I've had the game since launch and stuck 50 hours into it (played it on and off, not constantly since then) and haven't even done any of the Beasts or been to Kakariko yet. Just pottered around, getting distracted by loads of things here and there.
Got nothing on today and loaded the game up - just done Eventide - so might finally go do one today. I think I had wandered near the "main" quest for the Zora area as someone mentioned something about a prince. Though this was two years ago so my memory is a little hazy. Think I saw one of the Beasts from distance when I did that desert labyrinth too.
Jenuall wrote:I definitely did Gerudo last and Ruto first, but I can't recall the order I did the other two in!
The beasts were fun but forgettable I think, I can remember more about stuff in the world or even individual shrines than I can about the beasts.
I think the beasts are more interesting than the shrines. There's some really interesting level design and mechanics in them. Like having to use the trunk to raise water levels, making the Gecko turn on its side and back to access certain parts of the level and so on. The shrines were imo more basic and don't get me started on the awful motion based and combat ones.
Jenuall wrote:I definitely did Gerudo last and Ruto first, but I can't recall the order I did the other two in!
The beasts were fun but forgettable I think, I can remember more about stuff in the world or even individual shrines than I can about the beasts.
I think the beasts are more interesting than the shrines. There's some really interesting level design and mechanics in them. Like having to use the trunk to raise water levels, making the Gecko turn on its side and back to access certain parts of the level and so on. The shrines were imo more basic and don't get me started on the awful motion based and combat ones.
Oh yeah don't get me wrong there were some really clever mechanics going on in them. But I think because they are quite short, their visual design is not very distinct and so much of your playtime is spent on other things I just forgot most of the things about them.
The shrines were repetitive in many cases and yeah some of them were very frustrating (though for me the ones where you had to hit balls into targets and the like were more annoying than the motion control ones!) but they are such a big and regular part of the game that they linger in mind more in my view at least!
Jenuall wrote:I definitely did Gerudo last and Ruto first, but I can't recall the order I did the other two in!
The beasts were fun but forgettable I think, I can remember more about stuff in the world or even individual shrines than I can about the beasts.
I think the beasts are more interesting than the shrines. There's some really interesting level design and mechanics in them. Like having to use the trunk to raise water levels, making the Gecko turn on its side and back to access certain parts of the level and so on. The shrines were imo more basic and don't get me started on the awful motion based and combat ones.
Oh yeah don't get me wrong there were some really clever mechanics going on in them. But I think because they are quite short, their visual design is not very distinct and so much of your playtime is spent on other things I just forgot most of the things about them.
The shrines were repetitive in many cases and yeah some of them were very frustrating (though for me the ones where you had to hit balls into targets and the like were more annoying than the motion control ones!) but they are such a big and regular part of the game that they linger in mind more in my view at least!
Yeah, if the Beasts had a more visual differences that made them unique I think they'd stand out a bit more and be remembered. The problem is the shrines and beasts are all kind of uniformed to the Shiekah design.
Yeah, they were more of a pain... Because the motion control shrines you'd flip your pad and have the ball on the back of the puzzle
How is the DLC for this? Since the E3 conference I've had an urge to revisit BotW - I've finished the main story but there are a few shrines dotted about I haven't found and some side-quests I have left to do. I like the sound of the map feature that shows where Link has been.
Jenuall wrote:I definitely did Gerudo last and Ruto first, but I can't recall the order I did the other two in!
The beasts were fun but forgettable I think, I can remember more about stuff in the world or even individual shrines than I can about the beasts.
I think the beasts are more interesting than the shrines. There's some really interesting level design and mechanics in them. Like having to use the trunk to raise water levels, making the Gecko turn on its side and back to access certain parts of the level and so on. The shrines were imo more basic and don't get me started on the awful motion based and combat ones.
Yeah i would mostly agree, some of the shrines were very good puzzles and on a similar level of getting to a terminal in a beast. The electric based shrines in camel land were particularly enjoyable.
And I beat the game. I dunno. The last boss was a bit of an anticlimax. I don't know if it was because I prepared myself to the hilt for it. Probably was.
