The Football Thread 2024/25: Erik's Euro Odyssey Continues...

[Denster]

Hard not to feel for arsenal as they'd done so well right up to the 99th minute. Trossard was rightly shown the second yellow. He crashed into the back of silva then kicked the ball away. Anger should be directed at him for losing focus and ensuring his team were placed under pressure for 55 minutes after. It was a stupid mistake and he was correctly punished for it.

Arsenal were defensively brilliant after that and deserved all 3 points but it just didn't happen.
Greatly enjoyed the petulance from Pep and Arteta though.
As a neutral.

[Dowbocop]

Absolutely loving the hypocritical salt from all the City players last night about the "dark arts" - Rodri tried to get Havertz sent off in the tenth second of the game

They had everything put on a plate for them yesterday and almost failed to get anything because our team, to a man, just didn't let them for so long. In the cold light of day City had to smash and grab a point at their own ground against ten men and they're proper rattled about it

Yeah, watching it again, Oliver is asking for the free kick to be taken further back, Doku looks at him and kicks it in the direction he is pointing. Doku does overkick it a bit and I'm not sure if that's intentional or not but no ref is going to book him in that scenario. It's completely different to kicking the ball away after the whistle has gone because you've clattered into someone.

Here's a link to the clip:

https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/s/IQPwEmesVl

I don't rate Jeremy Doku but I think he's a good enough footballer that when he kicks the ball away from one Arsenal player, past two more Arsenal players, and into the one little bit of the pitch where we'd need to actually retrieve the ball then he knows what he's doing. Havertz had the ball at his feet - to use the phrase that was bandied about after Rice had the ball kicked at him but before Veltman tried to break his leg - Doku "has no business kicking that ball."

I haven't seen the angle but there's an argument going around that Trossard was trying to set Martinelli away with his hoof downfield, and there was so little time between the whistle and his kick that benefit of the doubt should have been applied (see also: RVP at the Nou Camp). But Doku gets the benefit of the doubt applied despite his being an entirely calculated and deliberate action, but Trossard is instantly cautioned for a split second decision.

[Benzin]

Trossard probably would've gotten away without the booking if it just been for the barge. But the hoof away (which probably seemed fairly directionless at the time) sealed it.

Essentially, don't do stupid challenges for the ball then give the ref a reason to send you off.

[Tomous]

Absolutely loving the hypocritical salt from all the City players last night about the "dark arts" - Rodri tried to get Havertz sent off in the tenth second of the game

They had everything put on a plate for them yesterday and almost failed to get anything because our team, to a man, just didn't let them for so long. In the cold light of day City had to smash and grab a point at their own ground against ten men and they're proper rattled about it

Yeah, watching it again, Oliver is asking for the free kick to be taken further back, Doku looks at him and kicks it in the direction he is pointing. Doku does overkick it a bit and I'm not sure if that's intentional or not but no ref is going to book him in that scenario. It's completely different to kicking the ball away after the whistle has gone because you've clattered into someone.

Here's a link to the clip:

https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/s/IQPwEmesVl

I don't rate Jeremy Doku but I think he's a good enough footballer that when he kicks the ball away from one Arsenal player, past two more Arsenal players, and into the one little bit of the pitch where we'd need to actually retrieve the ball then he knows what he's doing. Havertz had the ball at his feet - to use the phrase that was bandied about after Rice had the ball kicked at him but before Veltman tried to break his leg - Doku "has no business kicking that ball."

I haven't seen the angle but there's an argument going around that Trossard was trying to set Martinelli away with his hoof downfield, and there was so little time between the whistle and his kick that benefit of the doubt should have been applied (see also: RVP at the Nou Camp). But Doku gets the benefit of the doubt applied despite his being an entirely calculated and deliberate action, but Trossard is instantly cautioned for a split second decision.

RVP was miles away from the referee though and didn't hear the whistle. Trossard is only a few metres away and has more than enough time not to kick it. He gets no benefit of the doubt because he's just barged into someone with a challenge probably worthy of a yellow card in itself. I thought the Rice red was extremely harsh but I have zero sympathy for Trossard-to do that while on a yellow card with seconds to go of the first half at City away is just plain stupid.

[Dowbocop]

Absolutely loving the hypocritical salt from all the City players last night about the "dark arts" - Rodri tried to get Havertz sent off in the tenth second of the game

They had everything put on a plate for them yesterday and almost failed to get anything because our team, to a man, just didn't let them for so long. In the cold light of day City had to smash and grab a point at their own ground against ten men and they're proper rattled about it

Yeah, watching it again, Oliver is asking for the free kick to be taken further back, Doku looks at him and kicks it in the direction he is pointing. Doku does overkick it a bit and I'm not sure if that's intentional or not but no ref is going to book him in that scenario. It's completely different to kicking the ball away after the whistle has gone because you've clattered into someone.

Here's a link to the clip:

https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/s/IQPwEmesVl

I don't rate Jeremy Doku but I think he's a good enough footballer that when he kicks the ball away from one Arsenal player, past two more Arsenal players, and into the one little bit of the pitch where we'd need to actually retrieve the ball then he knows what he's doing. Havertz had the ball at his feet - to use the phrase that was bandied about after Rice had the ball kicked at him but before Veltman tried to break his leg - Doku "has no business kicking that ball."

I haven't seen the angle but there's an argument going around that Trossard was trying to set Martinelli away with his hoof downfield, and there was so little time between the whistle and his kick that benefit of the doubt should have been applied (see also: RVP at the Nou Camp). But Doku gets the benefit of the doubt applied despite his being an entirely calculated and deliberate action, but Trossard is instantly cautioned for a split second decision.

