The Last of Us II - 60 fps PS5 patch out now

The Last of Us Part 2 depicts individual people who are instead ruthless, capable, yet self-absorbed, and whose perception of violence is limited to how it affects them and their chosen family members. They are almost unbelievably unable to see the bigger picture. Part 2 ends up feeling needlessly bleak, at a time when a nihilistic worldview has perhaps never been less attractive. Its characters are surviving, but they’re not learning, and they’re certainly not making anything better.

Maybe the most surprising thing that The Last of Us Part 2 offered me was the surety that, while the game was made with great skill and craft, we are actually much, much better than Naughty Dog thinks we are

The Last of Us Part II feels complacent, yet also preoccupied with its predecessor. Every facet of the original game has been expanded and enlarged in the sequel, but not actually improved. It is as if its only inspiration is the original game, and the well of pop culture it was drawing from. There is practically nothing here we haven’t seen and done repeatedly throughout previous Naughty Dog games. It sets out to surpass its predecessor, but the only meaningful contrast between them is in its even more oppressive bleakness and violence. It digs two graves, fills them with blood, and then just strawberry floating wallows in them.

Tafdolphin wrote:

The game then pulls its twist - that Abby is also a playable character, and you will play out the same three days from her perspective. This forces the player into empathising with Abby, a previously hated figure, in a way that a film or any other medium cannot. While the first half with Ellie opens with a strong player connection and then erodes it, switching you to playing as the once-villain does the opposite. Of course the story and in-universe perspective of Abby also contributes to showing her as a likable protagonist rather than hated villain, but it's the playing as her that primarily forces the player's connection to her.

I genuinely thought that was a) very well done, and b) wouldn't be possible in anything other than a videogame. One of the unsettling things reading about people's reactions to that game is how many people remained hateful of Abby and unwilling to accept Ellie as a flawed and tragic character rather than a hero. For all the talk of the themes being obvious they apparently really aren't for a significant number of people.

Covered this, but I the twist came too late for me and felt like restarting a game that was already pushing its length. And you absolutely can achieve this in other mediums, it's a technique directly lifted from film for example and I've read several novels with split/opposing pro/antagonists. It's new to gaming yes, but like I say I think they fumbled the execution.

Fade wrote:Ah yeah, I remember in the first game where Joel 'learned' to use Ellie for his own selfish needs while torturing and murdering people.

The game ends with Joel murdering a bunch of medical staff who are trying to save the world and lies to his Ellie's face about it. Definitely not bleak.

The whole story of 2 is about them learning, what the strawberry floating strawberry float is that review even talking about

THE WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME IS THE JOURNEY THEY GO ON TO SEE THE BIGGER PICTURE, something Joel never did.

How are people this stupid? How can they not see the irony in saying the characters only care about their immediate family members when that Joel's defining strawberry floating trait?

Tafdolphin wrote:Did you play Spec Ops: The Line Orange? It did everything TLoU2 attempts 10 years earlier, but in a much more interesting (and I think successful) way, including playing with player agency/culpability in a much more explicit manner.

Fade wrote:Ah yeah, I remember in the first game where Joel 'learned' to use Ellie for his own selfish needs while torturing and murdering people.

The game ends with Joel murdering a bunch of medical staff who are trying to save the world and lies to his Ellie's face about it. Definitely not bleak.

The whole story of 2 is about them learning, what the strawberry floating strawberry float is that review even talking about

THE WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME IS THE JOURNEY THEY GO ON TO SEE THE BIGGER PICTURE, something Joel never did.

How are people this stupid? How can they not see the irony in saying the characters only care about their immediate family members when that Joel's defining strawberry floating trait?

I'm not at all sure what you're saying here. The review isn't of the first game and Joel is dead in the second. Regardless, excusing a narrative flaw as a character trait in nonsensical. These aren't real people, they're characters designed to serve a narrative purpose.

Edd wrote:The most ridiculous part of the Polygon review is them comparing and criticising ND's fictional post-apocalyptic world to the apparent selflessness and unity happening in America in 2020.

Fade wrote:@Taf What are you talking about? No it's not, it's uses cheap narrative devices to obscure the truth from you again and again and then pulls the curtain down every so often.

Ah yeah, that white phosphorus scene was really subtle, when the game showed me that dead mum holding a baby to make me feel bad, super subtle, definitely no match for the last of us with it's slow introspective character development

Tafdolphin wrote:

Fade wrote:@Taf What are you talking about? No it's not, it's uses cheap narrative devices to obscure the truth from you again and again and then pulls the curtain down every so often.

Ah yeah, that white phosphorus scene was really subtle, when the game showed me that dead mum holding a baby to make me feel bad, super subtle, definitely no match for the last of us with it's slow introspective character development

I never said it was subtle. I said it was better.

And I'm going to check out here as we're getting to a "No YOU'RE wrong" level of engagement.

Tafdolphin wrote:

jiggles wrote:

jiggles wrote:Predictions:

- Pleasantly surprised by total absence of the Bury Your Gays trope. Complains about misleading marketing campaign selling the game on the trope
- Positive on Abby’s design
- mixed on lev. Mostly decent trans depiction, but falls short of handling it as well as he would have done
- rightly calls out the shitty handling of black characters
- Marvels at the quality of the game but wrings hands at human cost of crunch needed to make a game to this standard
- Dislikes Ellie’s arc. Thinks the game is way too long. Hates everything from the farm onwards. Is appalled that the idyllic life for a queer couple is picturesque conservative Americana

Tar how did i do

Pretty well! The farm prediction was super interesting actually, and I actually never picked up on the imagery there (although I'm sure the whole thing was inspired by Christina's World):

Tafdolphin wrote:But that review is saying the same thing I was: that the player becomes clued into the fact that revenge is a fools errand extremely quickly but the characters never catch onto this despite being subject to the same context. The game goes out of its way to hammer home how wrong the cycle of violence is, but the characters never learn this, even way beyond the point where they should have.

And if Spec Ops is cheap, TLoU2 is bargain basement. Spec Ops is fully upfront with its motivations and intent, whereas this game just repeats the message over and over in increasingly unsubtle ways.

Edd wrote:The most ridiculous part of the Polygon review is them comparing and criticising ND's fictional post-apocalyptic world to the apparent selflessness and unity happening in America in 2020.

This is true. It's a bizarre line in an otherwise good review.