I loved it overall. Not sure where I would put it in the top Zelda games yet. And there's still stuff I want to do it (those weird ass mazes that seem to be in a few places, the map part above the Kokiri Woods, the island out in the sea). I will probably take a break away from it for now.
Squinty wrote:And I beat the game. I dunno. The last boss was a bit of an anticlimax. I don't know if it was because I prepared myself to the hilt for it. Probably was.
I thought that too, I wasn't mega over prepared and walked it. Had I not trained myself in parry it would have been harder.
Squinty wrote:And I beat the game. I dunno. The last boss was a bit of an anticlimax. I don't know if it was because I prepared myself to the hilt for it. Probably was.
I thought that too, I wasn't mega over prepared and walked it. Had I not trained myself in parry it would have been harder.
To be honest, I forgot about the parry move until the fight. It probably would've made guardian fights a lot better than just Ancient Arrowing them in the eye.
I can understand the praise for this game. It's better than WW, Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword, I think. I get what they were trying to do with it. It's pretty much the first Zelda game, in a modern template.
I started playing Breath of the Wild when it came out and I think I over-indulged. For the first half or so it seemed like the best game I'd every played. Then I went off it a bit (though I did find 115 shrines beforehand eek!) and ended up feeling a little cool towards it overall.
It was good to leave a big break between that and playing this DLC, inspired by some Zelda-y conversations over the weekend.
It's good!
My thoughts on the DLC 2:
1) It's nice that it forces you to revisit all 4 main quadrants again, and re-purposes some of the familiar things into new ways for the tasks. Some of the souped-up battles against foes are a nice advance from the vanilla game versions, and pinpointing the areas based on the map-shards was actually quite satisfying.
2) Lots of new shrines, which are frankly a little wearying after doing so many in the game proper. I think it's partly because the theme and aesthetic and music has worn thin by now (and I'm not sure the shrine Music was ever quite good enough to last so much exposure to it) and partly because most of the physics-based puzzles are remixing similar concepts to ones you've used throughout - there isn't the paradigmatic, step-up 'Ah-ha!' moments where you suddenly think of using things in a new profound way. It's the same kind of stuff just in different order and variations.
3) Re-fighting bosses with specific items/load-out was actually fun and sometimes benefited from the long hiatus as I'd forgotten most of their patterns and techniques.
4) The new divine beast is great and it's great rendition of the shrine theme throws into relief how grating the original was, and how welcome it is to have some more proper, persistent area-music instead of the fragmentary whisps of themes that the rest of the game has.
5) New boss is fun too, and fun in its flexibility of approach.
6) New cutscenes were by far the highlight for me. All of them were awesomely animated, punchy and short, with great writing. It also really added to the overall historic significance of the champions quest and the motley crew they are. MUST BE WATCHED IN JAPANESE though obviously, to not be gooseberry fool.
7) Bike is great!
Overall: A worthwhile addition and surprisingly extensive.
Last edited by deathofcows on Wed Jun 26, 2019 1:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
In fact I might as well post some overall thoughts on BotW proper, now I've gone back for another swig.
1) Obviously it's great.
2) The shrines don't stay great. Often they're just challenges of execution and not conception. And once you've got familiar with magnesis and stasis and so on, their satisfaction plateaus.
3) The game as a whole plateaus, I think. Because it primes you from the start, without the piecemeal addition of new items and mechanics, most of the mechanical learning and experimentation and novelty is front-loaded. Then you mostly just apply similar gameplay loops and bubbles in different areas with different environmental skins.
4) The feel of the game is flattened in three other ways, by my reckoning. Firstly the go-anywhere-climb-anything homogenises everything a little. There is no great mechanical, traversal variety between areas, and whereas previous games had meaningful binaries of hook-shot-able (or whatever) bits with the other bits remaining, unknowable, unreachable 'otherlands' - here everything is reachable, continuous and similiar.