RVP was miles away from the referee though and didn't hear the whistle. Trossard is only a few metres away and has more than enough time not to kick it. He gets no benefit of the doubt because he's just barged into someone with a challenge probably worthy of a yellow card in itself. I thought the Rice red was extremely harsh but I have zero sympathy for Trossard-to do that while on a yellow card with seconds to go of the first half at City away is just plain stupid.

The challenge is on the edge for me but I don't think it's a booking in and of itself. Again, a bit of common sense might have seen Oliver have a word with him about it (he was on a booking after all), but I feel he set the tone for that (rightly or wrongly) when he didn't book Havertz in the first minute for a similar offence.

[Dowbocop]

Also, Haaland won't get any censure for throwing the ball at Gabriel, but I think he should get a retrospective six game ban - not for Arsenal's benefit, but just to make Fantasy Football a bit more interesting

[Joer]

Very frustrating to not get the victory yesterday but it is what it is. Would have taken a point pre-game as is both a point gained and two points dropped for City based on expectations but to lose it in that fashion naturally hurts.

Obviously the sending off is Trossard's stupidity so no real complaints about that, the only real complaint is the lack of consistency.

Seen a lot of stuff about Trossard's momentum meaning he has to pull out of the pass to Martinelli but cannot completely do so after the whistle blah blah blah, and I get it, but the foul plus that was probably enough for a booking.

The Doku thing is why we all get so frustrated. Oliver was telling him to give the ball to Rice to take the free kick and he kicks it instead to Timber to delay the restart. There's no way a professional footballer for the best team in the world cannot make that pass to Rice so it has to be delaying the restart. He's set the precedent in that incident for not punishing a delaying of the restart. Even with our first goal, Partey gets fouled, ball goes into Bernardo's path and he ends up carrying the ball a further 10-15 yards up the pitch with no booking there for delaying things (which is ironically part of the City complaints in that we didn't take the free-kick from the right place).

It's worth noting that this is the same Michael Oliver who didn't want to give Kovacic a second yellow at the Emirates last season because he "didn't want to ruin the game". The same Michael Oliver who has sent off an Arsenal player 7 times in his career, more than any other team he's refereed. The same Michael Oliver who is on the City owners payroll and gets paid 10x his normal fee to referee a match in the UAE. The same Michael Oliver who didn't send off Doku for his karate kick on Macallister. There's a clear conflict of interest in that last point and his ability to be unbiased in Manchester City games which is not that surprising when you look at the difference in what he is paid by their owners compared to his employers. I'd certainly favour someone who wanted to pay me 10x my normal salary to do my job!

The whole "the law is the law" thing falls apart the moment it's not applied consistently. No neutral fan wants a player sent off for that. Referees should be allowed to interpret the rules and have a choice because otherwise you end up with this scenario of why wasn't Pedro booked, why wasn't Doku booked, why wasn't etc... all booked when X was when your defense is "the letter of the law" as even that's not being applied correctly.

TL;DR - Trossard should have gone, shame we didn't win, strawberry float Michael Oliver and Manchester City.

[Tomous]

I didn't know Oliver was paid £20k by UAE last year to referee a single match. That's dodgy as strawberry float

Also....those 7 minutes of injury time (which he was then going to play until 9)

twitter.com/HarrySymeou/status/1837924668654997976

Absolutely need to ban PL refs from freelancing.

[Rex Kramer]

The easiest way to remove those pointless bookings for time wasting is to just stop the clock when the ball goes dead and play 30 minute halves.

[Tomous]

The easiest way to remove those pointless bookings for time wasting is to just stop the clock when the ball goes dead and play 30 minute halves.

Been banging this drum forever. Don't understand why they don't even want to trial it.

[Dowbocop]

The easiest way to remove those pointless bookings for time wasting is to just stop the clock when the ball goes dead and play 30 minute halves.

Been banging this drum forever. Don't understand why they don't even want to trial it.

Wenger was talking about it a few years ago wasn't he? Football is basically the only sport that doesn't do this and it's mental.

Agree with Joer that Oliver reffing in the UAE is corrupt. It would also be corrupt if he was going off to the MLS at the behest of KSE, FSG or the Glazers.

[Tomous]

It's a stonewall conflict of interest. Whatever you think about the game yesterday, I think we can all agree on that.

[Jenuall]

I mean, you'd still need to punish people for time wasting, this is a commercial product remember - the longer that ball is dead the longer they have to wait to sell more half time pints and put more adverts in front of people watching at home

[Tomous]

I mean, you'd still need to punish people for time wasting, this is a commercial product remember - the longer that ball is dead the longer they have to wait to sell more half time pints and put more adverts in front of people watching at home

For sure, but it's going to happen a lot less if it has less benefit. It won't eradicate it completely, and teams will use it to break up momentum, but it will still reduce the issue overall in my opinion.

And make the sport fairer as everyone will play the same amount of time.

[Rex Kramer]

And it'll remove the nonsense where a ref won't blow up for time during certain passages of play, particularly if the home side are attacking.

[Jenuall]

I guess that depends on whether they amend the rule to blow up as soon as the in play time hits 30 or whether it stops when the ball next goes out of play

[Rex Kramer]

Either way, it isn't beholden to the ref deciding when it's most appropriate.

[Tomous]

I guess that depends on whether they amend the rule to blow up as soon as the in play time hits 30 or whether it stops when the ball next goes out of play

Just do it when it goes out of play. And allow teams to take free kicks after the buzzer so you can't just foul the opposition to end the game.

[Benzin]

The thread title

[Tomous]