The official Formula One and General Motorsport thread for the 2021 season! Season finale live on Sky & Ch4 Dec 12th 1pm

[Pancake]

It's always been a sport capable of producing dull seasons (92 anyone?)

I liked '92, but then i've always been a huge Mansell fan so i'm probably a bit biased there.

Whilst last year ended up being a domination by Hamilton, that didn't take away from the quality of the season as a whole, we had some all time classic races. I really think F1 is in a good place

Agreed, even with Merc being dominant, 2020 was a great season with some absolute classic races.

F1 in general is in a far better place when compared to how things were around 2014/15, for a start the cars look far better.

I'm glad he won (a bit like Button in 2009) but it can hardly go down as a classic, he was just too dominant.

[Vermilion]

My favourite one in recent years was the dildo nose cars and the awful tyres which gave us 8 different winners in 8 races. Mickey mouse yes, but it was really exciting.

You're referring to the 2012 step nose cars, looked horrific but the races were decent.

The dildo nose cars were 2014, and they really are some of the worst looking F1 cars ever.

[Robbo-92]

I’ve got a soft spot for 2009, first season watching the sport and loved the way that Brawn GP dominated the first lot of races and then they were on the back foot when Red Bull and to a lesser extent, McLaren got on top of the regulations to make it a bit touch and go whether Button would win the WDC or not.

[Imrahil]

Also, 2009 just had a bunch of memorable moments in general. Like the start of the Malaysian GP in that thunderstorm, with streaks of lightning filling the sky around them with booming thunder - as the cars lit the track up with their rear lights while lining up on the grid.

[Vermilion]

Also, 2009 just had a bunch of memorable moments in general. Like the start of the Malaysian GP in that thunderstorm, with streaks of lightning filling the sky around them with booming thunder - as the cars lit the track up with their rear lights while lining up on the grid.

Don't forget Kimi and his ice cream.

[Pancake]

There are fantastic moments and stories in every season, even if the racing is a little lacking. I can think of very few seasons in F1 history that have absolutely no redeeming features, we do not speak of 2002.

[captain red dog]

I've blown hot and cold on F1 throughout pretty much all of my life, there's never been a stage where I didn't pay at least some attention to what was going on in the sport but there have also been many points where I just didn't find it engaging enough to care about on a week by week basis.

I do think it was more exciting watching it as a kid, if nothing else because there was more of a mix of competitors - between 1980 and 2000 there were 11 different champions, in the last 20 years there have been only 7, also the season seemed to go down to the wire more often in the past with the championship not being decided until the penultimate or final race whereas now it often feels like a foregone conclusion halfway through the season

It's always been a sport capable of producing dull seasons (92 anyone?) but the reliability of the cars these days has exacerbated that I think. Having said that, there have been so many highly competitive and interesting seasons since 2000, despite periods of domination. Just off the top of my head, all these were good in my opinion, and a fair few had championship battles right to the last: 2003, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2010, 2012, 2014, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2020

That's a good point on the car side of things and yeah that almost certainly has been a factor. I agree that there have still been competitive seasons recently, and perhaps my problem is more in the perception of things than the reality because even in cases where the championship did go down to the last few races it still didn't carry the same level of excitement for me. Taking for example 2018 from that list it was pretty clear after about the mid-point of the season that Hamilton was going to win

That's fair enough. Personally, I think we're in a bit of a golden period in terms of the individual races and the quality of the drivers on the grid (it's a seriously talented bunch this year), but there's no doubt that F1 has changed significantly. For example, I think the old Murray saying "anything can happen in Formula 1 and it usually does" should probably be changed to "anything can happen in Formula 1 and it sometimes does".

I think that saying still goes. Look at the first Silverstone Grand Prix last season with a movie like the ending with Hamilton winning on blown tyres. Or Russell's dream Mercedes debut and how it imploded because of a team error.

Not to mention Grosjean surviving the worst crash in about 30 years of the sport!

Murray was right, anything can happen in Formula One, and it usually does!

Murray was just absolutely superb in making some really boring races sound very exciting. Crofty sometimes is too honest when there is a boring race and can't find anything to talk about. That said, he did a pretty solid job yesterday and Brundle definitely has the mantel as the voice of F1.