5) There is also a 'flattening' in how the continuity of traversal affects the discreetness of areas. Kokiri Forest in OoT is an enclave unto itself, separated by a loading screen from its surroundings. It has its own music and vibe. Making the areas more permeable between each other reduces their individual sense of place. It actually makes me wonder what the continuous scrolling of Link's Awakening remake might do to the feel of it compared to the original.
6) The music is often great but I think the new approach emphasises how much a physical part of Zelda games it used to be. Here it adorns and accents the experience. Previously each environment was walled off by a loading screen or whatever, but also its musical theme - as tied to the physicality of the place as anything else (think of OoT's Kakariko Village or - indeed - anywhere). Music was almost like an extra wall of difference between each place and the other. In BotW there is a physical, feel-able absence in the environmental character compared with before. I'm not sure it's worse, mind...
7) It's lonelier and emptier in a more profound way. I wonder if this musicality also previously gave environments a sense of inhabitation, or at least personality, that has been removed in BotW in a way that sometimes makes it feel cold to me. A little lonely. (I think it's why the Deku-tree area is a favorite of mine, as it feels most like a classic Zelda environment permeated by an 'ever-mood' of music and walled off by the Lost Woods). And maybe it's because the game is more 'realisitc', in the sense of having an indifferent land-mass that isn't built in obviously game-ic shapes and form. Maybe its the more subtle relationship between player/gameplay and environment (compared with the almost Mario-like clockwork of Skyward Sword) that makes me feel a little decentered, and the world feel a little more barren.
8) Maybe the loneliness is also just from the lack of a companion.
9) Maybe it's also the lack of a strong-narrative spine, with much of the adventure being player-led and most of the story played back in randomly-ordered memory flashbacks.
8) There are almost no roofs nor ceilings in the world proper. You can't go underwater, either. This is in-sync with the open-air freedom the game espouses, but also takes away a whole dimension of variety in the landscape, and for all its peaks and troughs and undulations, I think they all occur within a single plane of interaction and exploration.
9) I rewatched all the memory cutscenes in order and they are fantastic (IN JAPANESE ONLY PLEASE CHANGE YOUR SETTINGS IN THE OPTIONS THE ENGLISH IS DIABOLICAL) - varied in mood and focus (from the epic to the playful) and when done in sequence they really add a rich feeling of narrative. Zelda's anxieties and inner struggle is also really well done. It makes me hope the story beats are spliced throughout the adventure proper next time.
10) The story beats also 'fix' and frame the world into iconic, singular moments instead of the continuous world you just run through and 'use' mechanically. Like when Link and Zelda are sheltering under a tree or the one about the Silent Princess flower and so on. Similarly the moment when you first encounter a Lynel and there's that short scene of linking hiding behind a rock. Even short interludes like this - where camera control and framing is taken away from the player - really add an extra layer of perspective and drama and significance to the world. I think a slight obsession with continuous play and player-presence can deprive this amazing world of some of the engagement and drama it could have with even a few more close-ups or cutaways or whatever.
11) I'd go so far as to say that a couple of areas of fixed-angles (think: Temple of Time in OoT/Kokiri Forest indoor sections and so on) would actually add a layer of framing and visual-interest which might actually punctuate the constant, third-person player-eyed-view in impactful meaningful ways.
11) Link is inexpressive, I get it. And it's a Link better suited to this less narrative-focused, more emergent Zelda game. But it's a step-down from Skyward Sword's laughing-joking link full of personality.
12) Whole aesthetic and color-scheme of game tends towards realism compared with SS's goofier pastel-tones and colors. I think this also added a slight magic and wonder to the world, too though?
Etc.
Anyway contrary to that sounds I do think the game is great - I've certainly seen most of all it has to offer and think it plays like a buttery-smooth dream - but points like the ones above I never looked for, I wasn't trying to undercut the game's many (many) brilliant achievements. But as a whole there is a slight absence I kept feeling in the latter part of my playing - and I was struggling to quite place it. The above is just some of my working out!
P.S. I also feel slightly unnerved and sad in the last level of Mario Odyssey due to its silence and sound-echo - so maybe it's just me!
