The Last of Us II - 60 fps PS5 patch out now

Although I disliked almost everything about the narrative and direction of the game I do agree that it's obviously an incredible version of what they set out to do. The acting performances are off the charts, the animations are absolutely mind-blowing (even moreso considering they run well on ancient hardware) and the combat was impactful and much improved on the first game (even if it's essentially the same game). I have no doubt it is exactly the product they set out to make.

It's just a shame Neil Druckmann wrote a nasty, pointless story and had no editor.

Co-wrote*

Hayley Gross the cowriter is credited as the narrative lead too, fwiw

Ok then, they both wrote a nasty, pointless story I guess?

Don't go for the bait.

Zilnad wrote:Don't go for the bait.

I'll try not to.

Something tells me Tafdolphin might use Twitter quite a lot

The unabashed hate for the game (and Druckman in particular) just reminds me of all the crazy shite that was being spread around on there pre-release.

I know it easier for our brains to process complex situations if we just point the finger at one person but it's very very reductive.

The Limited edition Double sided Vinyl (of the soundtrack) finally arrived. Its stunning. Supposed to release in January but didn't ship until late march.

jiggles wrote:That strawberry floating dunk on Naughty Dog’s gameplay

Did Mafro write this

Fade wrote:Something tells me Tafdolphin might use Twitter quite a lot

The unabashed hate for the game (and Druckman in particular) just reminds me of all the crazy shite that was being spread around on there pre-release.

I know it easier for our brains to process complex situations if we just point the finger at one person but it's very very reductive.

Tafdolphin wrote:Although I disliked almost everything about the narrative and direction of the game I do agree that it's obviously an incredible version of what they set out to do. The acting performances are off the charts, the animations are absolutely mind-blowing (even moreso considering they run well on ancient hardware) and the combat was impactful and much improved on the first game (even if it's essentially the same game). I have no doubt it is exactly the product they set out to make.

It's just a shame Neil Druckmann wrote a nasty, pointless story and had no editor.

Tafdolphin wrote:Other opinions are available etc etc, and I still ultimately enjoyed it (solid 7/10) but it's a weaker game that the first that needed some serious editing.

/\ unabashed hate. And I do use twitter. No idea if that's supposed to be dunk on me.

I will say that people dismissing my dislike for the narrative as somehow cheap or sensationalist does grind my gears a bit. Read the last past: me and Orange exchanged a bunch of really interesting posts about the merits of its storytelling and the influences it displays. I spent this page praising many aspects of the game.

I'm not being a troll here. I just don't like the story (and Druckmann was the face of the game, he designed the narrative and came up with the story. Of course he's going to receive criticism if people didn't like it. How on earth is that reductive?)

Tafdolphin wrote:/\

Didn’t know you were in Australia, Taf.

I'm late to this conversation! Mild Spoilers Ahead, obviously:

But I liked the game. Mainly as a game.

As a narrative, I could see what they were attempting, though overall it felt like a well-meaning but misguided effort.

I thought as a game it was unbelievably polished, with encounters that felt genuinely panicky and organic, as you changed tactics on the fly, bounced back from mistakes, hastily sprinted to windows/counters/doors in a way that felt properly urgent at times. And some of the set-pieces were top-tier gaming thrills: Ellie as an angel of death, stealthing in and out of water. Or Abby Vs that Akira monster in the basement.

I agree with many that I thought the pacing was pretty bad, and I too felt it became a little exhausting (though in part that's testament to the game's quality, as it was also almost begrudgingly absorbing and moreish). Things like having a random Abby/Owen tidbit at the beginning outside Jackson before the long Ellie stretch, then the mid-point pivot back to day one, the piecemeal delivery of the Ellie/Joel stuff - and all the long (off-putting!) shots to destinations in the distance! - I'm not sure this was structured in the way that could lead to the best payoff emotionally.

I also gave precisely zero damns about Abby's crew. I actually found it odd that the game seemed to think that just more exposure to these vaguely unlikeable, uninteresting people would somehow add dramatic stakes. I'd go so far as to say that you could excise them all from the story and keep the focus on Ellie-Abby-Joel without really losing much. Even Dina and Jessie made little impact for me.

