trouble, they are lazy. Watch them closely. If they do not show up to work or try to escape, report them to the police.'”

Enough. All countries should withdraw. People are dying. Dying, for God’s sake.

It could easily be rearranged in any European country, or in North America for next summer. Hell, even if it couldn’t, that’s no reason to play it in Qatar. Just call the thing off. We can do without it, if doing with it means more bloody torture, exploitation and death.

I’d urge everyone to read the recently published Amnesty International statement on Qatar.

These people are not making this stuff up. FIFA released a World Cup Qatar 2022 Sustainability Strategy in 2019 but the worry is that this is all window dressing, designed to make everything appear to be fine, when it is far from fine, as the dead bodies are hauled off dangerous building sites and buried who knows where.

If England pulled out, it would be a serious statement of intent.

Don’t put the players in the invidious position of having to choose to play or not (though half a dozen of the world’s biggest names taking a boycott stance would be a game changer); the FA should just do the right thing.

There will be plenty of other World Cups, these poor people only get one life. What on earth do we think we’re doing, sanctioning this? How low can football get?

Read this and then come back and tell me this is all OK and we should be part of it This should, in any reasonable world, disqualify them from holding a World Cup. That should not even be in question.

It could just as easily be you or I melting in the sun. You think those workers wouldn’t want some solidarity from us? They need someone to fight for them, to be on their side, not to turn their backs and say “sorry pal, I fancy us to do well this year, so…”

Just because it is happening over there and not here, does not make it any less worse or appalling. Just because it is poor people from the Indian subcontinent and elsewhere who have been conned or forced through economic poverty to seek work there, does not mitigate the circumstances. We are all one people. No-one sweats less in the desert heat.

Doing nothing isn’t an option. We need to shame our own FA into withdrawing England from this festering boil of evil, and hope that others in other countries will do the same; clearly Germany and Norway will.

We don’t need much altruism here. We don’t need to be a saint. We can’t solve all the world’s problems, we can’t always make an unfair world fair, but we can bloody well solve this.

Pull out. Boycott Qatar 2022. Play it somewhere better.

I would fully support a boycott. But I think when it comes down to it, the majority of people just don't care (enough) about migrant workers in a country they've never been to or could point to on a map, even if it's for something they can relate to like the building of football stadiums for the World Cup. I spent nearly 10 years of my childhood in Qatar and whilst I would love to watch the games and see the camera panning across places I recognise and grew up experiencing, it would be too tinged with sadness and anger that so many poor workers died in hellish conditions just to make the spectacle (and let's be clear, football is just a spectacle) happen, I don't think I could bring myself to watch and enjoy it.

What do you all think?

I agree we should stand up against things like this.

Our government recently confirmed it is happy to continue making deals with countries that commit genocide, though, so I'm not sure a few thousand migrant deaths will mean anything to them.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Moggy » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:49 am

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by DML » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:51 am

:lol:

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Drumstick » Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:25 pm

strawberry float. :lol:

There was a period in time during the Nations qualifying where England were legitimately entertaining, when Gary deployed Sterling, Rashford and Kane in a front three with a traditional back four.

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PostRe: The Football Thread 2020/21: Aguerooooout
by Return_of_the_STAR » Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:27 pm

I would happily see a boycott with an alternative tournament, however it’s never going to happen.

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