[Vermilion]

There are fantastic moments and stories in every season, even if the racing is a little lacking. I can think of very few seasons in F1 history that have absolutely no redeeming features, we do not speak of 2002.

Ah yes, 2002, a season summed up by the Hungarian GP, in which thanks to Bernie's digital TV system which was then grabbing all the main footage, regular viewers found themselves watching nothing but Schumi out front leading for the entire first half of the race (that really was it, just Schumi out on his own for lap after lap).

The late great Jim Bamber had things summed up too...

[Rawrgna]

I wonder changing the Scoring system back to the old one of 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1 would help tighten up the battle for the championship over 23 rounds so a bad string of results could have huge implications on when the championship can be won.

[Vermilion]

I wonder changing the Scoring system back to the old one of 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1 would help tighten up the battle for the championship over 23 rounds so a bad string of results could have huge implications on when the championship can be won.

It's a good idea (and worked well during the time it was used), but would need tweaking to ensure the top 10 would continue to earn points.

Maybe 12-10-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1 would be better?

[floydfreak]

There are fantastic moments and stories in every season, even if the racing is a little lacking. I can think of very few seasons in F1 history that have absolutely no redeeming features, we do not speak of 2002.

The cars were fun too watch back then on edge all the time flat out not fuel saving or tyre management V10's no track limit madness etc

[floydfreak]

Sky & CH4 both did nice tributes too Murray Walker

[floydfreak]

[Pancake]

There are fantastic moments and stories in every season, even if the racing is a little lacking. I can think of very few seasons in F1 history that have absolutely no redeeming features, we do not speak of 2002.

The cars were fun too watch back then on edge all the time flat out not fuel saving or tyre management V10's no track limit madness etc

No racing either, it really was a procession back then. Give me 2021 regs over 2002 any day!

I wonder changing the Scoring system back to the old one of 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1 would help tighten up the battle for the championship over 23 rounds so a bad string of results could have huge implications on when the championship can be won.

I like the current scoring system personally. Changing it again would feel a bit unnecessary, tinkering for no substantial benefit.

[Robbo-92]

twitter.com/plebgrandprix/status/1376445223132274689

[Vermilion]

[Victor Mildew]

This track limits thing REALLY strawberry floats off the Hamilton haters doesn't it

Hamilton didn't obey the track limits, they should be ENFORCED!!!!!!

But Verstappen passed off track...

NOT LIKE THAT THOUGH!!!!!!! He only wins becuase he's got the best car!!!!!

The red bull was faster.

BLACK TRACK LIMITS!!!!!!

[Jenuall]

I really don't care enough either way but how it can't be seen as "gaining a lasting advantage" to continually exceed the track limits on the same turn is beyond me. If it wasn't gaining an advantage then he wouldn't be doing it.

[captain red dog]

I heard the explanation from that Masi I think his name is, race director? Anyway he said in the driver briefing it was made clear the track limit wouldn't be applied so harshly in the race, but completing an overtake off track was not allowed.

It seems totally fair, Red Bull aren't even complaining. They saw what Hamilton was doing and told Max to do the same. The only issue is he completed the overtake off road, and Max didn't seem to have any gripe with that, just that he should have gone off into the distance and built up the 5 secs needed to avoid the penalty.

F1 does get into a mess with the rules though. They seemed to handle track limits well last season and I remember them showing videos before qualy and the race with the safety car showing exactly where the track limits were allowed. What they have to do, is make sure the track limits are agreed on a Thursday and the same rules are applied all weekend.

A lot of the fuss over the limits seems to be purely with the fans. Hamilton, Max, RBR and Merc don't seem to have a problem with how it was applied.

[Robbo-92]

What I just don’t get about track limits is they literally have a line that defines the edge of the track, just say that a wheel or whatever they decide, needs to be on the track or you’ll start getting warnings and then a penalty if they carry on. The drivers wouldn’t be off the track if it wasn’t faster, overtaking or not. Ironically, F1 2020 does a far better job of imposing track limits in time trials than the actual race directors.