Similarly none of the things like enemies screaming out real names and so on felt like the harrowing reminder it was meant to be. But I did think it made the violence seem suitably practical and necessary as opposed to satisfyingly stylish and rewarding.

In general I think a lot of the way the narrative was done was the kind of thing that reads well in interviews and making-ofs and analyses: like Spending More Time With The Character Makes You Invest In Them, or Seeing How They Interact With Others Makes Them More Rounded And Is Illuminating To The Audience, or This Character Represents Simple Humanity Because They Are Pregnant or whatever else - but none of it actually landed for me. I recently re-watched the opening to Skyward Sword and was more invested in Groose/Link (who is mute!) and Zelda than I was in any of these side-crew.

In fact I often felt like the methods of narrative used were fundamentally bullsh*t - like the forced slow-walk of Ellie when 'sad' after the opener. Or the many other walking-sim scenes in which you are made to explore an environment at Naughty Dog's set-pace, to best absorb all their 'world-building' efforts and awkward, clumsy animation vignettes and try-hard dialogue snippets. To me it's all wasted effort that I can admire but doesn't actually work, and worse, is really irritating to suddenly be forced to roleplay a character as if performing for an audience, as if the scene was being recorded on film and thus had to abide by a certain pace and limitations of movement. I don't think letting me leg it round and speak to people like in a normal RPG is any less 'immersive', frankly.

It's lands for me like a game-design uncanny valley, and is less effective than when games just acknowledge their game-ness instead of trying for some weird performative verisimilitude - I've played 16-bit JRPGS with more emotional investment in the side-characters.

And though I realise this is a taste/preference thing - I could also remove every single written note and message without losing anything of note. Reading them felt like duty and in general this ecosystem of personal messages felt unconvincing to me.

Also, I was on the game's side, and onboard for its experiments, but was still dragged out by so many rubbish plot conveniences such as Jessie finding Ellie in the middle of a huge residential area in Seattle, or Isaac stumbling across Abbie on the island and so on. And so many other moments were weirdly underplayed, like Yara barely flinching when her arm is shattered, as if she's just had a chinese burn, or the Oh Well! Let's Move On! after Lev finds his mother again.

And all the contrived safe-code messages were tiring and boring.

BUT!

As harsh as all that sounds I found the game-proper to be engaging and worthwhile, with some real moments. And both Abby-AEllie fights were really effective and made me feel suitably conflicted and compromised. But the rest of the narrative I thought was an essentially noble attempt at trying to tell a story, and make a point through the videogame medium, but in a way that works better on paper than it does to experience and play through with controller in the hand.

The problem is that it’s Druckman’s story to tell.

Imagine if, say majority of fans telling a series of books written by an author what to include and what NOT to do.

Not everyone will be happy with the final product. I think people who took offence at Last of Us 2’s story alike to Kathy Bates’ character from Misery.

I liked the story in Last of Us 2, despite its bloated nature. People just have to accept what it is, and they have no rights to demand to change anything that a writer has laid out. It’s the writer’s story to write, not the fans.

Wedgie wrote:The problem is that it’s Druckman’s story to tell.

This is certainly true, but I don't like the conflation of "people who didn't like the story" and "people demanding he write something else". The latter are neckbeards who don't understand how creative media works. The former are entitled to their opinions and I think are the majority. I've never seen anyone telling ND he should rewrite the game, for example.

That's a good summary deathbycows, and pretty much how I felt coming out of it.

60FPS patch is out for PS5 now

https://blog.playstation.com/2021/05/19 ... h-for-ps5/



Digital Foundry analysis (they could literally only get it to drop a couple of frames in one specific spot):


https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digi ... -tested-it

Very nice. Replayed it very recently though but still good to know it's a thing now.

Bloody hell, fantastic and surprised its free! Need to replay the game of the generation.

I might finally get around to this on PS5, 60fps will be a nice bonus, especially as that's how I played the first one.

Still think I'll wait for a sale first though

It's going on sale on PSN from the 26th, along with some others so at least hold off until then if anyone's going digital.