Why aren't you vegan?

OrangeRKN wrote:I have no problem with it when the animals are treated well, and I am in fact more comfortable knowing those farming the animals care for them.

Karl_ wrote:(I'm not OR but) I live in Wales, where there are a lot of farms still producing meat (particularly lamb, mutton, and pork) in a more "traditional" way - I'm friends or colleagues with a fair few of those farmers and I know they treat their animals well so I've no problem at all with how they make their living. I was interested to find out a fair few of them are vegetarians themselves though, or can't bear to eat the kind of animals they raise.

If there's a moral problem with meat for me it's if animals go through unnecessary discomfort while they're alive. And I do understand that has happened with a lot of the kind of supermarket or fast food meat you'll get, which I think is a shame. It's not something I really feel personally responsible for, it's the corner-cutting inherent to capitalism and it should be curtailed by state regulation, which I'd 100% support even if it made meat somewhat more expensive.

That's all ignoring the environmental side, but again, climate change isn't an individual problem, I don't think you can make a moral judgement on an individual based on how "green" they are when really climate change is a problem with capitalism as a system.

Jenuall wrote:I find it interesting that a lot of people's barriers or desires around "going veggie/vegan" are based around a need to find replacements for the things they currently eat - direct meat substitutes, meat free sausages, meatballs (that name is going to need to change in time surely?! ) etc.

I understand that perspective, and it makes sense to think - "I like the stuff I eat now, how can I eat basically the same stuff but without meat". But for whatever reason I had never really thought of the process in that way. Don't get me wrong if the industry keeps improving like it is then absolutely I will be all over fake burgers and the like, but as I've been cutting meat out of my diet over the last couple of years I've seen it as more of an opportunity to explore entirely new options and dishes, rather than just to keep eating the same stuff but with the meat replaced.

I think in some ways that is one of the reasons why people bounce off the idea or give up quite quickly - you are so used to eating meat in those meals that anything else is going to taste different and to some extent inferior and therefore why bother. But in trying entirely new dishes there is less of a comparison factor and so you just end up realising that there are loads of incredibly tasty meat free meals out there and wonder why it took you so bloody long to find them!

I'd recommend this cook book to anyone looking for some vegan meals, some amazing stuff in here: BOSH!

Qikz wrote:I like meat and dairy too much, I feel bad but I need to eat what I enjoy

Meep wrote:I know the massive suffering caused by the dairy industry.

Ironhide wrote:

Meep wrote:I know the massive suffering caused by the dairy industry.

As long as the cows are treat well, allowed outside and kept healthy then I can't really see the problem.

My main concern is that the cows might get milked too often but that impact could probably be reduced by introducing milking rotas so the animals get rest days.

While on the subject of animal derived foods that don't involve killing the animal, why is honey an issue for vegans? The bees don't suffer at all and would produce the honey anyway.